Author Topic: Pods? Are expensive better?? (Read 5746 times)

Simpson · « **Reply #25 on:** January 15, 2012, 05:36:19 PM »

I think all pods make the A/F ratio incorrect in different ways.
Choose your poison.
I'm sure you can balance them out by jetting so its feels smoother.

But it will always be inferior to the air box for street use by the nature of its design.

camelman · « **Reply #26 on:** January 15, 2012, 06:01:55 PM »

I just don't understand why the statements keep flying around about no one being able to run pods on a SOHC 4. Engineering development didn't end in the mid 70s when these bikes were developed, but rather kept improving. Likewise, I'm sure there are decent pods available that have the necessary bits to perform as desired by us riders. I'm sure there are also other pods that will always make a SOHC4 run like crap. Plus, seeing how many people ditch the stock airbox and go to pods or velocity stacks on the race track, I just have to believe that there are decent pods out there.

So, to the OP's original question: Yes, I am sure cash has an impact on the quality of the pods. However, if you find a set of pods that has internals like a velocity stack, then I imagine you are most of the way there. Then, learn how to tune your carbs to get the performance you want. It is definitely possible. You might see an impact on operability if you like to wave your knees about a lot while riding at high speeds, but most of us don't flap our knees around in the wind while we are zipping down the interstate. I tried flying a kite once, but that is a different story.

Camelman

messeduptriple · « **Reply #27 on:** January 15, 2012, 06:13:29 PM »

So could I ask.. should I use the pods (k&n ) as above posted and stick with the stock jets first?? Or should I do a rule of thumb if there is one and bump up both sets of jets first?? I have a 38 main now..I'm guessing everything is stock as it came. Any opinions on this ?

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Retro Rocket · « **Reply #28 on:** January 15, 2012, 06:24:22 PM »

The most important part missed here is that if you are a noob and have little experience with tuning {especially 4 carbs}, the stock air box makes pods look like a mystery maze by comparison. Even with the best pods you will still have trouble with rain and cross winds, i think flapping your legs around is an exaggeration, there is no still or non turbulent air around pods as there is with the stock air box. Comparing to a race track is no good either as the bikes are tuned for full throttle operation which is rarely achieved on the street, so 2 completely different things, pods usually give problems with light or mid range throttle operation.. If you want thye least problematic approach, go with the stock airbox. I would like to add i am no purist and love modifying my bikes, i just don't like mods simply for the sake of looks over function....

camelman · « **Reply #29 on:** January 15, 2012, 07:34:20 PM »

That's it. I'm going to install some pods and prove you guys wrong... when I get the next bike built up that is. ;-)

Regarding your jetting question, it would be worth your time to read up the FAQ section to find out how to tune carbs. It takes patience and knowledge to do it right, and usually a dyno with an exhaust analyzer. However, you can get close enough for every day use by following the info given in the FAQ.

Camelman

shinneh · « **Reply #30 on:** January 15, 2012, 08:14:18 PM »

I am wondering why no one has mentioned Tin Top's Anti-pod system. It's kinda like pods, looks like em' and is very stylish. Alot of members here have them and love them. Not much info on tuning has been said, but I think that's because they are very close to what the stock air box would do.

I'd challenge you to at least give them a look. I haven't gotten a chance to purchase any yet, because everyone beats me to it. Next time though!

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=79491.0 <---- check it.

messeduptriple · « **Reply #31 on:** January 15, 2012, 08:22:02 PM »

I couldn't really tell..so is that 4 seperate filter boxes??

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Spanner 1 · « **Reply #32 on:** January 15, 2012, 08:24:57 PM »

Pods are for dudes who tool around the hood on their bikes... 0 or 100 hrs. spent on carb tuning it's about looks.... not about looong rides and wanting reliability and ridability and good air/fuel ratio to do that... never had a pod guy ( and the cafe mods that usually go with it )) ride 500 miles with anyone I know... it's all good

...

CycleRanger · « **Reply #33 on:** January 15, 2012, 09:14:16 PM »

messeduptriple · « **Reply #34 on:** January 15, 2012, 09:25:54 PM »

Lol... K... I think the majority of responses I've gotten are basically not very well for pods. Be it this is my first 550 project bike I think I've decided to throw out the pod idea and stick to the box. I didn't really want to but after that posting about rideability and air/ fuel ratio ..I think I want to enjoy my first season on this 550 and not hate it. I think next fall if I like this bike I will work on pods on it that winter. I just need to find a site that sells covers but something a bit cooler and not the shiny norm.

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Retro Rocket · « **Reply #35 on:** January 15, 2012, 09:34:12 PM »

Quote from: messeduptriple on January 15, 2012, 08:22:02 PM

I couldn't really tell..so is that 4 seperate filter boxes??

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Tintops "antipod"? Its a single filter with 4 very well made velocity stacks, if you plan on spending big money on K&N's with stacks, spend a little more and get Tintops, the filter is rated to flow over 250 HP....

andrewk · « **Reply #36 on:** January 16, 2012, 02:16:57 PM »

Quote from: camelman on January 15, 2012, 06:01:55 PM

I just don't understand why the statements keep flying around about no one being able to run pods on a SOHC 4.

Nobody is saying you can't use pod filters. The question in the thread is "what's better."

I don't know why anyone would complain about the removal and installation of a stock air box on an sohc 4. A 750 box comes off in < 5 min, and a 550 is a little tougher, but not hard at all. Work on any junk ass suzuki or Yamaha and you'll appreciate the kindness of Honda Engineering.

Pods and Stacks are on the track because the bike is always being run hard. In that context, they're very effective. What hondaman and others are pointing out are the inadequacies in pod filters on a bike that is not ridden flat out all the time- a street bike. If you want the maximum amount of throttle response and the best gas mileage, use the stock box and a high flow filter. Every bike I've put pods on (more than a few) has had a rich idle and fouled plugs in traffic if you didn't keep moving. Always ran good when you got some space to open it up, but the "streetablity" is pretty lacking, or at the very least, isn't ideal, especially when compared to the performance of the stock box.

crazypj · « **Reply #37 on:** January 16, 2012, 02:21:54 PM »

That still doesn't answer the question.
In my opinion, K&N or S&B are better than EMGO or Chinese knock off and worth the extra money

andrewk · « **Reply #38 on:** January 16, 2012, 02:23:27 PM »

Camelman- I quoted you, but wasn't directly meaning you in my reply.

andrewk · « **Reply #39 on:** January 16, 2012, 02:25:19 PM »

I've had the best luck with the round K&N's

crazypj · « **Reply #40 on:** January 16, 2012, 02:26:56 PM »

Carb removal, Yamaha XV535, first, remove all engine bolts...............................

Rgconner · « **Reply #41 on:** January 16, 2012, 03:28:15 PM »

Quote from: shinneh on January 15, 2012, 08:14:18 PM

I am wondering why no one has mentioned Tin Top's Anti-pod system. It's kinda like pods, looks like em' and is very stylish. Alot of members here have them and love them. Not much info on tuning has been said, but I think that's because they are very close to what the stock air box would do.

I'd challenge you to at least give them a look. I haven't gotten a chance to purchase any yet, because everyone beats me to it. Next time though!

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=79491.0 <---- check it.

Those are the ones I was thinking about!

If I was not staying stock, that would be my choice. Based on the testing several people have done, it provides the air but not the problems of stacks.

And they don't look like everyone else's pods.

HondaMan · « **Reply #42 on:** January 17, 2012, 10:02:31 PM »

Quote from: crazypj on January 16, 2012, 02:26:56 PM

Carb removal, Yamaha XV535, first, remove all engine bolts...............................

Don't forget the Kawi KZ650/750 Fours in that list!

andrewk · « **Reply #43 on:** January 18, 2012, 05:12:52 AM »

now THERES an airbox to complain about. KZ750, GPz, etc, etc.

If I never see one again it will be too soon!

wedoo2 · « **Reply #44 on:** January 18, 2012, 05:53:55 AM »

I've read several of these pod threads and they are pretty much the same. Usually the poster just says the hell with it in the end. The main reason people want to try it is the silliness of taking the carbs off. It messes with the paint on the box and screws up the boots, tugging and pulling.

Heaven knows there has to be a better way.

I understand picking up a couple of HP; did a K&N pod and rejet job on my VStar and picked up about 10 HP. That is power that I can feel, especially when I pass a cage. But is a couple of HP really worth it on a 550? I don't know. Maybe get a 750?

But it pretty frustrating when you get everything back together and one of the stupid carbs leak and you have to go through loosing your religion again taking them off.

Gotta be a better way.

Bodi · « **Reply #45 on:** January 18, 2012, 07:59:23 AM »

To the original question, I would use K&N since the others I've seen are clearly inferior. I've seen K&Ns many years old still looking and apparently working fine. Usually the Emgo and other cheap ones I come across have rusted metal and wrecked looking filter cloth after a couple of seasons.

The arguments about pods are all good. I can't possible argue against HM's experience, I doubt any of us can. I've worked on 550s with pods that ran exactly as described, and never I cured the stumbling. I've set up 750s and 400s with pods and gotten what I would say are excellent results. It's a bastard job though, you learn a lot about carbs doing it. On balance, I'd say go with the stock airbox unless you have a solid reason to lose it. For a chopper or a cafe bike the stock airbox is basically not an option.

And no, I don't believe there are any pods you can put on without rejetting.

andrewk · « **Reply #46 on:** January 18, 2012, 02:06:37 PM »

Quote from: wedoo2 on January 18, 2012, 05:53:55 AM

I've read several of these pod threads and they are pretty much the same. Usually the poster just says the hell with it in the end. The main reason people want to try it is the silliness of taking the carbs off. It messes with the paint on the box and screws up the boots, tugging and pulling.

Heaven knows there has to be a better way.

I understand picking up a couple of HP; did a K&N pod and rejet job on my VStar and picked up about 10 HP. That is power that I can feel, especially when I pass a cage. But is a couple of HP really worth it on a 550? I don't know. Maybe get a 750?

But it pretty frustrating when you get everything back together and one of the stupid carbs leak and you have to go through loosing your religion again taking them off.

Gotta be a better way.

I might be able to help with this "better way."

There are a few things you can do that make taking the carbs back off after you get done rebuilding them a non-issue, because it will be right the first time. First and foremost, test the carbs! I hang carb racks on a screw that is on the end of my work bench, and the carbs sit like the would on the bike. Then I put fuel to them, and check for leaks. If any, I fix them and re-test until it doesn't leak, then I re-install. It helps to know exactly why carbs leak too. (watch for split overflow tubes!)

Secondly, if you're struggling with hard airbox boots, you can try putting them in boiling water for a bit to soften them up long enough to get them installed, or get new boots. I believe a lot of people have very frustrating issues because they are working with parts that need to be replaced. Rubber doesn't last forever! Installing a set of carbs with all new rubber (both sides) compared with old, hard stuff is like night and day. I understand these parts aren't cheap, but it's worth noting I think.

I've got nowhere near the years of experience that Hondaman has, but I am a professional. I very rarely have to take carbs back off after I service them, but that's only because I am prudent in testing them.

Hope this helps-
Andrew

messeduptriple · « **Reply #47 on:** January 18, 2012, 02:43:27 PM »

Can I ask what will the bike run like with the jets off tune?? Does the exhaust play a part? I'm planning on getting a 4-2-1 any thoughts on these ?? Also back to what I was saying... How does the bike run if pods are bad? ? Or not right? How do you know how to adjust higher or lower on jets and main?? Not looking for in depth time taking in this answer unless you have time.. but what will the results be?? Will rain effect the pods? If they get wet? Thanks.

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wedoo2 · « **Reply #48 on:** January 18, 2012, 03:14:18 PM »

Thanks Andrew

Gordon · « **Reply #49 on:** January 18, 2012, 03:56:05 PM »

Quote from: andrewk on January 18, 2012, 02:06:37 PM

I've got nowhere near the years of experience that Hondaman has, but I am a professional. I very rarely have to take carbs back off after I service them, but that's only because I am prudent in testing them.

That's the main thing I don't understand about the idea of replacing the stock air box with pod filters to make it easier to remove and replace the carbs. If you do the job right, you won't have to pull the carbs again for a long time, but if you install pods you'll be pulling and replacing the carbs every weekend until you finally, if ever, get it running acceptably again. If you don't like pulling and replacing the carbs, the last thing I think you'd want to do is switch to pods.

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Author Topic: Pods? Are expensive better?? (Read 5746 times)