Topic: confusion reguarding timing setting. Am I advanced or just retarded?

[seanbarney41]

I think about it like this...point gap=dwell(dwell is just a more accurate way of measuring and setting point gap)...point gap affects timing, so dwell affects timing...if your timing is off, your advance is off too...not so tough to understand

[Deltarider]

OK, I'll try once more, but I'm sure others can explain better.
Imagine I start by setting my breakerpoints 1+4 at a dwell of exactly 49^o. Then I set, by adjusting the baseplate, the timing static exactly, spot on the static F mark. When revved you'll see that full advance will be at the first of the two full advance marks (that are 3^o apart btw, remember?).
Now I do it differently. I start by setting the breakerpoints 1+4 at a dwell of exactly 46^o. Then I set the timing again static exactly, spot on the static F mark. When revved you'll see that full advance will be at the second of the two full advance marks. I leave it for native speakers to explain. But this happens with my 500. Don't ask me how, it happens. Ever asked yourself why there are no double F marks (static)? Well above you have your answer.
BTW only with genuine Honda parts. When I discovered this many years ago, I was impressed how precise these parts were designed.

[seanbarney41]

I think that's what I just said

[Deltarider]

No, what you said, most of us have known for a long time. What I've said, has been said only by me.

[Spanner 1]

seanb..... your missing the point ( pun ).... If you use a 12 thou. gap you still set the static timing @ the F mark. If you use 14thou. you still set the timing @ the F mark. If you rev the bike to 2,500rpm you will see the full advance marks irrespective of whatever gap you choose to set your points 

[seanbarney41]

yup, I think everyone here is right, but all miss the points huh huh

[Spanner 1]

Delta....... I think what you have discovered is that the advancer' bounces' against it's stop as it is a sprung devise and engine firing pulses will cause a small movement ( the 3deg. you describe ). Honda allowed for this by using the double mark for full advance...... that's my theory, anyway 

[ofreen]

Then there is the human delay time between stimulus and perception.  (Which for some persons, takes years.)

Or never.

[Deltarider]

Delta....... I think what you have discovered is that the advancer' bounces' against it's stop as it is a sprung devise and engine firing pulses will cause a small movement ( the 3deg. you describe ). Honda allowed for this by using the double mark for full advance...... that's my theory, anyway

What I've found is that the 3^o tolerance Honda allows you to set the dwell, matches exactly the 3^o distance between the 2 full advance mark. It makes sense. When a new bike was delivered with it's ignition spot on, you would not in the future need to rotate the plates to find the right ignition timing. Just setting the dwell would do. That's been exactly my practice for the last 15 years. (Once fully advanced there's no bouncing, btw.)
Maybe read again what I posted above. I can add that if you start with a dwell of 47,5^o (the middle of 49^o and 46^oright?) and then set the ignition exactly at F (static), you'll see that full advance is exactly in the middle between the two full advance marks. No one else ever witnessed this? I find it amazing these stock parts were designed so precise.
BTW I only checked 1+4 for this.

[Spanner 1]

O.K., got it  ..... I would really like to see a graph of the advance curve too. Is it a straight line ? Should be , but maybe not !!! Anyone got a link, of a posting somewhere about that ??