Topic: can you open the engine with out TDC?

[L3niin]

for some reason the engine does not turn it moves back and forth but  it stopes complitly at a certain point ..
 im prettu sure im in nutral ive switched gears just in case and nothing

and i kinda broke this bolt
yeah has anyone changed this one tips anything ?

im turning it by the stator...

[fmctm1sw]

Was the bike running before?  What bike?  If I'm not mistaken, that little keyed shaft is part of the spark advancer behind the points plate.  Probably not too hard to find another one...

[L3niin]

its from a 77 cb 550 ..

aww man this bike need all sorts of attention ..

i remmeber i uised to kick the bike and it would spin no problem thats why i desided to open it ..
but now it only moves about 1 /3 around .

i got the popints plate off and the bolt was stiking out a little it came right out .. ill buy another bolt for it tomorrow ..

[killersoundz]

If you're going to crank on the crankshaft, don't do it on the points side. go to the rotor/stator side that is a much more beefy nut to crank on

[lucky]

Sounds like you need to get some help before you ruin the engine.

[tomkimberly]

Lucky, I think that is why he started this thread, not to get his balls busted...

Tom

[dave500]

you can open the engine in any position,you might have trouble removing the head if you cant rotate the engine to get access to the camshaft bolts though.

[trueblue]

you can open the engine in any position,you might have trouble removing the head if you cant rotate the engine to get access to the camshaft bolts though.

+1, if you can't rotate the engine you can simply use a chain breaker on the cam chain to allow you to get the cam out.  I would try to free the engine before disassembly, using the tried and true ATF and Acetone method.  Also like has been mentioned earlier remove the cover on the other end of the engine and use the bolt in there to turn the engine, it holds the rotor on and can take a little more grunt than the one on the spark advancer (which you found out the hard way can break).

[Bodi]

That bolt can be replaced, it might be a bit tricky but you're not the first one to snap that off. What does "stops completely at a certain point" mean: will it turn just a bit - or does it turn most of a turn then seem to hit something, both ways?
If it goes most of the way around you probably have a valve stuck open. If just a few degrees of movement it's more likely to be in the transmission and you're feeling the primary chain slack.

[trueblue]

That bolt can be replaced, it might be a bit tricky but you're not the first one to snap that off. What does "stops completely at a certain point" mean: will it turn just a bit - or does it turn most of a turn then seem to hit something, both ways?
If it goes most of the way around you probably have a valve stuck open. If just a few degrees of movement it's more likely to be in the transmission and you're feeling the primary chain slack.

It could also be a little rust in the top of one cylinder that the rings come up against and can't move past, hence why I suggested ATF.

[L3niin]

ok i finally tuck it off it Was Only WATER! in the cylinder that didnt let it move wow would of never guessed !

but i did in did lost where i open in ( in what possition ) ...
i did open a 71 cb500 and i do have it documented pretty well, could i just set it it the same same possition   ?

   

[L3niin]

this is wherre the cam sits
this was what messed up the cam , as you can tell in the last pictures ..
should i machine this back ? and re use or should i just replace

i will obiosly have to change the cam , rocker arm ?is there anything better i can but i seen poeple put in a 650 cam .. smart move ? no need ? what do you think ?

let me get ideas people might as well im gonna spend the money to replace see if i can make it better .. right ?

[phaedrus314]

I would just buy a running engine at this point, preferably one that hasn't been opened up.  Out of curiosity...How does an air cooled motor come to be full of water?

[754]

 Your cam end journal and maybe the head looks toasted... see middle of first pic and bottom of second pic..
 Get a manual, improper re-assembly on these often ends in bent up valves...

[phaedrus314]

754, is it financially practical to salvage a head in that condition?

[L3niin]

i kinda power washed the engine .. i thought i sealed all the ports but i guess not ..
hole new engine im ggonna have to open it up anyways .. right ? how much would it run me ?
couldnt i just replace these things ?

im in sandeigo ..  we got this salvage place for old bikes they got a couple engine that i can buy parts off of ..
good idea ill download the manual and check ..

[bollingball]

i remmeber i uised to kick the bike and it would spin no problem thats why i desided to open it ..
 
 I would think if it turned over with no problem that would be a reason NOT to open it. Maybe you just worded this wrong.

but i did in did lost where i open in ( in what possition ) ..
 I sorry but I'm not quite sure what this means

[quotauthor=L3niin link=topic=108958.msg1221024#msg1221024 date=1340575478]
i kinda power washed the engine .. i thought i sealed all the ports but i guess not ..
hole new engine im ggonna have to open it up anyways .. right ? how much would it run me ?
couldnt i just replace these things ?
im in sandeigo ..  we got this salvage place for old bikes they got a couple engine that i can buy parts off of ..
good idea ill download the manual and check .. [/quote]

It just depends what is needed and how you want it to perform. I could spend $3000. on a basic motor easy. And if you want to race then the sky is the limit.
 Now if you want to do a down and dirty rebuild maybe 1K. But that is just me. I have my wallet you have yours.
 Just take it slow and easy get the parts you need and above all take care putting that head back on If you have not heard of the rubber band trick then stop.

[L3niin]

i think im just gonna replace all the messed up parts .. and just call it a day ..

 
ok another question it seams to me there is some pretty knowledgeble people  already reading this ..

i want to put
upgraded triple tree ,forks , swing arm , rearsets , and what ever i can strip off of a newer bike ..
 what should i go for like a GXSR.. CBR..  any ideas give me a year and type .. would love to hear your thoughts

[lucky]

Maybe none of this was your fault.

Who sold you the motorcycle?

"and i kinda broke this bolt "
"i kinda power washed the engine"
"thought i sealed all the ports but i guess not "

Did you buy a workshop manual for your motorcycle?

I think you should slow down and read that manual.
It will help you a lot.

[Irukandji]

Im sorry L3niin
From reading all your posts it seems you are in way over your head in this project.
As lucky said, get a manual (and a shop class friend to help)

i think im just gonna replace all the messed up parts .. and just call it a day ..

 
ok another question it seams to me there is some pretty knowledgeble people  already reading this ..

i want to put
upgraded triple tree ,forks , swing arm , rearsets , and what ever i can strip off of a newer bike ..
 what should i go for like a GXSR.. CBR..  any ideas give me a year and type .. would love to hear your thoughts