Author Topic: How pitted is TOO pitted?  (Read 4906 times)

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Offline MCRider

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Re: How pitted is TOO pitted?
« Reply #25 on: August 23, 2012, 01:29:31 PM »
haven't gotten to the brake yet on my project, but i am curious and found that bikebandit.com lists the same part number for cb350f and cb550k and others.  then i did a search and found a stainless steel piston for $38 plus $6 shipping on ebay.  the ad says the piston fits these bikes: 

CB350F (72-74)

CB350G (73)

CB360 (74)

CB360G (74)

CB360T (75-76)

CB400F (75-77)

CB450 (72-74)

CB500 K0-K2 (71-73)

CB500T (75-76)

CB550F (75-77)

CB550K (74-78)


not a bad price for new, stainless.  ebay seller has 11,753 happy customers.  i may go this route is needed.
I was thinking there are sources other than OEM for these at better prices than OEM. I can't remember the forum members name that was selling the phenolics, at the time he was hit or miss on availlabilty. Seems I paid $35 each for those as well. (CB750) I think he sold on eBay as well.
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline TwoTired

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Re: How pitted is TOO pitted?
« Reply #26 on: August 23, 2012, 01:36:27 PM »
For phenolic, try Kevin400F.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline MCRider

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Re: How pitted is TOO pitted?
« Reply #27 on: August 23, 2012, 02:49:50 PM »
For phenolic, try Kevin400F.

Cheers,
That was him, thanks TT.
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline brewsky

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Re: How pitted is TOO pitted?
« Reply #28 on: August 24, 2012, 03:02:49 AM »
The piston IS reusable.
Don't worry about leaks, it won't.
Don't worry about braking action.  That will be fine, also.

The only possible issue with that piston *might* be retraction.
The square section seal goes (distorts) parallelogram during brake application.  When pressure is released the seal returns to square and pulls the piston back with it.
When the seal encounters piston pits, it changes how the seal is shaped at the pit area and that has an effect on it's retraction ability.  A few pits have very little impact on the this ability.  But, the detriment increases with the population and depth of the pits.
I wouldn't think that the small amount of pitting shown in the picture would be noticeable, and I've reused pistons with far more pitting successfully.
If it has any problem, it will show up as a dragging brake.  (Realize there are other causes to dragging brakes, too.)

The second issue with the pits is the loss of the plating and susceptibility to further corrosion.  However, if you fill the pits with the proper Dow Corning high vacuum pure silicone grease.  Water can't get at the de-plated steel and corrosion is thwarted.

Certainly a new piston won't hurt.  But, there is still service life in the one pictured, imo.

Cheers,

I'm confused now.......I thought the silicone grease was NOT to be used on the piston or seal, just on the pad sliding surfaces, and assembly lube or brake fluid was the only thing to lube the seal/piston with?
66 CA77
78 550K
78 CB750K
02 FZ1
09 GL 1800

Offline TwoTired

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Re: How pitted is TOO pitted?
« Reply #29 on: August 24, 2012, 10:05:06 AM »
The seal divides the piston into two areas one side of the seal has brake fluid and the other side is exposed to air a water from without.  Directly under the seal is ideally nothing, but to help it slide during assembly, we use some assembly lube.

The piston pitting is predominantly on the piston side exposed to water, salts, and atmospheric impurities, notably oxygen.
Once the chrome plating is breached on the piston, the far more reactive underlying steel is exposed.  To arrest further corrosion the silicone grease fills to pits, blocking water and oxygen access to the piston's base steel, arresting deterioration.

Clearly if the pitting is excessive, silicone grease cannot take the place of steel.  But, as the silicone does not combine or dilute with anything, it is not washed away by water or brake fluid.

Ideally, you do not want any silicone in a DOT3 containment vessel.  But, if the piston pits are small and under (or beyond) the seal instead of inside the DOT3 vessel, silicone grease does little harm.   However, if you must have uncompromising ideal conditions, then get yourself a new piston.

Also, be aware that it's not just the piston beyond the seal that is environment exposed, the aluminum caliper walls are as well.  A thin coat of silicone grease there, arrests corrosion of the caliper body.  Remember, the grease stays put unless mechanically pushed of placement site and isn't diluted with anything.  A very very thin coat is an excellent water shed.  And, if it sheds water, it blocks oxygen (therefore corrosion), too.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline brewsky

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Re: How pitted is TOO pitted?
« Reply #30 on: August 24, 2012, 04:23:13 PM »
Thanks for the clarification TT, now if it would just stop the squealing I would really be sold!
66 CA77
78 550K
78 CB750K
02 FZ1
09 GL 1800