Author Topic: K3 Café {yet to be named}  (Read 10106 times)

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Offline UncleD

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K3 Café {yet to be named}
« on: August 15, 2012, 06:36:56 PM »
I guess it’s time I started this build thread. I bought a bunch of parts that included this K3 frame (no motor) but with clear title and already painted. My original plan was to use these parts for my K4 and then eventually café the K3. The K4 ran well and looked pretty good but needed cleaning up. I couldn't wait to tear it down and clean it up. I will start a separate thread when I am ready to start the K4.

In the mean time I have been collecting/gathering and preparing parts for the K3. Here are some pictures to start.

K3 Frame all ready for assembly. As you can see, I couldn't wait to try on some of the parts. This is the spare F tank painted in black with a very dark blue flame on one side and yellow/orange flame on the other side of the tank. I think the PO was experimenting a bit on the design. This will probably get repainted eventually.

Also some parts I have been cleaning and preparing for install.

« Last Edit: August 15, 2012, 06:43:41 PM by UncleD »

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2012, 06:52:06 PM »
...and I've been doing some zinc plating in my garage. More on that later.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2012, 07:03:27 PM by UncleD »

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2012, 06:40:46 PM »
Triple tree bearings:
I bought these from a local shop. They didn't have the All Balls bearings but the guy said this Japanese brand are just as good.
2nd pic shows the parts with the rubber seal (not included with bearing kit).
3rd & 4th pic shows the Japanese brand beside the original Honda bearings.

Notice the thicker washer that was included in the kit. Measured the washer (5th pic) to be 3.92mm versus 0.65mm stock part (6th pic).

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2012, 07:09:00 PM »
...so I did some measurements.
Pic1 - the stock Honda bearings including rubber seal and washer measured 18.05mm
Pic2 - the new Japanese bearings including rubber seal and washer measured 22.56mm
Pic3 - instead of using the new thicker washer I used the stock Honda washer and got a measurement of 19.24mm; so I'm going with this combination.
The last three pics is what I ended up with.

Offline Tews19

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2012, 07:45:49 PM »
Nice work, very detailed.
1969 Honda CB750... Basket case
1970 Honda CB750 survivor.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2012, 07:47:34 PM »
Thanks Tews19..... this will be a slow process, but I'm enjoying it.

Offline CycleRanger

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #6 on: August 27, 2012, 07:52:07 PM »
...and I've been doing some zinc plating in my garage. More on that later.

Yes please! :)
Do you have a copy of the Honda Shop Manual or Parts List for your bike? Get one here:
https://www.honda4fun.com/materiale/documentazione-tecnica
CB750K5        '79 XL250s     CL350K3
CB750K3        '76 XS650      '76 CJ360T

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2012, 06:28:32 PM »
...and I've been doing some zinc plating in my garage. More on that later.

Yes please! :)
Electroplate at Home (one piece at a time):

I realize it might have been easier and more cost effective to send a bucket full of parts to the plater, but I really wanted to do my own plating.

To get started I bought one of these kits from Caswell

http://www.caswellplating.com/electroplating-anodizing/brush-plating-products/plug-n-plate-kits/plug-n-plater-zinc-plating-kit.html

Very simple to use and I got good results. Good for small parts only though. But when I read the warning label on the bottle, I got concerned about what I was breathing in. Yes I wore a mask and protective gear, but you never know.

My online search for a safe and friendly way to electroplate at home resulted in this instruction below.

http://www.ehow.com/how_8074590_electroplate-home.html

There is not one item in the ingredient list that I would worry about. Heck if I can zinc plate the rustiest bolt I can find on my bike using these ingredients, how cool would that be?
This is also good only for small parts. Instead of using the “D” cell battery, I used the power supply that came with the Caswell kit. I also read somewhere that molasses instead of sugar produced a better shine.

So the basic steps I follow are:
1) wash/dry the part to remove oil and dirt
2) wire-brush the part you want to plate to remove caked in dirt or rust (especially threaded parts)
3) Submerge the part in muriatic acid (same stuff used to control pH in swimming pools). This dissolves the old plating. Take precautions and I try to use small amounts only. Use only enough to submerge the part. This is the chemical that you have to really take precautions with. Do not breathe it in; do not get it on your skin. If you find a better way to strip the old plating or rust, I would be interested to hear it.
4) Rinse thoroughly. I leave it in a bucket of water while I prepare to put it in the plating solution (slows down flash rust).
5) Attach the part to the alligator clip and submerge in the solution. Duration depends on your power supply and how thick you want it to be plated.
6) Remove from the solution, dry it and use a brass wire brush to get the shiny zinc appearance.

Problems I've come across:
1) I didn't leave the part in the solution long enough. Therefore plating is not thick enough and even after polishing the part still looks dark not silver and shiny. If you let it sit long enough rust will start to appear.
2) The solution eventually corrodes or eats away the alligator clip.
3) I ran out of pennies (source of zinc).


I just recently found this in ‘K Two’ build thread. It looks much more efficient than my method. I think I will try this out in the future.

http://home.comcast.net/~rt66tbird/website/zincplating.html

Here are some more parts that I plated.




Offline CycleRanger

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2012, 07:50:59 PM »
Looks nice!  You can also get zinc anodes that are used for boat hulls.
Do you have a copy of the Honda Shop Manual or Parts List for your bike? Get one here:
https://www.honda4fun.com/materiale/documentazione-tecnica
CB750K5        '79 XL250s     CL350K3
CB750K3        '76 XS650      '76 CJ360T

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2012, 08:06:40 PM »
Looks nice!  You can also get zinc anodes that are used for boat hulls.
Yes, I'm now actually using a piece off of my boat. The fin part of the anode broke last year and for some reason I kept it in the shed. Now I know why I kept it  :)

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2012, 06:30:21 PM »
A word of caution about zinc plating.

My buddy pointed me to this link http://www.infinitechfinishing.com/Articles/Article7.htm about Zinc Plating. Read the section “You Crack Me Up!  Hydrogen Embrittlement is No Laughing Matter” in the article below.
Basically be careful about zinc plating high strength bolts and fasteners because of hydrogen embrittlement. Plating mild steel parts and brackets don't seem to be a big problem but be careful about high strength steel parts.

 
 

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2012, 07:20:42 PM »
This is the 74 motor I want to use. It came with the K4 I bought last year. This one needs a total rebuild. I'm cheating a bit because these pictures were actually taken 1 year ago when I dismantled this motor.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2012, 07:34:25 PM »
....some more.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2012, 08:17:46 PM »
The insides are looking really bad.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2012, 08:20:26 PM »
....really bad.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2012, 05:57:50 PM »
....piston and exhaust port view. Notice the piece of fin missing?

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2012, 06:09:57 PM »
Case split and not surprisingly, more crud on the inside.

Offline iron_worker

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2012, 12:59:38 PM »
I just got a zinc plating kit from Caswell and I'm starting to read and figure it out. ... however they sent me the wrong heater by mistake so I'm held up for a bit.

 What kind of surface prep did you do to get a finish like that? Did you strip the old zinc? Did you do any polishing?

IW

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2012, 04:13:28 PM »
I just got a zinc plating kit from Caswell and I'm starting to read and figure it out. ... however they sent me the wrong heater by mistake so I'm held up for a bit.

 What kind of surface prep did you do to get a finish like that? Did you strip the old zinc? Did you do any polishing?

IW
IW, the only prep I did is to clean any loose dirt, oil from the part. Then I dipped it in muriatic acid until bare metal is exposed. Rinsed it in water, towel dry then plated it.
The Caswell kit is good to get started, but I found it quickly too small to do all the parts I wanted to do.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2012, 04:17:56 PM »
I just got a zinc plating kit from Caswell and I'm starting to read and figure it out. ... however they sent me the wrong heater by mistake so I'm held up for a bit.

 What kind of surface prep did you do to get a finish like that? Did you strip the old zinc? Did you do any polishing?

IW
IW, after zinc plating and letting it sit overnight, I lightly polished it using a soft brass brush.

Offline iron_worker

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2012, 05:56:24 PM »
I got their 1.5gal Copy CAD and Zinc Plating kit:

http://www.caswellcanada.ca/shop/copy-cad-zinc-plating-kit.html

And I got their 2000W incoloy heater (and they shipped the wrong one ...arg. New one on it's way though.):

http://www.caswellcanada.ca/shop/2000w-mini-incoloy-heater.html

I also bought a 5A power supply off ebay for a bit cheaper than they list their 3A one.

So I think this setup should be pretty good for what I need. I was just reading and by the sounds of it they recommend you polish your bare steel to a bright shine if you want a true bright almost chrome like look. Perhaps that is too much though. Maybe I don't want to attract that much attention to the hardware. ha

IW

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2012, 07:37:56 PM »
I got their 1.5gal Copy CAD and Zinc Plating kit:

http://www.caswellcanada.ca/shop/copy-cad-zinc-plating-kit.html

And I got their 2000W incoloy heater (and they shipped the wrong one ...arg. New one on it's way though.):

http://www.caswellcanada.ca/shop/2000w-mini-incoloy-heater.html

I also bought a 5A power supply off ebay for a bit cheaper than they list their 3A one.

So I think this setup should be pretty good for what I need. I was just reading and by the sounds of it they recommend you polish your bare steel to a bright shine if you want a true bright almost chrome like look. Perhaps that is too much though. Maybe I don't want to attract that much attention to the hardware. ha

IW

Ahh you bought the bigger unit. I only bought the plug and plate kit http://www.caswellcanada.ca/shop/plug-n-plate-zinc-plating-kit.html ..... too small and too little.
The few pieces that I plated using the Caswell kit turned out really nice. But I was worried about breathing in the fumes from the zinc solutions included in the kit. So I started to look for a less toxic solution which consist of vinegar, epsom salt, molasses. In my opinion it works equally well as the kit and a lot more cost effective.

« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 09:45:05 AM by UncleD »

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #22 on: November 26, 2012, 08:11:25 PM »
Upon closer inspection I noticed this crack on the shifter hole. Can I simply have this piece welded?

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2012, 07:11:52 PM »
Some pics of after a quick soda blast. Looks much cleaner now. Notice the nicks/dents in the fins?

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2012, 07:14:57 PM »
...and a big chunk of fin missing.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2012, 07:16:56 PM »
view from the bottom.

Offline UncleD

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Re: K3 Café {yet to be named}
« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2012, 07:24:31 PM »
I am wondering if I should attempt to remove these plugs. Based on the amount of sludge I found in the rest of the motor, I suspect these should be opened up. What do you guys think? I welcome any advice. Thanks.