Author Topic: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?  (Read 1603 times)

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Offline 736cc

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Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« on: October 04, 2012, 05:31:12 AM »
My 78 Supersport front signals/running lights have me scratching my head. The front running lights work. When I push the signal switch either way, the running lights shut-off and signal starts to blink UNTIL the switch goes to the detent position, and then signal stays on w/o blinking. This is driving me nuts, and I've spent waaay too much time trying to fix it and it hasn't gotten fixed. The running lights are not as bright as the signals. The left signal is the orange wire, the left running light is the orange/white wire. The right signal is the light blue wire, the right running light is the light blue/white wire. Signals are grounded. Rear signals flash until the switch goes to the detent position. I replaced the signal stat and same results. What is going on inside the left handlebar switch? What can cause this problem?

Offline LesterPiglet

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2012, 05:36:16 AM »
How are they supposed to operate? I thought this was normal...no? I'm in the UK so don't have running lights.
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Offline millerza

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2012, 05:41:31 AM »
are the blinkers ever off? if so how?

Offline 736cc

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2012, 06:06:59 AM »
The blinkers are off when the handlebar switch is in the "off" position. The front running lights are on when switch is in that position.

Offline bryanj

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2012, 09:39:39 AM »
What happens with the engine running as that gives extra volts
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Offline freeze

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2012, 10:14:44 AM »
sounds like the contact in the switch are dirty and/or corroded. open the handle bar switch and clean the contacts, apply some dielectric grease if you have some.

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2012, 10:25:23 AM »
The stock flasher unit is sensitive to voltage and load conditions.

Stock front bulbs were 1034 and are often replaced with 1157, which is higher wattage.
Rear bulbs were 1073 and are often replaced with 1156 which is higher wattage.

Changing bulbs changes the load condition on the stock flasher unit.

Next is voltage sensitivity. The stock flasher operates faster as the voltage increases.

When engine is stopped and electrical load placed on battery, the system voltage lowers.
It also matters if the battery is at full charge.  And, turn signals seldom matter (operationally) if the engine is not running.

Even if the battery is full and the engine running, revved, the voltage to the system can be low if the connectors switch contacts, and fuse clips have oxidation/added resistance.  The voltage loss increases with the current flowing through it.  So, having a higher load like the headlight on will induce more voltage loss on the black wires in the harness which powers just about everything.  Don't forget ground connections, as they are part of the current loop out and back to the battery.
 
Many don't wish to go through the electrical system and clean the switch contacts, polish fuse clips and restore the connections to low loss connectivity, and simply replace the flasher unit with one that is insensitive to the system voltage levels (not stock).

I prefer the original, as the flash rate tells me if the system is charging and gives a battery health indication in the process, without adding a voltmeter.  It can also indicate when attention to voltage distribution components is warranted.

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Offline bjbuchanan

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2012, 11:19:18 AM »
My bike does the same thing its the switch contacts. I switched to a new round 2 prong flasher flasher and cleaned the contacts but apparently not good enough. I live with it, ill atleast not be the tool with the flasher on for miles ::)
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Offline 750resurrection

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2012, 11:19:52 AM »
Thanks for those orig bulb numbers TT.

 I had the same thing 736cc, the left turn signal was the weakest and liked to be the first to just stay lit and not blink.

 I have since replaced the flasher, EL13 at autozone, is working great.
 Before doing that I did have the left Hb control off and cleaned it and shot some CRC electrical crap in there (which i'm sure is melting away the plastic now - whatever)...
 
 Also cleaned a few grounds in the turn signals - cleared it up - or it's cleared up but not sure exactly if it was the flasher that did more than cleaning - I have handy access to the old flasher unit, but to keep myself blissfully ignorant I'm not going to go plug it in right now which would take less than 2 minutes for certain.

 I also had a low battery I think that didn't help much either. Plus my main keyswitch had problems in the lower plastic - someone had x-taped it to the keyswitch body after cracking the tabs... the tape had dried and stretched and it half hung out on one side - the rear brake running light didn't like that.

 I bet if you buy that autozone flasher and put it in it "solves" ( oh sorry masks) the (real) problem(s)... (I added the parenthesis stuff because TT is here... LOL )
« Last Edit: October 04, 2012, 11:24:29 AM by 750resurrection »

Offline bjbuchanan

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #9 on: October 04, 2012, 04:53:00 PM »
The new flasher was needed on my bike because I have non stock signals and the one I had was no good anyway. Depending on the light setup you might actually need it
The dirty girl-1976 cb750k, Ebay 836, Tracy bodykit
Round top carbs w/ 38 pilots, middle needle position, airscrew 7/8ths out, 122 main jet
Stock airbox w/ drop in K&N, Hooker 4-1

Don't trust me alone with a claw hammer and some pliers

Offline millerza

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2012, 08:28:30 PM »
The detent is pushed farthest left or right, so it stays? Here the blinker is constant on?
Does it continue to blink on the middle spot where you have to hold it?

Im not exactly sure what detent is refering to, hence the question. 

Offline 736cc

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2012, 03:57:34 AM »
Quote
The detent is pushed farthest left or right, so it stays? Here the blinker is constant on?
Does it continue to blink on the middle spot where you have to hold it?
The "detent" is the spot where the switch clicks "on" right and left. My blinkers start blinking as it the switch gets VERY CLOSE to the detent (and the running light shuts off); when it clicks into the detent, they suddenly stop blinking and just light up constant (with running lights still off). So, if I push it and hold just before the detent, the signals work normally but its not ez to hold the switch w/ my thumb delicately in that tenuous position during maneuvers like left turns in traffic and clutching.

Offline millerza

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Re: Who Understands 1978 Front Running Lights/Signals?
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2012, 07:15:13 PM »
there are different connections made in these two positions. If you look at a diagram that detent uses the buzzer, where the spot "close to detent" does not. My first thought was wiring problem, maybe something with the buzzer too.
In the diagram it will look like L2 L1 N R1 R2   
L2 is left detent
L1 is "close to detent"
N is off     etc.
also only one running light should go off at a time. Because the same filament is used, or appears that way. Left blinker on=left running light off&right running light on
 hope this helps
« Last Edit: October 06, 2012, 06:03:03 AM by millerza »