Topic: imola 200 - where are the hondas?

[turboguzzi]

another win for the motobel guzzi, says turboguzzi

http://imola.perugiatiming.com/risultati/default.asp?p_Anno=2013&p_Gara=1&p_Manifestazione=51&p_Sessione=001

pretty impressive when you consider they were down by almost 20kmh in top speed compared to the fours

http://imola.perugiatiming.com/risultati/default.asp?p_Anno=2013&p_Manifestazione=51&p_Gara=1&p_Sessione=001&p_Stampa=W

quite bit of carnage, only 34 finishers out of 54 starters

And still, someone needs to save honda's honour, best placed H was in 17 place. Alex D, where are you?

Weather forecast was really bad so opted not to drive down, feel really stupid as it was pretty dry all day long.  There's always next year right?

[mec]

congrats to motobel guzzi. fantastic performance.
but to be honest, when it comes to speed/laptimes, nowadays the guzzi is in the 6th place regio.
honda, kawa and suzuki are in front. the fastest honda suffered from a slipping clutch, the ultrafast goudier genoud kawa crashed in the first lap. i do not know what happened to the second placed "sweatshop" kawa, long time they have been the fastest on the track.
but all in all the best team won: two fast riders, one fast and reliable bike, very good team structure and strategy.
there is a lot to learn: for example how to make a special frame for the guzzi that looks like an oem frame (but is optimized from front to rear ).

some observations: without money you are nowhere. crazy all the efforts...

ducati TT2 in forth...WOW

the one and only CB500R to sell.

mec

[turboguzzi]

well, with everybody running harris, segale, rau, segoni and other frames, dont think motobel's "replica" of stock is an unfair advantage

you mean this one is for sale?
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=37074.0;attach=52843;image

if it is, really surprising that mama honda doesnt want it back to their collection.

crazy costs, sure, i wanted to do the race with Alex of Darvill Racing and just the expenses where way over my head. But how to keep costs down? not that replica manxes, G50's and patons are that cheap either.

did your friend built the 810 kawi?

[mec]

no, no, i dont think thats motobel does have an unfair advantage. however i admire their replica frame. its a piece of art.

its the attached cb500r (btw your link doesnt work).

to keep cost down you will have to change your mental mentality: throw away all thoughts of winning, better forget to finish under the best 20ties. then you are not forced to invest into a quick fueler system, a ton of tires, a spare race bike (for training sessions only)...and so on.
but if that what makes you happy?

the second attachement shows some missing teeth, segarra guzzi. unfortunately this happened  at the beginning of the race and not during practisesessions.

my friends kawa is in its final building stage, another two weeks for first roll out (depends on time and work my friend does). my mono-rotax will be ready for first starting up these days.

mec

[PeWe]

2:nd place to SWEDEN!! 

SWEATSHOP PHASE ONE - Peter Lindén
I remembered the name when I read an article about during the 1980's when he worked as a jet fighter pilot AND Road Racing when not flying. Recently retired from the Swedish air force.

[turboguzzi]

BTW, the riders of the TT2 duc , Paravano and Damiani are our national vintage champions, these guys are fast. Can tell you form personal experience... Damiani who is 50 something entered last year a national round of the professional supertwins class and took a third among all the fast kids...

yes, mec, thats the bike honda sent to Samoto Roma to use in some races and then it remained here in italy

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=37074.msg382765#msg382765

Rotax supermono? So maybe its time to come out with my new  project ....  i am building a supermono too, XTZ 660 motor in a TZ250 frame. from this year there will be a classic supermono class in italy for pre 1992 bikes, so you are welcome to come and try

you can follow my build here:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Super-Emmo/334019393364811

quite few pictures in there, takes time to load

peewee, sweatshop/phase one are a British team

[PeWe]

peewee, sweatshop/phase one are a british a British team

I mean the driver Peter Lindén. There is one Road racing guy with than name from Sweden :-)

[Darvill Racing]

Hi all,
Would love to have been there but the costs and logistics made it untenable!

For the record, even without a second bike (we don't have one) the cost in fuel and tyres means a lot of ££££'s before you take into consideration Logistics/food/entry fees.

The Honda's can be competitive but you need to invest in engine and frame (for both the SOHC and DOHC machines).... Plus above all this you have to finish!

Regards,
A

[voxonda]

Wow Guys, I do miss the "SPIRIT". No one can tell me a Honda cannot be up there. Here is so much knowledge gathered so let's build one!!!!

[Darvill Racing]

You don't need to ask me twice Rob....!

We both have machines that are capable, I have the infrastructure, just need the funds....

[simon#42]

all these races are over subscribed so you are going to have to have a proven record and a couple of very good riders to even get in . the infrastructure must include quick fillers , at least half a dozen sets of wheels and discs plus pretty much a complete bike in spares [ all exactly the same as the bike you are using ]  i suppose it may be possible to make a sohc honda competitive but it will need a serious investment from someone . things get expensive at this level , even racing a superstock bike at bsb a couple of years ago our tyre bill was over two grand a meeting . either get your money out or forget it !

[Darvill Racing]

What I said....

Got the lot not the cash.....!

[turboguzzi]

well, the fact that a world endurance team (phase one) left modern bikes for classics racing, tells you something about the level there...

that said, the italian round at least is run as part of our national championship, so they pretty much had to accept any local entries. had a few friends who entered it at "fast amateur level" (2:15 lap times) they enjoyed it quite a lot running midfield, till it lasted for both of them, lack of machine preparation meant DNF's....

If the guzzis can be competitive then a dohc honda should be too, still wondering how the 16 valve CB900-1100 based bikes cant match the two valve Kawi for top speed. Never mind the 16 GSX based suzuki's. 

[simon#42]

yes i wondered that as well ,  the guzzi's benefit from the fact that a lot of the modern parts retro fit into the old bikes . things havnt changed much over the years on the banks of lake Como !

[mec]

hi folks,

forget to finish under top ten with an old sohc. the rules say up to 1980. unless there is a class for 1970 and older you will not have a chance with our oldfashioned sohc. even if you have 120rwhp, you will be very sad when a +150hp 4valver or Z1260 kawa overtakes you. in addition to this you will have to use quick fasteners as motor mounts
btw i am not sure, if engine change is allowed by the rules (team segarra did so, after two hours repair they started the new engine and blue smoke came from the alternator regio cause of a wrong +/- wire connection).

dohc hondas are competitive, but the cost is double the cost of Z900/1000 bike. reliability is also a weak point compared to the Z´s.

the first 20min onboard the Motobel Guzzi:
http://www.youtube.com/embed/96VgIZoKa90

mec

[voxonda]

Hi mec,

totally agree with you, but........................................what is living without a challenge. Forget about riding/racing all together if winning is your goal. There are to many, former, riders out there who have raced at GP500 level! See for example Henk van de Mark from the Roadrunner team, Stephane Mertens at Dholda and so on.
Big issue would be the money involved, o so sad but true!

Rob

[simon#42]

the whole point of racing is trying to win otherwise you are just wasting petrol and wearing engines out .  the people that say its the money that stops them racing dont want to bad enough . if you really want it the money can be found . its just that you have to give alot of other things up to be able to afford it . so ..... lets see , stop drinking and smoking , sell all the road bikes , cancel that holiday , buy a crap car and sell the good one , work seven days a week , maybe get a second job at night . now you can afford to go to the races , but do you really want to that bad ?

[Darvill Racing]

In response Simon....

YES....

Which is why I moved to the 'Rock' to keep costs down and continue racing.

BTW
Is anyone over for the Pre TT/TT or the Southern 100...?

[simon#42]

that's fine if your only racing in the island alex , makes it very difficult to race anywhere else though . i could probably get to imola cheaper than you could get to liverpool !

[Darvill Racing]

Very true Simon,
We weighed up the annual costs of coming to the Island for the TT and Manx (without taking into consideration racing) and it made financial sense to not leave one day..

When we do go to the Classic Bol or Spa etc it does really increase the cost... Gotta love the Steam Racket!

Has its ups though... I can see the Bilown circuit from here ;o)