Author Topic: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?  (Read 8037 times)

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Offline motosan

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Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« on: June 24, 2013, 09:30:11 PM »
I did a pretty good job on the mechanical part and the bike is running super strong.  But....when it comes to electrics, it's like my first visit to a strip club....I don't even know where to put my hands.  So I've been putting it off.  But ....the time has come.... so would you please give me some pointers?   

My headlight was very dim.  So I took it apart, and I found that evidently, the original owner of my 550 put an SEV Marchal H4 (w/65w bulb), whose reflector is now severely discolored. so I'm thinking about re-plating it.  Any other good method for resurrecting the reflector?  (i'll be asking a shop to do it for me)



Now...here is the real question.  How do I tell if there is a relay for the H4 or not?  I read in some posts that putting a relay will be beneficial like improving light intensity and the light switch life expectancy and such.  Below is a set of pictures of wiring...i see some loose ends that aren't connected to anything else.  I have a multi-meter so I can check some stuff.  As far as its condition, everything except the front blinkers are working (which I'm pretty sure I can fix easily)

In essence, can you see if I have any relays for this light unit?  And how would you recommend I change this mess to improve the longevity of all other parts?  (buying everything Hondaman sells? :) )  Any help is appreciated, and thank you very much in advance!! 


One loose wire (not shown)


Loose wire in the center of the pic...any idea what this could be??


The entire elec panel
« Last Edit: June 24, 2013, 10:28:59 PM by motosan »
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Offline kghost

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Re: Found H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2013, 09:40:27 PM »
You can still buy the original lights. It comes as a complete sealed beam light.

They are not very expensive. I for one have never noticed a huge benefit to having super duper H4 bulbs on a motorcycle.

The benefit to the original is it has the reflector built in and no wiring or relay required.

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Offline Deltarider

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2013, 11:39:35 PM »
The discolored reflector is probably the result of installing a H4 bulb with bare hands. Never touch a H4 bulb this way. Almost everybody overhere uses H4 bulbs. Sealed beam lights are not known here. Halogen offers twice as much light, really. Just buy a good brand. Good old Philips is top, especially their Ecovision. H4 is no problem if you ride the bike as ment. The issue of a charging problem is exclusively discussed in this forum, which lead me to the conclusion bikes in US maybe are not revved enough. Americans are used to low rpm as consequence of the oversized engines in their cars. Maybe that's why.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 12:29:08 AM by Deltarider »
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Offline bryanj

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2013, 11:45:21 PM »
Some of the 77/78 models came with the H4 standard, or at least here in the UK they did and did not need a relay or any modifications, as to replating the reflector firstly the glass should not be seperate and secondly it will cost more than a new unit.

Just source a new unit on ebay  which can be eithe H4 or sealed beam
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Offline LesterPiglet

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2013, 12:16:38 AM »
Your green loose wire is spare. Normally used for a three prong flasher unit.
'Then' and 'than' are completely different words and have completely different meanings. Same with 'of' and 'have'. Set and sit. There, their and they're. Draw and drawer. Could care less/couldn't care less. Bought/brought FFS.


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Offline dave500

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2013, 12:19:17 AM »
ive been running 60/55w  h4 for years with no relay and no trouble,i have like less than a half volt drop to the terminals,osram silverstar or nightbreakers,not those pretend blue ones your supposed to think are brighter,be sure all your connections are real clean and tight,the wire running to the globe dosent even feel warm when run for some time.

Offline kghost

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2013, 01:29:35 AM »
The Replaceable bulb lights were illegal in the USA before 1983 fyi
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Offline trueblue

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2013, 01:40:07 AM »
The Replaceable bulb lights were illegal in the USA before 1983 fyi
Why? Were they afraid of being able to see at night?
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Offline Deltarider

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2013, 03:14:29 AM »
Quote
Quote from: kghost on Today at 03:29:35 am

The Replaceable bulb lights were illegal in the USA before 1983 fyi


Why? Were they afraid of being able to see at night?

No, it's more they were afraid they wouldn't create enough waste.  ;D
Same era the average Yank would open all windows if it got to warm inside (instead of turning the heating down).


« Last Edit: June 26, 2013, 12:26:28 AM by Deltarider »
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Offline kghost

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2013, 03:21:57 AM »

Quote
Quote from: kghost on Today at 03:29:35 am

The Replaceable bulb lights were illegal in the USA before 1983 fyi


Why? Were they afraid of being able to see at night?

No, it's more they were afraid they wouldn't create enough waste.  ;D
Same era the average Yank would open a window if it got to warm inside (instead of turning the heating down).




I have no #$%*ing idea why they did that.

Nor am I a yank.

now go watch your American tv shows at STFU lol
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Offline Deltarider

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2013, 03:33:19 AM »
STFU?
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Offline kghost

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2013, 03:35:12 AM »
*and
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Offline motosan

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2013, 07:22:53 AM »
Thanks for all the input guys!


I'm glad to that I don't really have to worry about flasher and all.  At least cleaning is piece of cake.  I'll just go to radioshack or somewhere and get a whole bunch of connectors and replace them all to make sure everything is clean. 

Green is a spare, good to know.

Some of the 77/78 models came with the H4 standard, or at least here in the UK they did and did not need a relay or any modifications, as to replating the reflector firstly the glass should not be seperate and secondly it will cost more than a new unit.

Just source a new unit on ebay  which can be eithe H4 or sealed beam

I just got a quote for re-plating, $75.  I think I'll just go get a new one as you said for the time  being.  I took the glass off since the seal was pretty much a little fancy version of caulk and i thought i could just polish it.  Obviously a wrong choice! :)    I did find something interesting though... a working unit of SEV Marchal headlight is going for $375+ on ebay.  How ridiculous is that!?  Just for that....I might actually fix it.

 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-SEV-Marchal-H4-Headlight-7-16464-52-Code-61248503-/360494623613?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53ef276b7d&vxp=mtr


Quote
Quote from: kghost on Today at 03:29:35 am
now go watch your American tv shows at STFU lol

with @ STFU = Star Trek Federation University  makes sense.
with & only "Save The Flying Unicorns" makes sense. 

kghost, I'm more than curious about what's going on in your country but I'm pretty sure I'm glad i don't live there.
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05 FZ600
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Offline Duanob

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2013, 08:28:33 AM »
You can buy a new H4 reflector and bulb for around $40. Its well worth it. I put a 35/35W in mine and it puts out about the same light as my old OEM sealed bulb and draws less power from the charging system. Or you can go with 55/60W and have more light with about the same power draw. i don't drive at night a lot so I don't worry about the output more about the input of an old anemic charging system.
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Offline kghost

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2013, 01:54:51 PM »
My comment was directed at people who like to "slag off" America and Americans.

It's tiresome in the extreme when people criticise some place they have no experience with.

FYI I live in Australia. It's quite nice here. I also still have a house and shop in Texas.

I've lived in about 6 different countries ( as in spent more than a year at a time in each), I don't criticise your country......don't make comments about anyone else's.

Oh....and I was drinking rum last night lol ;)
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Offline Bankerdanny

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2013, 03:32:40 PM »
I upgraded my Royal Enfield from sealed beam to halogen and the difference was remarkable. It was like the sealed beam had been a candle rather than an electric light.

My 550 just had the original sealed beam though, and it didn't seem dim to me.

The H4 bulbs were illegal here due to strict and antiquated rules by the US Department of Transportation. That's American cars didn't get aero headlights until after Europe and why Audi is currently fighting with the DOT over the adjustable LED headlamps it offers in Europe.
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Offline motosan

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2013, 05:20:22 PM »
My comment was directed at people who like to "slag off" America and Americans.

It's tiresome in the extreme when people criticise some place they have no experience with.

FYI I live in Australia. It's quite nice here. I also still have a house and shop in Texas.

I've lived in about 6 different countries ( as in spent more than a year at a time in each), I don't criticise your country......don't make comments about anyone else's.

Oh....and I was drinking rum last night lol ;)

Hey i hope you didn't take what i said in a wrong way....just making a dumb joke about the acronym STFU :)  By the way, did you know the Australian embassy in DC has a basement full of alcohol for its employees?  They get a shipment of container 'often'.  I have never seen a mountain of beer that big!

I must agree with Deltarider to a certain degree by the way, not about RPM thing, but how Americans in suburbs tend to want to drive anywhere.  I mean...my wife/mom always seem to want to drive, even for the distance of 5-10 min walk.  That's no good for neither the battery nor the exhaust system.  it's inconceivable in Tokyo where i grew up.

You can buy a new H4 reflector and bulb for around $40. Its well worth it. I put a 35/35W in mine and it puts out about the same light as my old OEM sealed bulb and draws less power from the charging system. Or you can go with 55/60W and have more light with about the same power draw. i don't drive at night a lot so I don't worry about the output more about the input of an old anemic charging system.

Thanks D.  I was reading up about charging system a little.  Since I don't ride at night, 35/35w sounds good to me.  I'll bookmark what people are talking about on the charging system and upgrade later if I need to.

I found a CHEAP and pretty cool looking one.  http://www.ebay.com/itm/7-H4-EURO-CRYSTAL-DIAMOND-MOTORCYCLE-HEADLIGHT-/250895412999


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04 CBR600F4i
05 FZ600
----------------------------------------------------

Offline kghost

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2013, 06:10:00 PM »
Was directed at our friend from the Netherlands.

I like the Netherlands. I wore myself out on a push bike last time I was there.

It's cool everyone rides their bike. Very efficient.
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2013, 07:07:47 PM »
As I recall, the sealed beam was mandated primarily to control the beam throw pattern and the overall size of the lamp.
The standardization prevented people from using huge search lights out front, blinding oncoming drivers.  (There were no cell phones back them to avert your eyes from oncoming head lamps at the time.)
There was also the need to keep left hand drive headlights from being operated here in the right hand drive states.

Further, the reflector shape and the glass mold pattern made it much more likely not blind oncoming drivers.  Citations due to modifications, were easy to keep independents "in line".   In short it was far easier to mandate and maintain a fleet of vehicles where the headlamp design was fixed and equalized among the populace, without a detailed and complicated codification of field test parameters.
Yearly or routine auto inspection weren't performed and the populace wouldn't have stood for it anyway.  The prohibition era had taught the populace to circumvent government controls.  If the US only allowed one type of bulb into the US, "creative alterations" became fewer and farther in between.

It also prevented the replacement of jeweled or focused cover glass with clear, thus blinding all oncoming drivers.

Once a law goes into the books, it tends to stay there, if for no other reason than to maintain the status quo.

You may understand that in 1940, there was a lot of sparsely rural areas, wide open spaces, and farmland.  People were fiercely independent and had learned to make do with very little (depression era and WWI rationing).  Anyone that has seen some farm machinery repairs, knows that elegance or design correctness is largely ignored in favor of getting the planting or harvesting done.

If you lived your entire life in cities or densely populated areas, where police are more prevalent, there was/is much less pronounced "offensive equipment" population, imo.

That's my recollection, anyway.  Besides, we Americans didn't give cr@p what the French, British, Germans or Dutch thought about our headlight legislation in the 30s and 40s.
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Offline motosan

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2013, 07:40:23 PM »
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Offline bryanj

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #20 on: June 25, 2013, 10:29:05 PM »
Ah well TT what it is over here is that England is so small in comparison and our roads are a lot older and follow the path lines from when people walked round trees, rocks,robbers(goverment or private), etc plus we have gzillions of roundabouts and drive on the correct side of the road so we have to have better lights in order to see the brick wall just before we hit it at speed.

But seriously I have noticed that  alot of US lights dip straight up and down whilst the european ones have a cut off pattern that alters depending on LH or RH drive
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Offline dave500

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #21 on: June 26, 2013, 12:37:57 AM »
heres how lamps here should look,note the sharp cutoff line that dosent shine onto the wrong side of the road on low beam,these are hella housings with 130/100 h4 bulbs,,then watch when the high beams get lit up,the two inboard 150watt clear lens landing lights come on with the 130 outers,,i havent seen a hid thatll out do this old set up yet?

Offline dusterdude

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #22 on: June 26, 2013, 07:17:16 PM »
I know on wheeler dealers they often change headlamps to uk specs,gotta say,you brits crack me up.
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Offline FuZZie

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #23 on: June 26, 2013, 07:45:55 PM »
check here before you spend, having them see you from a little farther away is a good thing. ;)
http://store.candlepower.com/cad.html

I did the 6, 3/8 kit they sell on my 400. I think the 500/550 was a 7" I'm not sure on the size though.
anyway low watt bulb is here http://store.candlepower.com/4512vh4hebu.html and I didn't need the relays but if you do I got the blade fuse panel from hondaman he does really nice bits. 

Offline motosan

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Re: Found an H4 on my 77 cb550...now what to do?
« Reply #24 on: June 26, 2013, 08:09:29 PM »
check here before you spend, having them see you from a little farther away is a good thing. ;)
http://store.candlepower.com/cad.html

I did the 6, 3/8 kit they sell on my 400. I think the 500/550 was a 7" I'm not sure on the size though.
anyway low watt bulb is here http://store.candlepower.com/4512vh4hebu.html and I didn't need the relays but if you do I got the blade fuse panel from hondaman he does really nice bits.

wow, i had no idea they were so close to my house.  They are practically in my backyard!   Thanks for the good tip on combating impulse buy   ;D                                                                                                                                                                     
----------------------------------------------------
77 CB550K (PD46a)
04 CBR600F4i
05 FZ600
----------------------------------------------------