Topic: 2014 Rally/Relay

[seanbarney41]

Absolutely.  So we should get planning as 2014 is going to swing into high gear fairly soon.  Have we decided yet on the structure?  Seems like we have a few options
1) Central location and we all descend for one big meet up
2) 3 GZ's traveling around in different areas of the country to either remain separate OR all meet up in a central location
3) Retain the current West to East or East to West route with the 4th GZ and develop a route, time table, participants (as we have for the prior 3 relays)
4) Turn GZ into a library book and have people "check him out" across the country to travel around with him (are we ever going to have a girl GZ? just wondering  ).  The local meet up idea would be this one I am guessing.

Did I miss any options?

Again, please consider this idea, especially for the relay rally...Change the rule that says only a CB Honda can take the mascot, to where only a forum member can take the mascot.

It'll be a good way to recoup some of the numbers of riders we lost from 2011 to 2012.  There's a lot of riders on the forum that own CB's, but for whatever reason don't use them for long distance trips. 

Eyedugstr, your idea is total crap.  Absolutely no reason not to ride your sohc4 anywhere...and that is the whole point of it all, right?  I could just pack up my van with clothes, tents, laptops, cell phones, food, women, etc. etc. etc. and just drive around meeting sohc4 members all while drinking coffee and smoking cigarettes in air conditioned comfort...but that doesn't really have #$%* to do with these killer old bikes, does it?

[Eydugstr]

It is a SOHC forum event, not just a relay so i would have to disagree with that..  We have nearly 15000 members, if the relay is organized like the first relay it will achieve its goal. Sometimes, unfortunately things like this only really work out well once, as everyone had a common goal to make it all work as a first, and it did, for some it may now be a case of "been there done that", it may have lost some of its shine for some, or its just not as well organized.....   Lets not cheapen it  before giving it a real good go......Just my opinion..   What do you call "long distance", just curious...?

Well...asking me what my idea of "long distance" is, takes what I said out-of-context, but since you asked, my idea of a long distance ride on a vintage bike is anywhere from 300-600 miles in a day.  The longest I've done (so far...) on a CB750 was about 250 miles (GZ 1.0), but did 750 miles (one day trip) on a Kawasaki Concours (coming from Hill City, SD, back to Kansas City, 2006 Concours Owner's Group rally).  Oh yeah, sure some people will ride ten blocks to a bar and act like it was a major journey;  Some won't consider anything under 1,000 miles worth noting.  That argument will still be going long after I've been buried.  The point I was trying to make, was that if we're more flexible with the rules concerning the rally, we might get more participants.

The main problem has always been a lack of commitment rather than a lack of planning; it's hard to plan with no committed riders, especially over long distances. Planning can, and should be started well in advance of a known schedule. People sign up at the beginning, then provide no input and sometimes go MIA, leading to numerous PM's by coordinators trying to get GZ down the road.      

Yeah, definitely can understand where you're coming from, was more involved in GZ 1.0 and saw some of what you're talking about...but you know what? That's always going to happen.  Show me a well laid plan and I'll show you ten goofs, a boss, and a weather forecaster that will mess it up every time.  A set schedule ahead of time would help a lot, I think.  The problem that I ran into this year, was the workplace at my new job requires me to submit my requested vacation dates in late Febuarury or early March, along with about 400+ other workers, and it's determined by seniority whether you can get it.  I can't be the only forum member in this situation!!  Didn't know until mid July when GZ was coming through, even then it was sketchy at best.

[seanbarney41]

so what does that have to do with being allowed to ride a modern touring bike on the relay?

[Eydugstr]

Eyedugstr, your idea is total crap.  Absolutely no reason not to ride your sohc4 anywhere...and that is the whole point of it all, right?  I could just pack up my van with clothes, tents, laptops, cell phones, food, women, etc. etc. etc. and just drive around meeting sohc4 members all while drinking coffee and smoking cigarettes in air conditioned comfort...but that doesn't really have #$%* to do with these killer old bikes, does it?

Who said anything about taking a tour bus?  Let me clarify :  All I'm saying is this, let SOHC/4 forum members ride other bikes and take the mascot, other than CB's.  Some people might not want to risk their prize restored CB's, or their CB's might not be in trip-worthy shape, but their other bikes are.  Just sayin'. 

so what does that have to do with being allowed to ride a modern touring bike on the relay?

 

Actually you're trying to jump on me from a response meant for Scottly.  The idea is that it might get more people involved in the relay, so that fewer people get stuck trying to do it all.  But if it's truly that awful of an idea, then just drop it and go on.  Have a nice day.

[seanbarney41]

all I am really saying 'Dugstr, is I don't see any point in having tons of participation if it's not on an SOHC4.  Other bikes have been welcomed and encouraged to ride along from the get go.  You want a relay of whatever bike?...Facebook.com will get you more than sorted.  My cb750 is my daily transportation as well as my hobby for about 7 months of the year to the tune 12-20,000 miles a year and it's maintenance costs are less than my '95 chevy van, which I put less mileage on...If you don't want to ride your restored bike, or you are not confident about it's dependability, fine...no guts, no glory.

[Eydugstr]

all I am really saying 'Dugstr, is I don't see any point in having tons of participation if it's not on an SOHC4.  Other bikes have been welcomed and encouraged to ride along from the get go.  You want a relay of whatever bike?...Facebook.com will get you more than sorted.  My cb750 is my daily transportation as well as my hobby for about 7 months of the year to the tune 12-20,000 miles a year and it's maintenance costs are less than my '95 chevy van, which I put less mileage on...If you don't want to ride your restored bike, or you are not confident about it's dependability, fine...no guts, no glory.

It's great that you use your CB750 for daily transportation, but is that the case for everybody?!?  And how is changing the rule for who gets to carry the mascot going to turn it into a "whatever bike" rally when the whole thing is ran from a SOHC/4 forum?  Obviously if there's an CB honda there, let the mascot ride with the CB Honda.  If anything it'll help get GZ from point A to point B without messing up people's vacation plans/work schedules etc, etc, in areas where there are fewer riders.  There's still going to be plenty of CB hondas buzzing around.  If you hit people with the mantra of "no guts, no glory..." then don't be surprised if they hit you with the silent response of no participation.  And considering how numbers dropped from 336 to 134 then to 107, it might be a good idea to at least poll other options.

[Retro Rocket]

My comment about distances wasn't meant to be sarcastic mate, some people think 100 miles is a huge ride, i was just curious. I've , in the past, done 700-800 mile days on a number of occasions on a 750/4, these bikes eat up the miles and love it... I keep any bike i own well maintained and wouldn't think twice about doing the same thing now on one either....   I plan on riding one of my 750's to Phillip Island when its built for the motoGP, thats close to 2000, I have friends that do that every year....

[dave the welder]

back on the 12th BankerDanny suggested asking other groups(NGW)to join.there is another web site/forum for 750 Hondas called HONDACHOPPER.COM.these guys live and breathe SOHC750.in 2011 we had a group of Denvers Choppers ride with us.i go to both of these  forums almost daily.and I would think some of them would join.no in my defense I never mentioned anything about this years rally because the dates were so vague plus they have severaj get togethers around the country every year.maybe next year we should invite them to take Godzilla to some of there events.

[Mooshie]

Okay fellows lets all go to our happy place  .  I think this has been debated in past rally's as well (though maybe not as passionately) I like the idea the way it is:  SOHC-4's carry GZ and any other bike that wants to ride along is more than welcome.
How about if we start deciding the format for the 2014 ride?  Many choices and ways to go with all of this. 
Seems Scott threw out Southern Utah as an option for a meet up?
Who has other ideas?  Can someone get a poll going?  Is that easy to set up (I guess I could stop being lazy and do it myself!)

[RAFster122s]

Weather is going to be an issue for any year, especially when GZ is primarily moving on weekends. Just a fact of life we have to deal with...with rain comes slower speeds on bikes as well as more risk riding. Many riders won't ride in rain on purpose for these and other reasons.

Option 2 has merit because it can give more room for the GZs to have a slower pace moving through their assigned regions on a predetermined schedule. The loitering time GZ will have will be greater or the time for more photo-ops and regional activities would be increased. For areas with more riders GZ could get passed around amongst them. Fewer riders less coordination needed.
The idea of them GZs converging for a big meet could be coordinated or it could be a Western meet in southern Utah and a Eastern meet somewhere east of the Mississippi during the summer when school is not in session most places. (Folks with kids often have less free time once the kids are back in school...)
Utah would be a long haul for anyone living in the Eastern US or Canada.
Running 4 GZs next year could be done if there are enough coordinators stepping up.
There could even be a meet up of Western and Eastern US and a separate meet where they both join in the "middle" so to speak. That could give more options.

I hope to be able to support or ride in the 2014 event(s) whichever form it takes.

David

[Mooshie]

[TwoTired]

I'll say up front, that I believe a tour or ride organized though this forum should involve at least one SOHC4.  The mascot should be carried on a bike falling under this forum's namesake.  That's my opinion/vote.  I don't see the point, otherwise.
I'll inject here that I think if you participate in the tour group with an SOHC4, you should get to actually carry the mascot for some portion of the tour.  The mascot carrier should don the responsibility for seeing to it that a non-carrier get his or her chance.
If you are just going to ride along with a designated SOHC4 mascot carrier, what does it matter if you show up on the ride with an SOHC4?
Perhaps a goal should be how many different bikes carry the mascot?  Just a thought.

Viewpoint on the GZ tour experience related to the decline of participation:
I participated in the first GZ tour.  I had some fun, and it was overall positive, and the guys were all great to be around... had laughs   The riding was much more aggressive than I had anticipated, though.

I would have participated in the second tour if my arthritic hips would have cooperated.  It was greatly aggravated by the Corbin seat I was testing leading up to that ride.  The pain comes and goes, some rides it's ok, on others I can't get off the bike fast enough to walk around and get the pain to subside.  Anyway, I was relegated to at-the-moment availability, and an unreliable participant.  Plans were made without me, which is perfectly understandable, schedules to meet and all that.  I didn't want to wet blanket the activity with invalidic concerns.  Maybe next year...

2013 saw the same (core) riders in my area heading the organization tour.  (This is not a complaint, only observation.)   Initially, I wanted to participate.  But, then realized that the "ride leader" was forming to be the same as who set the riding pace in the first tour, which was pretty aggressive.  20 years ago I would have reveled in such a ride.  I can still ride pretty fast if I need to.  But, I just don't need to.  And, I rather enjoy looking about where I travel as opposed to just the tarmac my tires will encounter ahead of me 100% of the time.   I certainly won't add risk or race on unfamiliar roads with unknown surface conditions.  Now, I have no intention or desire for disparaging anyone else's riding style.  But, to share the fun, means it should be fun for those that are sharing.  If my hips would cooperate, I was mentally ready for a 600-800 mile tour over 2-3 days.  But, my interest evaporated at the prospect of a 600-800 mile race over 2-3 days.  And, I have no desire to be a rapid package deliverer.  I withdrew, as it became clear I would just slow down, probably frustrate, the other riders interested, and kill their fun.

I can't say why others would decline participation.  This is just one viewpoint and explanation.

For 2014 I ask, how would/could it be different?  Do all group rides necessarily turn into road races?   It seems that almost every group ride I've been on does.  BTDT   Perhaps I'm just too old and worn out to be included.

Carry on...

[Stev-o]

A single meeting place such as Utah will not draw a large number of SOHC riders. Doubt Wilbur from FL would be up for it and I simply cannot devote a week to such a trip.
Don't get me wrong, it's a great idea and would be very cool if we could pull it off but I don't see it.

Regional meets make more sense to me. FL/GA, Mid E Coast, TX Hill Country, AZ, CA etc, are just quick examples.  I feel we would have good turnouts if a date for each of these meets was posted at least 2 months prior. 

Hey Sean - your van loaded with girls booze and smoke sounds like a fun time!

[madmtnmotors]

Viewpoint on the GZ tour experience related to the decline of participation:
I participated in the first GZ tour.  I had some fun, and it was overall positive, and the guys were all great to be around... had laughs   The riding was much more aggressive than I had anticipated, though.


2013 saw the same (core) riders in my area heading the organization tour.  (This is not a complaint, only observation.)   Initially, I wanted to participate.  But, then realized that the "ride leader" was forming to be the same as who set the riding pace in the first tour, which was pretty aggressive.

I certainly won't add risk or race on unfamiliar roads with unknown surface conditions.  Now, I have no intention or desire for disparaging anyone else's riding style.  But, to share the fun, means it should be fun for those that are sharing.  If my hips would cooperate, I was mentally ready for a 600-800 mile tour over 2-3 days.  But, my interest evaporated at the prospect of a 600-800 mile race over 2-3 days.  And, I have no desire to be a rapid package deliverer.  I withdrew, as it became clear I would just slow down, probably frustrate, the other riders interested, and kill their fun.

I can't say why others would decline participation.  This is just one viewpoint and explanation.

For 2014 I ask, how would/could it be different?  Do all group rides necessarily turn into road races?   It seems that almost every group ride I've been on does.  BTDT   Perhaps I'm just too old and worn out to be included.

Carry on...

Well put. I was acutely aware of the "pressure" from the beginning of the first relay, which happens to be a direct result of the mathematics involved. With one "baton" forming an unbroken chain, trying to cover all 50 states (and most Canadian provinces) limits the amount of time for languishing in any one area. I tried to provide a visual aid for 2013 by arranging circles on the map that were 350 miles in diameter, which seemed a reasonable traverse, and it still took 24 of these "circular regions" to cover all 50 states.

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=101662.0

Based on the limited riding season in many areas we are limited to probably 8 months maximum (32 weeks). Subtract four weeks for inclement weather and we're down to 28 weeks to cover these 24 circular regions. That's pretty much 350 miles every week, and if a rider starts at one edge and carries the baton to the far edge of that same region, then has to drive back, there's a 700 mile trip with only one week to pull it off. Life and responsibilities (work) usually limit this to weekend days, so there you have it: 700 miles every two days.

Not pretty. 

I had suggested running two concurrent relays, maybe one West and one East, with a common finish line. This method would effectively DOUBLE the amount of time devoted to each region. Alas, most of the feedback received was not in favor of this, with some of the complaints being "That's not in the true spirit of this relay" or "I can barely keep up with one relay, how can I keep up with two?". This complaint made me smile, because each member would only have to follow the particular relay that they planned to participate in based on their location. Following along with the "sister" relay would be just for kicks...

We can easily press enough batons into service to run two relays with "Lefty" and "Pimpzilla", and we even have "Contingency 'Zilla" that we could use to run three concurrent relays (one for or overseas members?). I think "Righty" (from the first relay) has earned a permanent spot on Jerry's mantle, and "right"fully so, seeing as how he put forth a monumental effort that has yet to be repeated.

I think a split relay has some real merit. To relax the pace by doubling the amount of time available for EVERY area involved, I kind of thought was a no brainer, even way back when it was first presented.

[Tripps]

I think the idea of regional meets is a good one. I didn't even know this thread existed til Becken told me today. I had fun the first year, I had the time, went out to Ohio, then up through Ontario to Michigan. I'll be honest, this year moving him was more of a chore/burden, not to be negative or anything, but I am busy with work this year, and the uncertainty made it impossible for me to plan anything, and the lack of any participation in my area devolved it into just running miles of slab alone to move him on. Not being a killjoy, but a different format is needed. On the plus side, I got to meet Larecords and Becken, so I made 2 new friends.

[MoMo]

I think one reason interest has waned is the Rally is held too frequently.  It seems that once it is completed only a short time passes and it begins anew.  Maybe every other year would heighten the anticipation.

I do like bankerdanny's idea of shipping GZ to events where sohc riders would meet....Larry

[mjstone]

I'll say up front, that I believe a tour or ride organized though this forum should involve at least one SOHC4.  The mascot should be carried on a bike falling under this forum's namesake.  That's my opinion/vote.  I don't see the point, otherwise.
I'll inject here that I think if you participate in the tour group with an SOHC4, you should get to actually carry the mascot for some portion of the tour.  The mascot carrier should don the responsibility for seeing to it that a non-carrier get his or her chance.
If you are just going to ride along with a designated SOHC4 mascot carrier, what does it matter if you show up on the ride with an SOHC4?
Perhaps a goal should be how many different bikes carry the mascot?  Just a thought.

Viewpoint on the GZ tour experience related to the decline of participation:
I participated in the first GZ tour.  I had some fun, and it was overall positive, and the guys were all great to be around... had laughs   The riding was much more aggressive than I had anticipated, though.

I would have participated in the second tour if my arthritic hips would have cooperated.  It was greatly aggravated by the Corbin seat I was testing leading up to that ride.  The pain comes and goes, some rides it's ok, on others I can't get off the bike fast enough to walk around and get the pain to subside.  Anyway, I was relegated to at-the-moment availability, and an unreliable participant.  Plans were made without me, which is perfectly understandable, schedules to meet and all that.  I didn't want to wet blanket the activity with invalidic concerns.  Maybe next year...

2013 saw the same (core) riders in my area heading the organization tour.  (This is not a complaint, only observation.)   Initially, I wanted to participate.  But, then realized that the "ride leader" was forming to be the same as who set the riding pace in the first tour, which was pretty aggressive.  20 years ago I would have reveled in such a ride.  I can still ride pretty fast if I need to.  But, I just don't need to.  And, I rather enjoy looking about where I travel as opposed to just the tarmac my tires will encounter ahead of me 100% of the time.   I certainly won't add risk or race on unfamiliar roads with unknown surface conditions.  Now, I have no intention or desire for disparaging anyone else's riding style.  But, to share the fun, means it should be fun for those that are sharing.  If my hips would cooperate, I was mentally ready for a 600-800 mile tour over 2-3 days.  But, my interest evaporated at the prospect of a 600-800 mile race over 2-3 days.  And, I have no desire to be a rapid package deliverer.  I withdrew, as it became clear I would just slow down, probably frustrate, the other riders interested, and kill their fun.

I can't say why others would decline participation.  This is just one viewpoint and explanation.

For 2014 I ask, how would/could it be different?  Do all group rides necessarily turn into road races?   It seems that almost every group ride I've been on does.  BTDT   Perhaps I'm just too old and worn out to be included.

Carry on...

I agree!  I don't mind the miles at all, but I don't like turning it into a race to get there.  I prefer riding no faster than the speed limit.  My occupation, bus driver, depends on my license and I will not risk it.  Besides it is nice to see a bit of the scenery.

MJ

[madmtnmotors]

I do like bankerdanny's idea of shipping GZ to events where sohc riders would meet....Larry

To take my "musings" one more level....what about a "baton" for each region? The regions (or teams) could revert to their original (2011) definition, or new ones could be defined (most likely). The original spirit was to "get out and meet fellow members" which I think has succeeded immensely. I know, and have met, more members than I might have otherwise, some from across the country, and one from "across the pond"! A regional "baton" could be passed around by regional members for regional events and relay related topics could be organized in their own regional headings. Regional Headings could even have their own regional moderators further "spreading the load" so that most of the coordinating efforts don't get heaped on just a few individuals. Special events could be organized from there, and regional batons could even converge for one big annual "party". 

Lefty could be the mascot for the Southeast, with "Pimpzilla" serving as mascot for the West. Each region could customize theirs as they saw fit, maybe sporting a small, miniature crankshaft (Cranky?), or have one permanently attached to its own scale model CB Honda, etc. Mock kidnappings of a neighboring Team's baton would not be out of the question.... 

Keep the ideas coming!

[scottly]

I'm going to start a new topic and avoid cluttering up the team threads with this.

I commented on one thread a couple weeks back that this year's ride has been like herding cats.  V 1.0 was amazing in how it just came together.

V 1.0 had some serious problems in a couple of areas. If not for several high-mileage Heroes, GZ would never have made it.
A change in format has been suggested before, and more than once...
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=96790.0
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=117016.0

[scottly]

One advantage to having multiple meet-up points is that it makes scheduling easier, but the disadvantage is greater distances must be covered by each rider to get to the meet-up point. This also makes it a series of rallies, instead of a relay.
The advantage of the linear relay format that has been used the last three years is that more riders have been able to participate without having to commit to serious miles, at least in some cases.

[scottly]

Do all group rides necessarily turn into road races?   It seems that almost every group ride I've been on does.

That hasn't been my experience on the relay..

[RAFster122s]

One advantage to having multiple meet-up points is that it makes scheduling easier, but the disadvantage is greater distances must be covered by each rider to get to the meet-up point. This also makes it a series of rallies, instead of a relay.
The advantage of the linear relay format that has been used the last three years is that more riders have been able to participate without having to commit to serious miles, at least in some cases.

It could be a combination event...sometimes it would be nice to get to know other SOHC/4 owners who live nearby, someone you could possibly meet to ride with from time to time. The relay or rally can serve to do both.
Keeping the pace slower and allowing time to get to know others is part of the experience. Nothing says you can't trade GZ at a rally or relay them a different path.
Given the limited riding season in most of the country you don't have to make it a once a year blast through the country. The members of radio controlled aircraft modelling group in the US, AMA, set forth on a PR campaign to relay a small trainer across the US and have the aircraft flown all over the country. It was started in 2008 and was flow by something like 1000 flights and over 811 pilots in 48 states and it was far more subject to weather and coordination issues because it could only be flown in winds below 15 mph and ideally below 10mph and not in the rain. The Steven Aero Squirt 400 survived the endeavor and it took a little over 5 years to make the circuit and will be put on display in the national AMA museum in Muncie. They sought out media attention for the event as it made its way across the US and they got it.

[scottly]

It could be a combination event...sometimes it would be nice to get to know other SOHC/4 owners who live nearby,

True, but in my case, the nearest riders have always been 90-100 miles away.
To do a regional meetup in Utah would require a 3-4 day commitment from each rider: at least a full day to get there, a day to enjoy riding around and seeing the scenery, and a day to get home.   

[artsqu]

Great job with the poll form Mooshie.

Additionally I am also interested in the 2014 ride to Lebannon, Mo.

I will be watching the postings for future details.

[Bankerdanny]

Nice poll. I'm going to think on it a bit before I choose though.