Author Topic: Gasoline Question?  (Read 11393 times)

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Offline RainsongCB750F

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Gasoline Question?
« on: August 21, 2013, 12:26:35 PM »
a thought just occurred to me chaps. Does anyone use any other gas besides the lowest octane rating at the pump for their cb750s?
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2013, 12:39:42 PM »
a thought just occurred to me chaps. Does anyone use any other gas besides the lowest octane rating at the pump for their cb750s?

Oh yes.  The testimonials abound.  Though there is little scientific justification.

But, if you lay the entrails of a goat on your instruments at moonrise...and toss six grains of salt over your left shoulder facing east, and BELIEVE, you'll definitely notice a difference!
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline Schnell

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2013, 12:41:36 PM »
I use regular gas, but I do know that it may contain a small percentage of ethanol, which the super gas does not. Ethanol is not so good for rubber parts.
A good traveller has no fixed plans and is not intent on arriving. --Lao Tsu

primary: 1974 Honda CB750
long term, now resting: 1981 BMW R100/7
project: 1971 Honda CL350
project: 1974 Honda CB450

previous:
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1973 BMW R90/6
1981 Suzuki GS650
1973 Honda CD175

My little website: http://frankfoto.jimdo.com/

Offline RainsongCB750F

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2013, 12:53:42 PM »
a thought just occurred to me chaps. Does anyone use any other gas besides the lowest octane rating at the pump for their cb750s?

Oh yes.  The testimonials abound.  Though there is little scientific justification.

But, if you lay the entrails of a goat on your instruments at moonrise...and toss six grains of salt over your left shoulder facing east, and BELIEVE, you'll definitely notice a difference!

two tired, you crack me up! Youre the man
1978 CB750F
When Jesus comes back he will ride an SOHC4.

Offline acollin

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2013, 01:26:29 PM »
I switched this summer to non ethanol with an octane rating of over 90-- maybe 92 or 94. The effect was immediate and substantial. Throttle response was radically different and got better as the older gas worked its way through the system. The man who repaired my chain saw recommended I try it and said to never put the ethanol fuel in the chain saw.

Also another word on the ethanol fuel and rubber pieces. All you have to do is drop a float bowl and take a look. Fragments of rubber-- little bits of fuel line. I am fortunate to live just afew miles away from a station that sells high octane non ethanol. Not cheap about $4.70 a gallon.

Offline RainsongCB750F

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2013, 01:34:07 PM »
I switched this summer to non ethanol with an octane rating of over 90-- maybe 92 or 94. The effect was immediate and substantial. Throttle response was radically different and got better as the older gas worked its way through the system. The man who repaired my chain saw recommended I try it and said to never put the ethanol fuel in the chain saw.

Also another word on the ethanol fuel and rubber pieces. All you have to do is drop a float bowl and take a look. Fragments of rubber-- little bits of fuel line. I am fortunate to live just afew miles away from a station that sells high octane non ethanol. Not cheap about $4.70 a gallon.

Thats awesome! So does high octane gas mean it contains no ethanol?
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Offline Duanob

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2013, 01:41:25 PM »
I switched this summer to non ethanol with an octane rating of over 90-- maybe 92 or 94. The effect was immediate and substantial. Throttle response was radically different and got better as the older gas worked its way through the system. The man who repaired my chain saw recommended I try it and said to never put the ethanol fuel in the chain saw.

Also another word on the ethanol fuel and rubber pieces. All you have to do is drop a float bowl and take a look. Fragments of rubber-- little bits of fuel line. I am fortunate to live just afew miles away from a station that sells high octane non ethanol. Not cheap about $4.70 a gallon.

Funny I've never found anything made of rubber in my float bowls. I use regualr pump gas. Now ask me about sediment and find sand particles....
"Just because you flush a boatload of money down the toilet, doesn't make the toilet worth more",  My Stepfather the Unknown Poet

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Offline Xnavylfr

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2013, 02:39:02 PM »
NO!! Hi-OCTANE does NOT mean it is ethanol free!!  You'll have to search for ethanol free gas. Check the pumps, if it say's contains 10% or greater ethanol that means all grades.


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« Last Edit: August 21, 2013, 02:41:18 PM by Xnavylfr »

Offline Schnell

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2013, 02:55:42 PM »
In my area in Canada at the gas stations i stop at, ethanol is in only In the lower grades of gas, not in the highest grade.
A good traveller has no fixed plans and is not intent on arriving. --Lao Tsu

primary: 1974 Honda CB750
long term, now resting: 1981 BMW R100/7
project: 1971 Honda CL350
project: 1974 Honda CB450

previous:
1975 Honda CB750
1973 BMW R90/6
1981 Suzuki GS650
1973 Honda CD175

My little website: http://frankfoto.jimdo.com/

Offline crazypj

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2013, 03:03:42 PM »
I don't remember where I read it but 10% ethanol gives a 5~6% lean mixture so non-ethanol should give a slightly richer mixture and better performance
The octane rating will be as stated, there is no advantage using higher octane, plus, unless motor is modified, you may loose performance and could cause engine/valve damage if fuel is still burning when exhaust valve opens
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Offline acollin

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #10 on: August 21, 2013, 06:04:28 PM »
I should have taken a picture of that rubber residue in my float bowls. Without question-- a fine black rubbery granule.


I've been told that if you live near a small airport, you can buy aviation fuel that does not contain ethanol.

Anyone try aviation grade fuel?

Offline Gordon

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #11 on: August 21, 2013, 06:53:36 PM »
I should have taken a picture of that rubber residue in my float bowls. Without question-- a fine black rubbery granule.


Definitely sounds like dissolving fuel line rubber, but that's more of an issue of just old fuel line that needs to be replaced.  That will eventually happen no matter what type of fuel you're using.  I don't even have non-ethanol gas available anywhere near me and I've never had fuel line problems because of it. 

Offline Xnavylfr

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #12 on: August 21, 2013, 08:27:36 PM »
HERE for GORDON!!!  http://www.buyrealgas.com/Texas.html


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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #13 on: August 21, 2013, 09:07:13 PM »
I switched this summer to non ethanol with an octane rating of over 90-- maybe 92 or 94. The effect was immediate and substantial. Throttle response was radically different and got better as the older gas worked its way through the system. The man who repaired my chain saw recommended I try it and said to never put the ethanol fuel in the chain saw.

Also another word on the ethanol fuel and rubber pieces. All you have to do is drop a float bowl and take a look. Fragments of rubber-- little bits of fuel line. I am fortunate to live just afew miles away from a station that sells high octane non ethanol. Not cheap about $4.70 a gallon.

Funny I've never found anything made of rubber in my float bowls. I use regualr pump gas. Now ask me about sediment and find sand particles....

Well, let's see...

There's the rubber bowl seal, an O-ring on the 550, that swells to +4mm when this ethanol soaks it as anyone who has removed one when wetted has discovered. After drying out for an hour, they shrink back to size. In both excursions, they leak a little bit.

The tiny rubber O-ring that holds the mainjet in place on the 500/550/400F/350F carbs: when they swell from the ethanol, they leak a little more fuel thru the middle groove of the mainjet. This causes the smaller 400F/350F bikes to act rich when hot, causing them to not want to rev up like they should.

On the post-1975 750F bikes (PD carbs), there is the tiny rubber O-ring in the pilot jet's hole, which swells with ethanol and then cracks after the ethanol has removed its elasticity. Then the bike won't idle on that cylinder.

The fuel tees of the 750 pre-1975 carbs have 8 O-rings (only 4 on the K0) that try to prevent leaks, but don't after the ethanol has made them hard: about 2-3 years.

Those same 750 float bowls are sealed with a flat rubber gasket, some of which recently have dissolved when ethanol soaks them (see last year's posts). Most of these are gone now, thankfully...

The OEM rubber fuel hoses in the coveted 5.5mm size, without the red (or yellow) stripe on their sides, shrink about 0.75mm ID on average after 2 years passing ethanol. This makes them brittle, and usually leak. The 5.0mm hoses shrink slightly less, but become so stiff that they will not let go of their spigots when removed, and are known for pulling them right out of the carb bodies and petcocks if not cut off with a sharp blade.

Then the is the total loss of lube to the top piston rings and valve guides that is caused by the detergent of the ethanol, but that's not a carb... :(

Ethanol is nasty stuff in these bikes.
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Offline Gordon

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #14 on: August 21, 2013, 10:21:46 PM »
HERE for GORDON!!!  http://www.buyrealgas.com/Texas.html


Xnavylfr(CHUCK)

The closest place to me is 45 miles away in Greenville, so it would cost about 2 gallons of gas for the round trip.  I did actually ride out to check out the place about two years ago, but ended up not filling up my tank there.  After checking the place out I decided I'd take my chances on sticking with the e10 from my corner store rather than put what they have in their tanks into my beloved bike.  It was not a pretty sight.   

Offline Schnell

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2013, 06:28:52 AM »

[/quote]

After checking the place out I decided I'd take my chances on sticking with the e10 from my corner store rather than put what they have in their tanks into my beloved bike.  It was not a pretty sight.
[/quote]

Yet it goes into those heavier than air flying machine fuel tanks. Scary thought.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2013, 06:31:38 AM by Schnell »
A good traveller has no fixed plans and is not intent on arriving. --Lao Tsu

primary: 1974 Honda CB750
long term, now resting: 1981 BMW R100/7
project: 1971 Honda CL350
project: 1974 Honda CB450

previous:
1975 Honda CB750
1973 BMW R90/6
1981 Suzuki GS650
1973 Honda CD175

My little website: http://frankfoto.jimdo.com/

Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #16 on: August 22, 2013, 07:03:26 AM »
a thought just occurred to me chaps. Does anyone use any other gas besides the lowest octane rating at the pump for their cb750s?

Oh yes.  The testimonials abound.  Though there is little scientific justification.

But, if you lay the entrails of a goat on your instruments at moonrise...and toss six grains of salt over your left shoulder facing east, and BELIEVE, you'll definitely notice a difference!

lol isnt that a bible passage?
1968 Honda Z50
1977 Honda CB550K
2018 Indian Scout

Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #17 on: August 22, 2013, 07:05:01 AM »
As per previous threads and hondamans advice, I run plain jane old regular 87? octane which contains 10% ethanol and I just add about an ounce of redline synthetic 2 stroke oil.
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Offline 70CB750

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #18 on: August 22, 2013, 07:15:27 AM »
+1 on adding oil to the gas on every fill.

I go out of my way to fill on pure gas, you can check your state here:

http://pure-gas.org/

Now the real question - what oil do you run?  ;D ;D ;D
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Offline Mo

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #19 on: August 22, 2013, 08:57:25 AM »
Can someone just inform me very quickly, as I am completely ignorant on the matter.

Since ethanol is very bad to the rubber seals on these bikes, and since as far as I know, newer cars still have rubber parts that come into contact with gas,why isnt that same "newer" rubber being used on these bikes (seal kits, etc)?

Offline Muckinfuss

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #20 on: August 22, 2013, 09:23:35 AM »
People've been using rubber hoses in their stills for a couple-three of centuries without any problems from the 100% ethanol running through 'em.  Done it myself and never found any bits and pieces in the end product.
Ethanol was put in gasoline starting in the '20's (and still is) to increase octane ratings.  No ethanol related crashes reported that I'm aware of.  Varnish will happen with pure gasoline, so that's a non starter argument.  Ethanol is a solvent that actually keeps stuff clean.  Every, and I mean every fuel injector cleaning product at Autozone or any other parts store.....mostly ethanol.
Ran in airplane engines of all types.....through WW2 even.  No ethanol related crashes reported here either, that I'm aware of.
93 octane is 93 octane, no matter how it's obtained.  87 is 87.  and so on and so on.
  And yet if you put it into your motorcycle all hell breaks out.  How can that be?
I swear, there is more voodoo about gas, oil and auto parts store snake oil additives.
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Offline goldarrow

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #21 on: August 22, 2013, 09:45:58 AM »
+1 on adding oil to the gas on every fill.

I go out of my way to fill on pure gas, you can check your state here:

http://pure-gas.org/

Now the real question - what oil do you run?  ;D ;D ;D


Just quickly looked at the stations map in the website.  I guess if you're in California, you're pretty much SOL as only 5 stations listed in the northern part of CA.   And I suppose I'm polluting my bikes with these ethanol. 
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Offline 70CB750

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #22 on: August 22, 2013, 09:49:22 AM »
Very similar in Northern Virginia.  We are close to the center of wisdom - a.k.a. DC - further you go from Washington, more likely you will find pure gas.
Prokop
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Pure Gas - find ethanol free gas station near you

I love it when parts come together.

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CB750K3F - The Red
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #23 on: August 22, 2013, 09:52:01 AM »
People've been using rubber hoses in their stills for a couple-three of centuries without any problems from the 100% ethanol running through 'em.  Done it myself and never found any bits and pieces in the end product.
Ethanol was put in gasoline starting in the '20's (and still is) to increase octane ratings.  No ethanol related crashes reported that I'm aware of.  Varnish will happen with pure gasoline, so that's a non starter argument.  Ethanol is a solvent that actually keeps stuff clean.  Every, and I mean every fuel injector cleaning product at Autozone or any other parts store.....mostly ethanol.
Ran in airplane engines of all types.....through WW2 even.  No ethanol related crashes reported here either, that I'm aware of.
93 octane is 93 octane, no matter how it's obtained.  87 is 87.  and so on and so on.
  And yet if you put it into your motorcycle all hell breaks out.  How can that be?
I swear, there is more voodoo about gas, oil and auto parts store snake oil additives.
Agreed. I run the 2 stroke oil mainly as an added lubricator. It never hurts to run a fuel additive. Indeed if you read any octane booster the first ingredient is methanol, which is why I primarily use MMO, Lucas, or the aforementioned redline syn oil no methanol here.
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Offline David B

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Re: Gasoline Question?
« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2013, 04:43:00 PM »
I've been happy with Startron to offset the ethanol in both my bikes. My triumph Tiger (1050 liquid cooled triple) knocks/pings even with 93 octane without it.   My CB750 seems happiest with 87 octane.

How much 2 stroke oil are you guys adding? 
DB