Author Topic: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Rebuilt to NEW OLD STOCK -- PIX ON PAGE 50  (Read 277874 times)

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Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #825 on: April 01, 2015, 09:21:46 PM »
Installed the last of the SKFs for this build. Oil pump and starter motor are the only excuses I have left to dally engine assembly. Can't seem to shake off this nervousness  >:( >:(
Uh, starter motor is no excuse, get to work! 8) what's the worst that can happen, a small leak?? ;D ;D
;D ;D

Don't have all the parts for the starter, so put the oil pump back together (short on time too during the work week).

The impellers: I have a near NOS oil pump I bought from Bill with immaculate impellers, saving that for the 836 K3. The K2's original pump was in good shape, but the impellers and the end caps both had a bit of scarring. They were deemed adequate for a stocker, but I wasn't quite happy with them. So I bought me a set of barely used impellers and end caps with very very little wear from Godffrey.

Outer two impellers are new(er), left two end caps are new(er).

The seals: Elan's super kit + bypass valve spring and a NOS oil screen I chased down a year ago took care of it all.

The rest: I had to drill out a screw or two, can't remember so got new replacements.


« Last Edit: April 01, 2015, 09:32:34 PM by edwardmorris »

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #826 on: April 01, 2015, 09:28:56 PM »
The metal walled seal is a very snug fit and the shaft goes through it a bit tight. I lubed things up with the same mineral oil and everything went in buttery smooooooooooth. After I put that section together, I noticed that the gear pulls out a bit. Wasn't sure if it was supposed to do that so used the bat phone  ;D ;D ;D Then realized, I have the K3 oil pump sitting in a bag somewhere, so I went and checked it out, that one pulls out the same length so moved along.

Put it all together AND THEN, IT HAPPENED!! I conquered my fear of torquing schit  ;D ;D ;D JIS bit from my Heavy Duty impact driver fits perfectly in an 8mm socket (Thanks Gordon). Dean's vid series was a great help too. Will prime it the night before putting the cases together.

Offline evanphi

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #827 on: April 02, 2015, 04:48:32 AM »
JIS bit from my Heavy Duty impact driver fits perfectly in an 8mm socket

Brilliant! Good to know...
--Evan

1975 CB750K "Rhonda"
Delkevic Stainless 4-1 Header, Cone Engineering 18" Quiet Core Reverse Cone, K&N Filter in Drilled Airbox
K5 Crankcase/Frame, K4 Head and Cylinders, K1 Carbs (42;120;1 Turn)

She's a mix-matched (former) basket case, but she's mine.

CB750 Shop Manual (all years), searchable text PDF
Calculating the correct input circumference for digital speedometers connected to the original speedometer drive

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #828 on: April 03, 2015, 09:36:18 PM »
Scheduled to work all the way until 5:00PM Monday  :( :( Had some time to get organized to close up the cases, took about 18 months but I now have every single bolt, o-ring washer and nut for the engine NOS ;D ;D

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #829 on: April 04, 2015, 02:29:37 PM »
Caught a quick break, installed  a new seal on the starter clutch, red line assembly lubed it up, tricked the damned clutch with toothpicks so I could slide the gear in place, torqued it down in three steps to 72Ft-lbs, double nutted removal of bent timing shaft. I can't remember exactly, but the starter gear only spins one way right?

Next break, cleaning gasket surfaces and thread chasing everything.

Offline Tews19

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #830 on: April 05, 2015, 08:04:42 AM »
Yes starter gear only spins one way. If it goes in either direction then you have no electric start...
1969 Honda CB750... Basket case
1970 Honda CB750 survivor.

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #831 on: April 06, 2015, 09:06:07 PM »
Got some final cleaning done, all the old hondabond is off, lower case is sitting sealed up after I thread chased every single threaded hole. Good thing I did that, turns out despite my compulsive masking when I painted them, there was still some paint that bled into one of the threaded holes where the oil hoses meet the crank. Filled it up with acetone to break it loose, then the thread chaser removed the gunk.

Finished cleaning the gasket surface on the top half, will need to do the rest next break, which is Wed at 6:00PM :o While I was cleaning out the hondabond, I noticed that these two things on both side that look like oil returns, aren't the same size. The dyno side has large holes, points side has one big and one tiny little dinky of a passage. Should I leave it be or drill it out?

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #832 on: April 06, 2015, 09:13:30 PM »
These holes varied between the different cases. There isn't any pressure on them, so if they drain, that's all it takes.
That said, sometimes I have found flash from a mold that some tech did not clean out: this often shows up in the "horror" pictures we occasionally see where someone cleaned their oil pan and found them, years later. It's usually some flash casting edge that escaped the initial sandblast treatment that was used to remove casting scale, etc., when the parts were once new. If it is flash, it will be thin enough that a good tap with a screwdriver tip will break through it: if so, then think about filing it away so it won't risk a trip through the gears someday?
See SOHC4shop.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
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Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book
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Link to website: https://sohc4shop.com/  (Note: no longer at www.SOHC4shop.com, moved off WWW. in 2024).

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #833 on: April 06, 2015, 09:21:31 PM »
Thanks Mark! I'll take a closer look and post back, it didn't seem too thin but I could be wrong...

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #834 on: April 11, 2015, 03:17:52 PM »
So the crankcase oil return casting is pretty solid, didn't knock loose with considerable tapping, so I'll leave it be. Moved on to getting stuff together to close the cases, started with the crank and connecting rods. All new bearings, bolts torqued up to 14.5ft-lbs which honestly doesn't feel too tight, but that's what the manual and Mark's book call for, so leaving it be (unless advised otherwise).

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #835 on: April 11, 2015, 07:39:44 PM »
All new clutch, pre-soaked the plates then assembled the main shaft, some ceran wrap to keep debris out.

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #836 on: April 11, 2015, 07:44:02 PM »
The crank oil drain caps got new o-rings and torqued down. Was installing the NOS primary tensioner and realized I don't have an extension for the 1/4" torque wrench, so decided to tighten it in place for now, then surprise! my trusty Carftsman set already had one  ;)

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #837 on: April 12, 2015, 11:41:27 AM »
Quick Q: Neither my K2 nor my K3 have item #15 spline washer on the clutch. Should I worry?

http://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb750k2-four-usa_model14362/partslist/E09.html#results

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #838 on: April 12, 2015, 02:25:09 PM »
Started a thread about it here, looks like cases won't be going back together today :( :( Apparently something changed with the K2 about that splined washer, but can anyone with a K1 confirm that the K1s had it? I think I've got one of the left over K1 engines so its possible mine's a K1 clutch and primary shaft. I'll dig through some pix to see if the primary shaft has a groove for it (don't recall seeing it).


Moving on, I started mocking up the trans after I finished installing the kickstart assembly. I know there's supposed to be about 1mm gap on the last two gears, but mine seems to be a tad more. Also noticed there's about 1mm or more on the shaft spline itself where the spacer goes. Is this normal or is something off? I'll try and check the gaps again with the shifter forks in place.

Offline Davez134

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #839 on: April 12, 2015, 02:27:58 PM »
I wish I could tell you what the tolerances are for movement in that last picture. I do know on mine, there was VERY little side to side after putting that clip on. Also the gap in your first picture looks fine to me, but again do not have any exact numbers to go by. Wish I could be of more help, I want you to get this thing done! ;D ;D
« Last Edit: April 12, 2015, 02:30:03 PM by Davez134 »

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #840 on: April 12, 2015, 02:45:23 PM »
I wish I could tell you what the tolerances are for movement in that last picture. I do know on mine, there was VERY little side to side after putting that clip on. Also the gap in your first picture looks fine to me, but again do not have any exact numbers to go by. Wish I could be of more help, I want you to get this thing done! ;D ;D
Me too! I have it all here, wanted to wrap up the bottom end today and the top end by mid week :(

I tried this: Once the C4 is fully engaged, there is no side to side movement and the gap between the C1 and drive gear is almost exactly 1mm. Call it good?

Offline Davez134

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #841 on: April 12, 2015, 03:24:59 PM »
That's what mine was like, shifts smooth, no resistance or noises.

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #842 on: April 12, 2015, 04:12:50 PM »
Cool, I'll leave the counter shaft as is for now, thanks!

Back to the damned clutch, I take back my earlier post, the K3 DOES have that splined washer on it. Somehow its missing on the K2, and I don't have a definitive way to confirm if it can live without it. I'll wait for Mark or Terry to swing by. It wasn't there when I tore it down, and I followed this article at the time. The article makes no mention of it either so I never bothered to check. Just saw it today on the fiche AFTER I torqued it all down and bent new tabs >:( >:( >:(

http://www.salocal.com/sohc/tech/clutch/cth4.htm

Offline jerry h

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #843 on: April 12, 2015, 06:46:55 PM »
Quote
Quick Q: Neither my K2 nor my K3 have item #15 spline washer on the clutch. Should I worry?


Digging through my old pics, mine had #15.   Don't think your clutch can live without it.   What's one more parts order... ;D



Quote
"It is not the critic who counts, the credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose hands are covered with grease and oil."

K2 http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,105097.0.html

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #844 on: April 12, 2015, 07:32:59 PM »
Quick Q: Neither my K2 nor my K3 have item #15 spline washer on the clutch. Should I worry?

http://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb750k2-four-usa_model14362/partslist/E09.html#results

Hmm...interesting. That's a drawing of the K0-K1 clutch.
More of the K2 engines came with this clutch (now being called the "K3" version, for whatever reason) than with the K1 type.
http://www.hondaparts-direct.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=2560020&category=Motorcycles&make=Honda&year=1973&fveh=132837
(Hint: click on the "PRINT" instruction for a full-page view.)
The splined washer is the spacing for the basket vs. hub.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2015, 06:12:02 AM by HondaMan »
See SOHC4shop.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
Hondaman's creed: "Bikers are family. Treat them accordingly."

Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book
Link to My CB500/CB550 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?sortBy=RELEVANCE&page=1&q=my+cb550+book&pageSize=10&adult_audience_rating=00
Link to website: https://sohc4shop.com/  (Note: no longer at www.SOHC4shop.com, moved off WWW. in 2024).

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #845 on: April 12, 2015, 08:08:02 PM »
Jerry! Glad your still subscribed! Yep, looks like I'll need one, thanks Mark, for confirming as well!

Got some lead on a replacement, but if I make time before it arrives, I'll redo the clutch basket using the one from my K3. Since things have been delayed a bit, went ahead and ordered some F2 connecting rod bolts and nuts as well. The old ones went on fine but just didn't "feel" right (hard to explain). Work's been killing me with scheduling all over the place, so I think I'm just going to have to insist on some time off and get the engine done. Rest of the stuff shouldn't require as focused an effort (hopefully).

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #846 on: April 13, 2015, 06:17:26 AM »
Started a thread about it here, looks like cases won't be going back together today :( :( Apparently something changed with the K2 about that splined washer, but can anyone with a K1 confirm that the K1s had it? I think I've got one of the left over K1 engines so its possible mine's a K1 clutch and primary shaft. I'll dig through some pix to see if the primary shaft has a groove for it (don't recall seeing it).


Moving on, I started mocking up the trans after I finished installing the kickstart assembly. I know there's supposed to be about 1mm gap on the last two gears, but mine seems to be a tad more. Also noticed there's about 1mm or more on the shaft spline itself where the spacer goes. Is this normal or is something off? I'll try and check the gaps again with the shifter forks in place.

If that C4 and idler gear are backward (either or both) then they drag on each other. That's the clue something is awry. ;)

I've seen recently a gearbox where the splined washer AND the cupped washer were missing, poor guy. Some 'chopper shop' had [re]built his bike, they said, just before he bought it 20 years ago. He rode it for 5 years, struggling with a no-shift-if-sitting-still-or-moving-slowly scenario, thought it was normal. Parked the bike, eventually pulled the engine and sent it to me for general rebuild, as it ran poorly. When I got into it, I ended up with a whole sheet of notebook paper, single-line-ruled, one item per line, of parts missing or assembled wrong inside. Somehow it still ran!

(He sure likes it better now!)
See SOHC4shop.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
Hondaman's creed: "Bikers are family. Treat them accordingly."

Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book
Link to My CB500/CB550 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?sortBy=RELEVANCE&page=1&q=my+cb550+book&pageSize=10&adult_audience_rating=00
Link to website: https://sohc4shop.com/  (Note: no longer at www.SOHC4shop.com, moved off WWW. in 2024).

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #847 on: April 15, 2015, 08:06:56 PM »
Little time, little progress, but keeping at it. Swingarm was rebuilt by Mark, then powder coated and put away. Installed new bushings Uncle Tez style 8) 8)

BTW where is uncle Tez?

Offline edwardmorris

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #848 on: April 16, 2015, 11:40:11 AM »
SOOOOOO glad I caught this before I forced the damned 22s in this weekend, local honda guy has them, will pick em up.

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,146871.msg1672085.html#msg1672085

Offline Davez134

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Re: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Project "Ice Cream"-- SLOW ASSEMBLY
« Reply #849 on: April 16, 2015, 04:33:47 PM »
Yep, had to cut mine down.