Topic: 1972 CB750 Four K2 -- Rebuilt to NEW OLD STOCK -- PIX ON PAGE 50

[edwardmorris]

Replacement kill switch knob restored to somewhat new like color, hopefully I'll have the RHS controls back together tomorrow. Did this while waiting for the K3 carb parts were on ultrasonic cleaning cycles.

[edwardmorris]

RHS control built! Gotta love Marc's work, who would have thought? Powder Coated Lettering FTW!

Did I mention how much I LOVE my JIS drivers  ?

[Restoration Fan]

RHS control built! Gotta love Marc's work, who would have thought? Powder Coated Lettering FTW!

Did I mention how much I LOVE my JIS drivers  ?

Wait, what?  The lettering is powder coated?  We're getting ready to touch up the paint job on our LH and RH switches soon, so I'd love to hear how you got them to look so beautiful like that.

[edwardmorris]

That's Marc/Powderman's work. I'll be sending my K3 controls and Master Cyl to him as well

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=126735.msg1515401#msg1515401

[Restoration Fan]

That's Marc/Powderman's work. I'll be sending my K3 controls and Master Cyl to him as well

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=126735.msg1515401#msg1515401

Oooh, sweet.  He's just up the road from me about an hour's drive in Dawsonville, GA.  Might be worth a trip up there!

[timbo750]

I read in another thread were he said that he uses a small spoon to get the powder in the letters! Thats attention to detail and pride in your work that you just don't see very often anymore.

[edwardmorris]

Its this same thread, just a few posts below the link above. Although I'm willing to bet he makes it sound easier than it is  Got a few cool bits he'll be doing for my K3, so excited 

[edwardmorris]

Which way does this thing go on?

Option A

[edwardmorris]

Option B

I can't find any good pix at this angle, almost all are top down and I can't see which side the beveled protrusion is

[danyo]

Option A

[edwardmorris]

Might just be, I found a not so great pic in my photo journal from last Jan when I tore it down. Although now I can't say for sure if the one or both of these bearings needed to be grooved? Looks like neither had a groove, when I took it apart, but both had a snap ring?? I'll just wait for the seniority to advise before installing new SKFs.

[edwardmorris]

Also, this guy got cleaned up and received a shiny new SKF (buttery smooooooth and quiet  ). Heat gun easy install, reverse of removal.

Almost 18 months on this forum and only now I realized that this cap has oil passages in it  Held a high pressure hose on all ends to clear it out, then compressed air.

[HondaMan]

Also, this guy got cleaned up and received a shiny new SKF (buttery smooooooth and quiet  ). Heat gun easy install, reverse of removal.

Almost 18 months on this forum and only now I realized that this cap has oil passages in it  Held a high pressure hose on all ends to clear it out, then compressed air.

...and don't forget the little O-ring when reinstalling it! It can be a 1.9x5.8 or 1.9x5.9 or 2x6, whichever one you have.

[HondaMan]

Might just be, I found a not so great pic in my photo journal from last Jan when I tore it down. Although now I can't say for sure if the one or both of these bearings needed to be grooved? Looks like neither had a groove, when I took it apart, but both had a snap ring?? I'll just wait for the seniority to advise before installing new SKFs.

Usually, installing it the wrong way can make it possible for the gear teeth to graze the case. When you have the shaft with the grooved (inner) bearing, it shows up immediately, so make sure that the bearing retainer is seated to space over the bearing properly.

[edwardmorris]

Thanks Mark, I do have all NOS o-rings and seals for the entire engine so I won't miss it.

I'm still not a 100% clear on the orientation of the gear on the final drive. From my old pic it looks like Option A is the right way, anyone else concur?

Also the fiche shows grooved bearings but from what I can tell, the cases were never split before. So mine are both smooth, but with a retainer anyway, so I'll stick with non grooved replacements.

[edwardmorris]

Main shaft was next, followed usual inspection steps, installed new SKFs. 1" PVC diy driver worked like a charm. The left side bearing slides into position, then presses in.

[edwardmorris]

Primary was next, 1-1/2" PVC DIY driver. The needle rollers were pressed in by the machine shop for me. The basket/bell pressed on with the same 1-1/2" PVC.

[edwardmorris]

This was quite the adventure, and I'm glad its finally back together. If you read back a few pages, you'll find my story of how I got the SKFs and found a shop to widen the grooves for me without asking for my organs in exchange. Only the two smaller ones need widening, the large one already has the correct width.

All was going well, till I decided to put the counter shaft back together next. Started inspection, smoothed out rough splines, inspected worn dogs and remembered I bought NEAR NOS condition C2 and C5 gears from Bill Benton  All jolly I went to go fetch them and after five straight hours of ransacking the entire house, I still haven't found them  Infuriated beyond all recognition 

[Davez134]

Thanks Mark, I do have all NOS o-rings and seals for the entire engine so I won't miss it.

I'm still not a 100% clear on the orientation of the gear on the final drive. From my old pic it looks like Option A is the right way, anyone else concur?

Also the fiche shows grooved bearings but from what I can tell, the cases were never split before. So mine are both smooth, but with a retainer anyway, so I'll stick with non grooved replacements.

All I can offer is mine were grooved with retainers. Although I'm sure my cases had been split before. Reply 87 on my project shows bearings. Probably not much help but just another reference

[edwardmorris]

Thanks man, I'm wondering this is another early K2 oddity. I went back to look at the pix from the tear down, I found these two. First one shows the large retainer hangin loose when I split the cases


This is the lower case I think, and looks like all the retainer grooves are on this side. I don't see one for the inner final drive one, so mine may never have had one?

[Terry in Australia]

Here you go Rafi, this is CMSNL's schematic for a K4, but in my experience, all of the K's were pretty much the same, as were the F0/F1. There should be the "full circle" retainer outboard of the bearing on the sprocket side, and I'm pretty sure, a half circle on the other bearing, which is grooved in the pic. Cheers, Terry.

http://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb750-four-k4-usa_model482/partslist/E++21.html#results 

[edwardmorris]

Thanks Terry! I don't know what I want to write this off as, but I think I know how I'm going to proceed for now.

I found just 3 half circle retainers from when I tore down the engine, and one full one. Like Terry said, I believe the full one sits NEXT to the large bearing. The other one is definitely not grooved because there is no recess cut for a half ring in either of the cases. So either these are a terribly odd cases, or the fiche is wrong. Either way, I think it will work out fine if I put it back together using Option A above. Pix to come as soon as I'm done with it.

In the meantime, I finally found the newer C2-C5 set. Now that I've taken a closer look, they don't really look that much different when it comes to dog wear, but then again, this is my first time so what do I know. Can anyone tell if the used set is any worse? The only difference to my untrained eye is that the parkerizing has been blasted off the newer set. Its also missing an oiling hole, and the stamping is different. Thoughts? Should I reuse my old ones and save the clean set for someone else?

C2?

[edwardmorris]

C5?

[MCRider]

EM: Sorry I can't remember what your original problem was, jumping out of 2nd gear?

If so, my experience, personal and with a few otherwise, is that its not just the gear dogs that get worn. First, its the shift fork that gets worn or bent. From abusive shifting.

THEN, the dogs get worn because the fork is not moving them into full engagement. Each time they jump apart they take some metal with them, ultimately causing visual wear.

But, if you put new gears in with a worn or bent shift fork, you will soon have the same problem.  How's your shift fork?

[edwardmorris]

Hey Ron, the bike only "ran when parked" so I never rode it to see how things were. When I tore it down, I posted up close up shots of the dogs and shift forks. Couple members expressed concern over the state of the dogs for the C2-C5 combo and also the shift forks. So I purchased the "like new" ones pictured above to avoid having issues, along with a set of "like new" shifter forks to go with them. But now that I have them side by side, I only see the old shift forks being a little too worn, but the dogs look damn near identical. Again, to my untrained eye. So I was pondering what to do with the old one, especially if its no better than the replacement....