Author Topic: refreshing a 400 4 - Now Refreshed - tuned + GoPro'ed  (Read 14669 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
refreshing a 400 4 - Now Refreshed - tuned + GoPro'ed
« on: September 30, 2013, 08:56:41 pm »
Howdy all,

I bought my buddy's 75' CB400f back in April and rode it on and off during the summer knowing that it need a freshening up. I gave him $1200 bucks and re-jetted his Bonnie for this little jewel.



It's a fun city bike but it has 35,500 miles on it and has it's issues.

For one the previous owner broke off the cam chain adjuster bolt in the case then cross drilled it
The head light bracket is off of a 500 or 550 and the beam can't be aimed down. . It works but lets just say I can see all of the street signs really well. The transmission has a horrible whine, the horn doesn't work, the electrical powers all the need circuits but is dodgy at best, front brake lines are ready to burst, on and on and on... it's the same age as me and we're both in about the same shape.  :-X.

So this brings me to last Saturday morning when the weather turned for the worst. 3.5" of rain over the weekend. Fall is here! Out to garage I went, coffee in one hand, and a pack of smokes in the other. It's time to give the little girl some love.

Is it just me or does everyone start these projects with the tank full of fuel? The last time I did this it was full of gas too. I found my keys for my other bikes and siphoned as much off as could and the remainder went into lawn mower.

I started in with the body panels and controls, fenders, and harness.

Apparently the main fuse melted out of the box and this was the fix. They could have at least used butt connectors.
 




I got it stripped down to this and checked the compression.



120 +- 2 across the board so I'm thinking it's worn out evenly.

I use a short version of an automotive gauge.


So off with her head and I pulled on her jugs. Unbolted the case and stuck it on my bench. Disassembled the two sides and split the cases. The internals "look" good. Not much for crud past the second ring, although the valves are crusty they don't leak brake clean with the cambers full.

Now on to the broken cam bolt.
The knob should have stopped when he broke the bolt off. BUTT NOOOOOOO I think I can drill it out. Where did he think the shaving were going when he was drilling sideways?!? Well right down into the base. I'm sure it wasn't much, it's just one more thing to be fixed.

   


I have inserts at work so finding them isn't a problem.

Drill, Tap, install.





So I think I found a good trans off of ebay. It has the forks, primary chain, and complete trans with the bearings so we will see... My old middle shift fork had the pads worn off. I hope this new old #$%* isn't to beat up. lol.

I also have a line on a set of 466 pistons and freshly bored cylinders! I also have questions out to that guy as to where the boring was done.

anyhow that's it for now. I'm off to clean the cases and bead blast everything in the morning. Cheers!







« Last Edit: April 29, 2014, 04:40:00 pm by thirsty 1 »
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #1 on: September 30, 2013, 09:18:48 pm »
Off to the bead blaster and solvent tank


Such cute little pistons. Lol




Insert and driver.



« Last Edit: September 30, 2013, 09:46:12 pm by thirsty 1 »
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline Mugen_Stumpo

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 287
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2013, 10:58:44 am »
looks like a great project 8)

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2013, 09:11:18 pm »
looks like a great project 8)

Ya it should turn out good I see you have one too! Thanks.

That first post was pretty grumpy of me. I think I had maybe one to many oat soda's. lol

I had some more progress at the bead blaster and solvent tank.



I managed to get most all of my cases and covers cleaned with the exception of a few random parts I forgot in the morning before work. Not bad for getting paid to rebuild my little baby.

I did have a really big score on though. While I was "working" this morning I happened across my old friend Doug from camgrinders. I was over in the tool room looking for plugs to cap off my cylinders when I heard him talking outside the door. I shot the s with him and then asked if he could possibley hone a set of cyl. with a 2" bore. I thought he might but I wasn't sure he could do anything this small. I got a "well maybe whats it for" out of him so I showed him the goods. He say's gimmie'em I'm going back to Ballard right now, do you want them later this morning or later this afternoon? I told I was going out of town till Sunday so if it was at all possible I'll pick them up later today. Well sure enough not even 2 hours later he called me up and told me they were done! Whaaa! Right on dude I'll be right up.

He's an old friend so free to me and it was just a deglaze. I'm reusing my old pistons and putting in new OEM rings.
This is not the first time I've had cyl.'s honed by him and his guys, but it is the first set of MC jugs. I do larger bore diesel work for a living and have used this shop for the last 8 years. I know now that if anyone in the NW needs cylinders honed or bored for a MC it'll be done in a timely manner.  I have nothing but good thing to say about this guy. As I said hes been a friend of work for a long time. I've come to find that he does all size cylinders. http://www.camgrinders.net/   this was about 2 passes with a 280 grit hone (As Per Wisco specs.). I 've fore gone the 466 kit. It had bad fins. ---- Lame.





I also picked apart my oil pump and found it in perfect shape. Sweet!!



Cheers, Thirsty



« Last Edit: October 02, 2013, 07:53:19 pm by thirsty 1 »
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2013, 06:20:31 pm »
I've had a few small victories in the last week or so. The transmission I ordered from ebay turned out to be in nearly new condition. :) My old one was kinda sloppy. The bearings and bushings were worn and the middle fork was shot.

old
 

new used


As you could imagine, the gear segment the fork was running in was also in trouble. The metal had transferred so it was nice to have the replacement. I also bought the primary chain and slippers.

I took my cases back to work and plugged off the oil galleys with ear plugs and masking tape. I'm not a big fan of putting cases in the bead blaster. I suppose if the proper precautions are taken all is well. I needed to get all of the baked on road grim off of the lower half. It's all nice and clean now.

 

I've been waiting for my parts from Bike Bandit and DSS so I'm in a lull. I have a few things from DSS like the cam chain and slippers but I need my primary bumpers so I have to wait......and wait....and...



assembled my lower half and checked the trans for shifting. all's well in the trans. waiting....waiting...


Here's a comparison picture of my old cam chain on the bottom with the new chain on top. It was time. 

« Last Edit: October 09, 2013, 07:33:56 pm by thirsty 1 »
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2013, 10:42:12 am »
I've had a bit of progress on my engine so here are a few pics.

The local bearing house had my primary bearings in stock for 23 bucks - excellent!





Looks like someone had a chain come off at one time. Yikes, That could have been a disaster.



Installed all the shifter stuff and checked the trans for operation. All's well...



Taped off and ready for paint.



Does anyone know the proper order for the piston rings? Is the flat square one the second ring, and the tapered silver'ish one on top? I think this is right but I'm not 100%.




Almost forgot about my new toaster oven.  After my covers bake I can make a chicken for lunch. Maybe even have some toast!





« Last Edit: October 26, 2013, 10:02:43 pm by thirsty 1 »
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: I was thirsty, refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2013, 10:00:48 pm »
Bake: 200f 4 60

73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2013, 09:06:20 pm »
engine is complete  :) Just needs a valve adjust after I pull the rockers. I forgot about the tach drive  ::)







cheers, Thirsty
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline Mcwilliams570

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 646
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2013, 09:29:41 pm »
Engine looks great.. I like the toaster oven idea.

Matt
My CB550 project http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=101182.0

Project UFB Cb550 http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=112143.0

Like a 10 dollar hooker on Friday night its going to be ridden.

1974 cb550
1975 cb550
2005 vmax
2009 vmax-sold
1981 gl500i

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2013, 05:23:22 pm »
It's dead.  ;D

73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline cheftuskey121

  • Super Newbie
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,305
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2013, 05:31:03 pm »
tits up. you killed it.

Offline NobleHops

  • Don ya be callin' me no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,380
  • Misfit - Tucson, Arizona
    • RestoCycle - Vapor Blasting and Japanese Motorcycle Restoration
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2013, 09:36:07 pm »
It's dead.  ;D



It just wants a belly rub. I'm a dog guy, trust me on this.
Nils Menten * RestoCycle LLC * Tucson, Arizona, USA

R1200GS, DRZ400E, CBX (4x), Z1 (2x), CB500K, CB750K (3x), CB350F, H1, CL360... I have a motorcycle problem.



I do Vapor Blasting!   http://www.restocycle.com
Ikon Suspension: http://www.ikonshocksusa.com

My build thread: NobleHops makes a 400F pretty for his wife: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=131210.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2014, 04:27:19 pm »
I just spent 2 months in S Korea, it's nice to be back home and twiddling with the 400.

I made a bit of progress today. It was an early morning bead blast session follow by 2 cans of VHT Glossy black epoxy.  I've never used this paint so I guess I'll see how it turns out !







Cheers
« Last Edit: January 19, 2014, 09:59:33 pm by thirsty 1 »
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline NobleHops

  • Don ya be callin' me no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,380
  • Misfit - Tucson, Arizona
    • RestoCycle - Vapor Blasting and Japanese Motorcycle Restoration
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2014, 08:30:59 am »
Damn, that looks fantastic. Can you shed some light on the bead blast setup? Is that a cabinet that this frame fits into? And what did you degrease with in preparation for the epoxy - lacquer thinner or something equally horrible? Great work!

I am liking your engine with the black barrels, kinda wish I had done that.

Nils Menten * RestoCycle LLC * Tucson, Arizona, USA

R1200GS, DRZ400E, CBX (4x), Z1 (2x), CB500K, CB750K (3x), CB350F, H1, CL360... I have a motorcycle problem.



I do Vapor Blasting!   http://www.restocycle.com
Ikon Suspension: http://www.ikonshocksusa.com

My build thread: NobleHops makes a 400F pretty for his wife: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=131210.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2014, 10:13:35 pm »
Hey thanks! Ya its a large industrial size media blaster. We use glass beads for the aluminum parts, it supposedly doesn't take the material off. ??? It works excellent for steel. As far as prep for the epoxy paint. None. The can says to clean really well and nock off the loose stuff so did. Lol.  After the bead machine I take it all to a wash rack and pressure wash everything. Then it's all done. Spic and span. I think of it as a "perk" of my job.

You said you used the VHT hi temp on your CBX. Did you have any problems with it turning brown around the exhaust ports? I was thinking I might take the head back off and paint it back like the jugs.....

« Last Edit: January 22, 2014, 10:23:07 pm by thirsty 1 »
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2014, 07:21:48 am »
Here's the work set up! Sorry about the fuzzy pics



73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline NobleHops

  • Don ya be callin' me no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,380
  • Misfit - Tucson, Arizona
    • RestoCycle - Vapor Blasting and Japanese Motorcycle Restoration
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2014, 12:42:33 pm »
I confess to a bit of envy - every now and then a blast cabinet would be just the thing. I see your hubs and disc in there, so I presume you're relacing the wheels too? I'm a few days from doing that myself, should be interesting :-).
Nils Menten * RestoCycle LLC * Tucson, Arizona, USA

R1200GS, DRZ400E, CBX (4x), Z1 (2x), CB500K, CB750K (3x), CB350F, H1, CL360... I have a motorcycle problem.



I do Vapor Blasting!   http://www.restocycle.com
Ikon Suspension: http://www.ikonshocksusa.com

My build thread: NobleHops makes a 400F pretty for his wife: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=131210.0

Offline NobleHops

  • Don ya be callin' me no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,380
  • Misfit - Tucson, Arizona
    • RestoCycle - Vapor Blasting and Japanese Motorcycle Restoration
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2014, 12:44:06 pm »
P.S. Are you happy with the finish of the epoxy paint, now that it has cured?
Nils Menten * RestoCycle LLC * Tucson, Arizona, USA

R1200GS, DRZ400E, CBX (4x), Z1 (2x), CB500K, CB750K (3x), CB350F, H1, CL360... I have a motorcycle problem.



I do Vapor Blasting!   http://www.restocycle.com
Ikon Suspension: http://www.ikonshocksusa.com

My build thread: NobleHops makes a 400F pretty for his wife: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=131210.0

Offline flybox1

  • My wife thinks I'm a
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 14,296
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2014, 08:08:40 pm »
Good job so far.  Hope to hook up a PNW ride this summer and see your finished ride...
'78 750K (F3 engine) PD42b's, Modified airbox w/K&N  filter, 40/110 jets, 1 needle shim, IMS@ 1 turn out. Kerker + Cone 18" QuietCore

Past Bikes
1974 550K0 (stock), 1973 CB350F (stock), 1983 Yamaha XS400K (POS)
77/78 cool 2 member #3
"Knowledge without mileage equals bullsh!t" - Henry Rollins

"This is my CB. There are many like it, but this one is mineā€¦"

Offline NobleHops

  • Don ya be callin' me no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,380
  • Misfit - Tucson, Arizona
    • RestoCycle - Vapor Blasting and Japanese Motorcycle Restoration
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2014, 11:01:59 am »

You said you used the VHT hi temp on your CBX. Did you have any problems with it turning brown around the exhaust ports? I was thinking I might take the head back off and paint it back like the jugs.....

I ran out and photo'd it with the flash, as it's a little hard to see in there in the garage, but I think the answer is "maybe a little?"



It still looks great overall.

Let's talk about your hubs and mine please. I just got mine back from being "vapour blasted" by a great guy in Santa Fe, NM, and much to my surprise the surface is a little pebbly/toothy and the finish a skosh uneven, much like you'd expect to see after bead or other media blasting. (will post pics a bit later). I was somehow expecting the metal to look new and the surface unaltered, but that was not the case.

I'd like to restore the finish to a nice even satin-smooth finish, and I dread spending hours with my polishing wheel to try to get it, and failing. What's your plan with yours? And what did you blast it with? Glass beads again?

Nils Menten * RestoCycle LLC * Tucson, Arizona, USA

R1200GS, DRZ400E, CBX (4x), Z1 (2x), CB500K, CB750K (3x), CB350F, H1, CL360... I have a motorcycle problem.



I do Vapor Blasting!   http://www.restocycle.com
Ikon Suspension: http://www.ikonshocksusa.com

My build thread: NobleHops makes a 400F pretty for his wife: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=131210.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2014, 11:15:55 am »
Something like this? I'm actually working today so I can get back to the details later.



To

73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2014, 11:20:12 am »
I really liked your idea with the red scotch Brite on your gauges so I ran with it. Hope ya don't mind.
73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

Offline NobleHops

  • Don ya be callin' me no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,380
  • Misfit - Tucson, Arizona
    • RestoCycle - Vapor Blasting and Japanese Motorcycle Restoration
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2014, 11:27:25 am »
Something like this? I'm actually working today so I can get back to the details later.



To



YES man, EXACTLY. That looks PERFECT. Please share all!
Nils Menten * RestoCycle LLC * Tucson, Arizona, USA

R1200GS, DRZ400E, CBX (4x), Z1 (2x), CB500K, CB750K (3x), CB350F, H1, CL360... I have a motorcycle problem.



I do Vapor Blasting!   http://www.restocycle.com
Ikon Suspension: http://www.ikonshocksusa.com

My build thread: NobleHops makes a 400F pretty for his wife: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=131210.0

Offline NobleHops

  • Don ya be callin' me no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,380
  • Misfit - Tucson, Arizona
    • RestoCycle - Vapor Blasting and Japanese Motorcycle Restoration
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2014, 12:44:12 pm »
Here's how my parts look now. Immaculate but dull on the smooth surfaces:







Nils Menten * RestoCycle LLC * Tucson, Arizona, USA

R1200GS, DRZ400E, CBX (4x), Z1 (2x), CB500K, CB750K (3x), CB350F, H1, CL360... I have a motorcycle problem.



I do Vapor Blasting!   http://www.restocycle.com
Ikon Suspension: http://www.ikonshocksusa.com

My build thread: NobleHops makes a 400F pretty for his wife: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=131210.0

Offline thirsty 1

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 512
Re: refreshing a 400 4
« Reply #24 on: January 24, 2014, 12:49:33 pm »
Something like this? I'm actually working today so I can get back to the details later.



To



YES man, EXACTLY. That looks PERFECT. Please share all!

Ok, I started off in the bead blaster again to get the big stuff off and get into all of the groves. Then I just started hand  sanding with some 240, then 320, then the green scotch pads and the red pads. No water or solvent or anything else. Just the basic elbow grease theory. After that I taped off the outside of the hubs and painted them with my left over VHT Black I used on my cylinders. Then into my toaster oven and baked at 150f for about 20 minutes. Remove, let cool, remove tape, and re-polish with the red pad. Done

I know what you mean about the rough surface after the cleaning. It's almost like the surface of a golf ball, kinda. It sanded out surprisingly fast and I'm not much for polishing anything. For me the maintenance is to much. So - that's where the scotch bite came in. Your gauges came out really nice by the way. You might have a doppelganger bike in Seattle. lol.   

73' CL125, 75' CB400F, 16' KTM 1190R, 05' KTM 525EXC

75' CB400F  -  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=127295.0

My 79 CB750F for fun   ----   http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=19923.0

 

;