Author Topic: Danielle CB550K Build - Toyon Moto Club #5 (Read 93705 times)

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #50 on:** May 27, 2014, 08:01:27 PM »

Not much to report. Fitted a new brake stay from Joker. Thinking about pimping out maybe just a bit more with some additional Joker parts, like turn signals and headlight ears - maybe. Ordered new gauges. I was originally planning with a single Motogadget tach, but ended up with Koso mini-gauses. In the mail.

Now I'm trying to decide on a front fender. Because this build has 500 sliders which are an inch shorter than 550 sliders (I did not learn this until recently), it's impossible to incorporate a fork brace with the stock fender brace (which I already had chromed). Since they are mutually exclusive, I decided to go with the Tarozzi fork brace in lieu of the stock set up. This means that if I want a front fender (which I do), I will have to mount it to the underside of the fork brace. With a test fit, the inside surface of the fender rubs on the top of the tire slightly - but I think it's do-able.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #51 on:** May 28, 2014, 12:20:47 PM »

Ha! Nary a neighbor! Good idea. Now that I have the rearsets on, I can try going downhill on the steep 1/4 paved driveway as soon as I fill the MC reservoir. The push back uphill is a #$%* though.

Trad · « **Reply #52 on:** May 28, 2014, 03:23:37 PM »

Beautiful stuff in here.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #53 on:** May 28, 2014, 07:44:42 PM »

It's a long coast down..... Top of the driveway.

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #54 on:** May 29, 2014, 12:07:44 AM »

Quote from: Blackfin5 on May 28, 2014, 07:44:42 PM

It's a long coast down..... Top of the driveway.

Good thing you're not pushing a 750 back up that driveway!

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #55 on:** May 29, 2014, 07:30:30 AM »

Yeah, pushing a complete bike up that hill in the Summer time would be no fun.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #56 on:** May 30, 2014, 09:23:37 AM »

Heck no! This is the bottom section. I can't get the driveway into one photo.

It's a little off topic, but just finished painting the Toyon Moto man-shop.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #57 on:** May 30, 2014, 09:25:30 AM »

Trad - Thanks. Been following your build too. I've had lots of inspiration from guys here - FunJimmy, Tweakin, brandEn, bwaller, etc etc.

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #58 on:** May 30, 2014, 04:29:41 PM »

Awesome man shop!

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #59 on:** June 09, 2014, 12:43:51 PM »

Yes, it is going slowly. I've been putting more time in the 750 Blaster and my buddies' 4 CB550s than my own; but I did finish the front caliper and bled the S.S. line. It's a new Nissin MC. I think 15mm (not positive, may be 14mm). Anyway, the feel is very firm. I'm ready for a test....roll. Thanks again, Godfrey and Slingshot. The Tarozzi fork brace is being "finessed" in fit and appearance to accommodate a front fender.

Tweakin, congrats on selling the 915cc and sorry to see it go. It will always be your build.

bwaller · « **Reply #60 on:** June 10, 2014, 04:47:32 AM »

I probably shouldn't mention this since you already have all the parts installed, but for the next time....check out vintagebrake.com. There is a ratio chart for matching master cylinders to calipers. I use 15mm Nissin masters on my street CB's with dual stock calipers and the "feel" is indeed very wooden. The lever is firm alright and it's easy to find these master, but there are better choices. A large bore cylinder with small single live piston calipers takes far greater effort. Mr. Morse helped me and I have an 11mm master on my racebike. I really appreciate the two finger input, much improved feel.

Keep up the good work, you're going to enjoy it.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #61 on:** June 10, 2014, 06:18:30 AM »

Thx Brent. I'm glad you did mention it. The chart really helps. It is a 14mm, not 15. The brake lever on my orange 550 rider is stock and is sponge-like even with a rebuilt MC and SS line. So for this build I went next size up from OE. The difference in feel is substantial. As you say, like a board. The only thing I can think of is perhaps the MC cylinder on the orange 550 is a bit too worn although it looked ok.

RobbyD · « **Reply #62 on:** June 10, 2014, 11:21:12 AM »

Great look build and awesome attention to detail. Keep it up!

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #63 on:** June 10, 2014, 11:24:27 AM »

Vintagebrake.com recommends a ratio of about 27:1 for a "2 finger feel." (That's what she said). I'm guessing the CB550 caliper piston diameter is about a 39-40mm. Anyone know? And I assume the ratio decreases with a S.S. line. By how much?

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #64 on:** June 10, 2014, 06:12:33 PM »

Well.....it seems the CB550 piston is 38.2mm and with a 14mm MC the ratio is about 7.4 according to the chart, thus out of bounds.. This is waaay too stiff according to the chart if looking for a ratio range of 23:1 to 27:1 (or even 11:1 to 14:1 if you read further down the ratio explanation). Surely the wheel size (19") and disc diameter (~11") come into play. Yes the level feels firm but not like a toggle switch. Is a 14mm MC too big for a stock single CB550 front disc/caliper set up? It seems a lot of guys use this size MC for single discs.

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #65 on:** June 10, 2014, 07:00:35 PM »

Quote from: Blackfin5 on June 10, 2014, 06:12:33 PM

Well.....it seems the CB550 piston is 38.2mm and with a 14mm MC the ratio is about 7.4 according to the chart, thus out of bounds.. This is waaay to stiff according to the chart if looking for a ration range of 23:1 to 27:1 (or even 11:1 to 14:1 if you read further down the ratio explanation). Surely the wheel size (19") and disc diamter (~11") come into play. Yes the level feels firm but not like a toggle switch. Is a 14mm MC too big for a stock CB550 front disc/caliper set up? It seems a lot of guys use this size MC for single discs.

I use a 16mm radial master cylinder with 2 stock calipers. Way better than stock and the feel is fine.

bwaller · « **Reply #66 on:** June 10, 2014, 09:14:04 PM »

I didn't mean to start a #$%* storm with this but here's my take on the matter then I promise not to bring it up again! I have two bikes with 15mm Nissins and I thought because there was so much lever that it was a vast improvement too. Compared to stock it is. But you need to pull like hell. Anyone that can brake from speed with two fingers and this set-up I'll not arm wrestle with!

The smaller bore master allows far better modulation. OK, just another opinion, back to the bike biz.

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #67 on:** June 10, 2014, 10:49:13 PM »

Quote from: bwaller on June 10, 2014, 09:14:04 PM

I didn't mean to start a #$%* storm with this but here's my take on the matter then I promise not to bring it up again! I have two bikes with 15mm Nissins and I thought because there was so much lever that it was a vast improvement too. Compared to stock it is. But you need to pull like hell. Anyone that can brake from speed with two fingers and this set-up I'll not arm wrestle with! The smaller bore master allows far better modulation. OK, just another opinion, back to the bike biz.

I think an 18mm would certainly be overkill with a single stock caliper. I use one on my twin disc GL1000 front end with larger bore caliper pistons and it works even better than the 16mm on my 550 with twin stock calipers. The difference of course is that my twin calipers are not the same as stock on either bike.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #68 on:** June 11, 2014, 09:30:05 AM »

Brent - your input is ALWAYS welcomed and appreciated. In the past I always upgraded the MC by seat of my pants based upon the "feel" of the OE on the bike. The chart/ratios eliminate most of the guesswork. Thanks for the heads up. I like the feel a tad on the firm side. This 14mm feels too stiff but it may improve with additional weight of the engine. If not, I think I will drop down to a 12mm.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #69 on:** June 13, 2014, 01:42:21 PM »

I decided to go with this fiberglass front fender. As mentioned earlier up, I am eliminating the OE fender mount/fork brace. I had to trim the fender a bit along its width for a proper fit to the 100/19 front tire. It is not a perfect radius match to the tire, but better than the one in green primer I got from Benjie. I need to also trim/build the top of the fender a bit for a flush mating to the underside of the Tarozzi fork brace.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #70 on:** June 16, 2014, 06:29:31 PM »

Question. Once the rear wheel/brake plate was assembled and with the axle spacers slid onto the axle, I still had about 6 to 7mm of space to take up inside of the new CMR swing arm, which was built by Denis Curtis to 550 specs. The rear ends of the swingarm at the bolt drew together easily as I tightened the axle nut, well before I stopped tightening at 70 ft-lbs. Am I assuming correctly that this is not an issue and not unduly straining the swingarm welds at the cross-brace?

bwaller · « **Reply #71 on:** June 16, 2014, 06:41:20 PM »

You'll need to make new spacers, that's way too much clearance. It will eventually bend the arm somewhere. You only need 1mm or so to slide the wheel in place.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #72 on:** June 16, 2014, 07:05:46 PM »

Thanks, Brent. I'm already using the "long" spacer on the brake plate side since this is a '76 rear hub which has the shorter nose on the brake plate. The proper spacer is on the sprocket side. I need to see where the rear wheel is centered in the swingarm with the axle nut loose to determine which side needs a spacer to take up the extra 6mm or how to size 2 spacers proportionately to ensure the hub is centered.

Blackfin5 · « **Reply #73 on:** June 17, 2014, 11:54:29 AM »

Brent. I way over estimated the gap. It's only about 2.9mm with the sprocket side snug against the left leg of the swingarm and with the axle nut all the way loose. It's just a hair shy of the width of the bolt and nut washers which go on the outside of the CMR swingarm.

I can eliminate the gap by only hand tightening the axle nut a few turns. Then, once I torque to 70 ft-lbs, the rear hub/tire is pefectly centered in the swingarm. Measuring from the hub flange on each side to the swingarm at the shock mounts, the measurement is within 1 mm of each side.

Do you still think I should take up the gap with a 1.5mm spacer on each side? I think right now the final drive sprocket at the engine should be directly in line with the rear sprocket. I don't think a 1.5mm spacer at the sproket side would affect the chain travel to the engine if a spacer is till required.

bwaller · « **Reply #74 on:** June 17, 2014, 04:58:47 PM »

Send Denis an email and ask if 2.9mm is too much.

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Author Topic: Danielle CB550K Build - Toyon Moto Club #5 (Read 93705 times)