Author Topic: I don't know brakes, so...  (Read 1319 times)

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Offline Dr. Noisewater

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I don't know brakes, so...
« on: November 30, 2013, 05:59:43 PM »
I've been working on a 75 CB550F for about a year now. It was a barn find and my first ever project bike. One of the many, many issues it had was the front brake, it simply didn't work. The bike had been sitting for at least 15 years. I figured the master cylinder needed to be rebuilt so I bought a rebuild kit from Dime City awhile back. I put the front brake on the back burner until the engine was working well enough to actually need brakes. But in the meantime I had installed clip-ons and ordered shorter brake lines from Slingshot Cycles.

Well, today I had some spare time (waiting for new points to arrive) so I decided it was time to swap out the brake lines and get a better idea of what the problem was with the front brake. The reservoir has had old fluid in it ever since I got it, so I thought I might as well try to bleed it like normal and see what happens.. nothing. (keep in mind I'm a bike brake newbie) So I decide to just remove the lines and catch whatever fluid spills. After removing the lower brake line I pulled the lever and fluid poured out as expected. This makes me think that maybe the master cylinder is working fine? It doesn't leak, it's been holding fluid for at least 15 years, and seems to operate normally before the caliper so maybe it's ok?

Since it wouldn't bleed through the caliper when I attempted does this mean the caliper is the problem? Is it possible the pistons that push the pads are just stuck from sitting so long? Just hoping to get a more knowledgeable opinion on this before I dive in. Thanks guys for any input.

Offline wowbagger

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2013, 06:18:17 PM »
I had a similar issue with my CB500. The bleeder screw was plugged up. I ended up doing a full caliper rebuild including replacing the bleeder screw with a speed bleeder as well as replacing the piston seal and having the piston polished and the caliper body honed. I also made sure to clean out the groove for the piston seal as well as possible.

Here's a pretty good walk through for rebuilding your front caliper:
http://www.motorcycleclassics.com/classic-motorcycle-repair/1973-honda-cb500-5.aspx#axzz2mBZ9pWFC

Offline tomkimberly

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2013, 09:38:45 PM »
I guarantee the bleeder hole is plugged in the master cylinder. A rebuild is in order, unless you have a low opinion of your life.


Tom


Offline Dr. Noisewater

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2013, 09:58:08 AM »
Thanks for the info guys, I did a search on "stuck caliper" and it seems the safest, most effective method is to use a grease gun. I'm going to play around with it and see if I can free it. If I get it free do I need to rebuild anything? I still need to read more..

Tom, you said the bleeder hole in the master cylinder is plugged, do you mean the bleeder on the caliper?

Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2013, 02:51:54 PM »
I think that's what Tom meant.

Tom was referring to the bleeder hole in the master cylinder guys, tiny little passage that gets blocked easily....... ;)
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Offline BeSeeingYou

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2013, 05:27:33 PM »
Old brake lines will often plug up so it's possible that may have been an issue.  Clean out/ flush/ rebuild the MC whatever it needs.  Remove the caliper from the fork and use a known good/new brake line and hook it directly to the caliper.  Bleed it.....it doesn't have to be perfect and use the MC to pump the piston out so you can clean the seal groove, replace the seal with new and check the piston for excessive pitting.  Pump slow and easy and you won't make a mess.  If you don't have patience and a light touch you might have fluid all over. ;D

Offline Dr. Noisewater

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #6 on: December 01, 2013, 06:24:03 PM »
Great, thanks guys for all the suggestions. I'll be saving this job for next weekend and hopefully everything goes well.

Offline tomkimberly

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #7 on: December 01, 2013, 07:18:16 PM »
I think that's what Tom meant.

Tom was referring to the bleeder hole in the master cylinder guys, tiny little passage that gets blocked easily....... ;)

+1

Inside the master cylinder are two holes, one is for feeding fluid to the system, the other one (which many times looks like it is not drilled all the way through) is the bleed back hole.

Tom

Offline Dr. Noisewater

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2013, 05:43:10 PM »
So if the bleeder in the master cylinder was blocked would any fluid be able to pass through the brake line? When I pulled the bottom line I was able to shoot fluid out by pulling the lever, which I why I was leaning towards the caliper being the issue.


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Offline mrbreeze

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2013, 06:46:21 PM »
The small hole in the master needs to be clear for the piston to release when you let off of the brake.Use the smallest guitar string to clean that port out. There is plenty of info here in the forum about that. Years ago when I didn't want to screw with it and had more $$ to burn, I took my caliper to the stealership and told them to make it good. They sold me a new piston which I probably didn't really need and I guess new seal. Add the labor and I had a pricey ticket and guess what? It still didn't fix it. The wheel would turn until I applied the brake. Then it would stay locked until I cracked the bleeder. After reading about the plugged port in MC problem, I crammed the guitar string in the hole and low & behold it kinda shot a spurt out of the reservoir and all was golden.
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Offline Dr. Noisewater

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Re: I don't know brakes, so...
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2013, 08:57:35 PM »
Great, thanks mrbreeze. That makes a lot of sense, and luckily I have plenty of strings laying around! I'll give it a go this weekend and see how what happens.