Author Topic: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project  (Read 24740 times)

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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #25 on: December 26, 2013, 04:42:34 AM »
Subscribed. ;D
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Offline TurboD

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #26 on: December 26, 2013, 12:24:45 PM »
Tim I got the chance to check the other ports, I did not check each one at every lift setting, but I would say that they all do look to be similar, some small fluctuations here and there as would be expected.

Johno I understand what you are saying, I'm sure you could setup a flapper type sander and do the same thing, it would just take longer than a carbide cutter.

I worked with the #2 intake port a little more today and the numbers are continuing the increase. I slightly widened the floor on both sides at the turn or radius to the valve seat, it is hard to see in the pictures but look closely compared the previous pictures and you will see it. Also I removed material around the valve guide boss, making it more streamlined and less restrictive.

Here is progress so far.
Flow CFM @ 10 Inches

             Before           Basic Cleanup         light Reshaping
.100         24.7                 24.7                         25.0
.200         46.1                 46.2                         46.8
.300         52.1                 56.6                         58.4
.400         54.3                 57.7                         60.0
.500         55.1                 57.9                         60.1



Offline MRieck

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #27 on: December 26, 2013, 03:58:58 PM »
Bang that guide out out of there and do some real work. ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Offline Don R

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #28 on: December 26, 2013, 05:33:41 PM »
This is about where I left off on mine.
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Offline Greg H

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #29 on: December 27, 2013, 12:51:44 AM »
Looking good .Great pics and info. From here on is where it gets interesting ;) ;) 

Offline joe p

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #30 on: December 27, 2013, 03:17:25 AM »
Looking good .Great pics and info. From here on is where it gets interesting ;) ;) 
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Offline Sam Green Racing

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #31 on: December 27, 2013, 03:29:05 AM »
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Offline TurboD

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #32 on: December 27, 2013, 09:14:33 AM »
Thanks again for the interest, hopefully this little project has been helpful to see what can be done to increase the performance of the old SOHC head with minimal work and to this point zero cost. The reason for this thread was to show what could be done at home and on a budget. I would say that a solid 8 CFM (10%) increase in flow with our intake port is worth noting. Pretty much from this point on, gains are going to be smaller and more work intensive along with adding costs.

Again so far I am happy with the results, we now have a head for very little cost that is now capable of supporting 10 horsepower more over a stock casting, the added benefits would also be that with the additional flow the useable rpm range of the engine has been increased and raised.

It has been suggested to replace the guide and perform more work, and naturaly these would be some of the next steps to take. The aftermarket guide would offer a smaller overall diameter and size, along with the abilitly to use smaller stem valves if desired, both would produce additional flow. With this project I am nearing the end as to work for increased flow, this head has a date with about 15-20 pounds of boost so working for every last CFM and running the budget up is not really needed.

I am however curious to possibly try out a set of aftermarket stainless valves that have a reshaped head and under cut stem, these would most likely be the next step to take for addition flow and keeping on a budget. I am sure they will be lighter as well allowing for a little more additional RPM before valve float. I will shop around for a set.

I am also working on testing just the stock intake "spigot" by itself to see just what its limits might be, I have a feeling that we are getting within a few CFM of its ability. Also I will be working on the exhaust side and showing some before and after shots.

   

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #33 on: December 27, 2013, 10:09:12 AM »
New stock size valves like you mention would be a good comparative test for a basically stock head. Looking forward to seeing you prove/disprove that style of aftermarket valves.
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline MRieck

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #34 on: December 27, 2013, 11:24:10 AM »
Thanks again for the interest, hopefully this little project has been helpful to see what can be done to increase the performance of the old SOHC head with minimal work and to this point zero cost. The reason for this thread was to show what could be done at home and on a budget. I would say that a solid 8 CFM (10%) increase in flow with our intake port is worth noting. Pretty much from this point on, gains are going to be smaller and more work intensive along with adding costs.

Again so far I am happy with the results, we now have a head for very little cost that is now capable of supporting 10 horsepower more over a stock casting, the added benefits would also be that with the additional flow the useable rpm range of the engine has been increased and raised.

It has been suggested to replace the guide and perform more work, and naturaly these would be some of the next steps to take. The aftermarket guide would offer a smaller overall diameter and size, along with the abilitly to use smaller stem valves if desired, both would produce additional flow. With this project I am nearing the end as to work for increased flow, this head has a date with about 15-20 pounds of boost so working for every last CFM and running the budget up is not really needed.

I am however curious to possibly try out a set of aftermarket stainless valves that have a reshaped head and under cut stem, these would most likely be the next step to take for addition flow and keeping on a budget. I am sure they will be lighter as well allowing for a little more additional RPM before valve float. I will shop around for a set.

I am also working on testing just the stock intake "spigot" by itself to see just what its limits might be, I have a feeling that we are getting within a few CFM of its ability. Also I will be working on the exhaust side and showing some before and after shots.

 
Bore the intake seat/throat out to .9....you will pick up some good CFM for low cost.
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"

Offline Big Jay

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #35 on: December 27, 2013, 11:59:48 AM »
I am however curious to possibly try out a set of aftermarket stainless valves that have a reshaped head and under cut stem, these would most likely be the next step to take for addition flow and keeping on a budget. I am sure they will be lighter as well allowing for a little more additional RPM before valve float. I will shop around for a set.

Ours neck down to 6mm under the head.

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #36 on: December 27, 2013, 01:19:52 PM »
Jay,

Have you guys flowed your heads?  ;)
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline Greg H

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #37 on: December 27, 2013, 03:19:12 PM »
Just a thought ,have you considered just cutting back the guides . I say this because back in the day I ran a 970 sohc Honda motor which was fitted with a Weslake modified head,which as well as extensive porting, bigger valves etc,  had all  the guides cut  back  . As a consequence of this we started cutting the guides back on  the single cylinder BSA C15 based motors we used to build for the local Grasstrack racers .These motors used to fly, the  only downside was that the guides needed to be changed frequently. Unacceptable on a road motor I suppose , not a problem for a race motor though. 

Offline MRieck

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #38 on: December 27, 2013, 04:10:43 PM »
Just a thought ,have you considered just cutting back the guides . I say this because back in the day I ran a 970 sohc Honda motor which was fitted with a Weslake modified head,which as well as extensive porting, bigger valves etc,  had all  the guides cut  back  . As a consequence of this we started cutting the guides back on  the single cylinder BSA C15 based motors we used to build for the local Grasstrack racers .These motors used to fly, the  only downside was that the guides needed to be changed frequently. Unacceptable on a road motor I suppose , not a problem for a race motor though.
Big valve angles, heavy valves and stiff springs certainly do that. I have found the best compromise is to taper the guide about 10 or 12 degrees and leave the length. I am also getting rid of the guide boss at that point too.
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Offline scottly

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #39 on: December 27, 2013, 05:03:32 PM »

I am also working on testing just the stock intake "spigot" by itself to see just what its limits might be, I have a feeling that we are getting within a few CFM of its ability.
 
I would be very interested in seeing the results of the spigot test. Thanks.
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Offline Greg H

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #40 on: December 28, 2013, 01:05:04 AM »

I am also working on testing just the stock intake "spigot" by itself to see just what its limits might be, I have a feeling that we are getting within a few CFM of its ability.
 
I would be very interested in seeing the results of the spigot test. Thanks
Me to  :)

Offline johno

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #41 on: December 28, 2013, 03:54:08 AM »


I found it easier to use PVC pipes and plasticine ( play doh), machined up guides to different angles and lengths
GRASSHOPPER SOHC HONDAS ARE THE MEANING OF LIFE.

Offline johno

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #42 on: December 28, 2013, 03:56:31 AM »


spin the guides up in a lathe
GRASSHOPPER SOHC HONDAS ARE THE MEANING OF LIFE.

Offline johno

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #43 on: December 28, 2013, 03:59:30 AM »


easy to use play doh for different guide shapes rather than the real Mcoy
GRASSHOPPER SOHC HONDAS ARE THE MEANING OF LIFE.

Offline johno

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #44 on: December 28, 2013, 04:03:51 AM »


with right diam use the PVC pipe to do spigot only tests etc...........just easy baby
GRASSHOPPER SOHC HONDAS ARE THE MEANING OF LIFE.

Offline johno

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #45 on: December 28, 2013, 04:06:38 AM »


the ol play do makes life fast and easy for guide shapes
GRASSHOPPER SOHC HONDAS ARE THE MEANING OF LIFE.

Offline johno

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #46 on: December 28, 2013, 04:10:23 AM »


can compare the valve stem only numbers.

this is a long time ago for me , cant remember the numbers  but just trying to show a quick easy way to dial in on the bench
cheers  johno
GRASSHOPPER SOHC HONDAS ARE THE MEANING OF LIFE.

Offline TurboD

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #47 on: December 28, 2013, 06:03:40 AM »
Thanks for all the input.

Big Jay That is good to know, because I looked at the pictures of the valves on the site and read the discription and it did not appear that the stems were necked down. Thanks.

Greg You are correct the shortening or elimination of the guide would boost flow, but for this project I am hoping to put a few miles on it.

Johno You must have read my mind, I am going to my local metal shop and if they don't have something suitable, I am off to Lowes to look at PVC pipe. 

I do not have a non "F" model (early) head in my hands at this time, do they have a smaller spigot?? If so, if someone could supply me with the inner diameter for it, I will test it for comparison.

Offline simon#42

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #48 on: December 28, 2013, 07:33:09 AM »
this thread is turning out far more interesting than the title suggested !

Offline Tintop

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Re: Low Buck 750 Cylinder Head Project
« Reply #49 on: December 28, 2013, 08:21:12 AM »
this thread is turning out far more interesting than the title suggested !

May deserve to be a 'slicky' when all is said and done.  Or at least moved to the FAQ section for future reference.
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