Topic: K1 build : Machine shop butchery

[KayOne]

I have been watching other members builds and learning a lot from the forum. Although I started my build over a year ago I have been too lazy to document it. I have taken quite a few photos along the way so I guess I will start posting.

I have been cleaning, refurbishing, replacing various components along the way and most are done, waiting installation. I am so pumped after picking up my finished tins tonight that I have to stop procrastinating and share.

So tonight I will start with the mess my painter found when he stripped the paint on my tank. I actually looked good to both of us...little did we know that the bike had apparently gone for a spill in it's previous life....here we go. It seems like a tradition to name the build on SOHC4 so suggestions would be welcomed.

Tank before, repainted but looked decent:



What the chemical stripping revealed:



And:









YIKES! Needless to say I had to slip the painter another $150 for the job.

Next thing holding back the job is the rear hub. I have four hours wet sanding one side to remove the gouges left by the Harley spokes. Dreading another four hours of hand cramping, skin spitting drudgery.

[NobleHops]

Next thing holding back the job is the rear hub. I have four hours wet sanding one side to remove the gouges left by the Harley spokes. Dreading another four hours of hand cramping, skin spitting drudgery.

Wet sanding is just for the end. Save your time and your hands and start with 320, get the big stuff done with that, then ascend the grades with the wet/dry till it's smooth. Should cut your time by 2/3!

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

I can relate to that.  I purchase what looked like a fairly pristine SS tank.







After the paint was stripped, we found all kinds of pinholes!



I had to have a welder replace the top panels of the gas tank.  No bueno then, but all is good now. 

[calj737]

K1 - for your hub, start by having it glass bead blasted or vapor blasted. It will thoroughly clean the surface (required for premium results) and put enough tooth in the aluminum that wet sanding will be cut drastically. You can actually go straight to ScothBrite, then to final wet sand if you want a brilliant shine.

* (The cure for hand cramps is devious substitutes on preparation work)

[KayOne]

Thanks for the suggestions NobleHops and calj. I have to find a bead blaster. Many the businesses here are in the midst of a 50 yr. long oil boom and charge WAY too much $. I've been quoted $100 minimum for one single small item. My machinist neighbor said he would turn it on the lathe, but the wait is typically 6 months....summer is four months long here!

[Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er]

That $100 can get you a Harbor Freight blast cabinet that you can cherish forever. 

[KayOne]

I lost the pics of the bike loaded on the trailer because my old camera crapped out and the memory card is the size of a suitcase and will not fit in my laptop.

This is how the bike looked after I removed the engine, gauges and a few other items.



It appears that the PO partially disassembled the bike to sand blast and paint it, trouble is he didn't strip it completely.



After seeing the damage to the tank it is apparent that the bike had a front end damage, hence the bent fork ears, late model black head light shell and red paint or primer all over the steering head, gauges and wiring. Why disassemble or mask anything if you can save time and paint it on the bike?



Even the gauges were splattered with paint, notice that someone has taken the tach apart at some point.



Check out the custom green washer on the rear shock mount.



I should get my engine parts from Cycle X this week and start on the engine. Once I finish the rear hub and lace on the new Sun rims I will take them in to get the new vintage rubber mounted, move the bike to the garage and have a roller! Here sits the bike waiting in the basement.



Later, stay warm.

[tweakin]

Nice!  I love gold K1's...

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Nice!  I love gold K1's...

I wonder why?? 

Yes, this one's coming along nicely, too.

[KayOne]

Thanks Tweakin. I was on the fence regarding the color I wanted to paint it. When you posted your build with only the gold fork ears installed, well that nailed it. So...you are responsible for this gold K1.

[tweakin]

Thanks Tweakin. I was on the fence regarding the color I wanted to paint it. When you posted your build with only the gold fork ears installed, well that nailed it. So...you are responsible for this gold K1.

Sweet!  I too was on the fence regarding the gold, but brandEn talked me into it over the silver.  So glad I went with it, pictures can't do it justice.

[DH]

Kayone, which cyclex parts are you going to use? Any of the new/redesigned cam chain tensioner or primary tensioner parts?

[KayOne]

Hey DH.

I'm using the new Cycle-X cam chain and primary chain tensioners. As well as;

HD lightweight primary chains, Kibblewhite cylinder studs, Cometic head gasket, Wiseco 836 pistons, CX-2 cam (Webcam 41a with more lift), titanium jam nuts and beehive springs.

Also ordered a Power Arc optical ignition. I installed one on my '79 CB750F and couldn't be happier with it. Lots of guys think it's expensive but when you consider it comes with an automotive grade coil, very nice ignition wires and NKG caps, it stacks up well with other systems once you buy the coils etc. Plus it comes with 4 spark curves and has a FAT spark. I have so many hours into this bike I just want to set up the ignition and forget about it.

[DH]

Sounds like youre doin things right. It'll be fun to watch. What do you think of the tensioners as far as quality? they look good in pics, very appealing. I'm considering them for my 750 as part of a refresh.

[KayOne]

Thanks, I'll let you know when I get them.

[KayOne]

My K1 had a bent. flat sided Harley rim with rusty spokes so I ordered up front and rear polished Aluminum Sun rims and stainless steel spokes from Buchanan's.

This project is not a strict restoration as I want to change a few parts to improve performance. The wheels are much lighter than the stock DID's and I like the look of dimple less rims.  The front rim is slightly wider than stock at 2.15". The rear is 2.75", a bit wider than I wanted but Sun doesn't offer a 2.5" wide rim.

The rear hub was beat up from the Harley spokes that were all threaded from the outside, leaving deep scars in the flanges. Without access to a lathe it took six hours of flat filing and another four or five hours of wet sanding and buffing to get it back to an acceptable condition. When I spoked the hub, I discovered the Harley spokes had egged the holes causing the spokes to extend too far into the rim.....another 2 hours carefully grinding 2mm off the ends of the spokes. Did I mention I hate the PO?

Everything worked out and I am satisfied with the end result:

BTW I used SprayMax 2K clear coat on the hubs (as well as the other parts that Honda clear coated).

Finished hub about to get new bearings:



Finished wheel....FINALLY!



The rim trued up very well, rim width looks really good to me. Dropping off the rims to the local Honda shop tomorrow to get 4.25" Dunlop K81 by 18" on the rear and a 3.50" by 19 ribbed Avon on the front rim.



Next up, tach rebuild with damper refill.

[thirsty 1]

Purdy

[KayOne]

I have been going hard putting my bike together (so much so that I ignored work on my build thread). Long story short, everything on the bike is done and have been waiting a couple weeks for my cylinder head and a cylinder over bore. Got the stuff home today and inspected it.  #2 and #4 bores have spiral scratches deep enough for to be detectable with a fingernail. Ran the stuff across town to my Drag engine builder of 25 years for him to have a look. I left the cylinder and pistons with him so he can contact Wiseco to find out reference measurement points. A quick measure with a bore gauge found a .0015" variance range between cylinders...this with a .002 Wiseco specked clearance !!!! He said the scratches are due to a dirty hone stone.

The engine builder is going to use a high tech boroscope tomorrow to measure how bad the job is , this way I can have a third party printed report  to present to the machine shop. To add insult to injury I was charged huge $ for the bore and valve seat surfacing and the head was in excellent condition except for the usual exhaust seat pits. New KPMI valves...how difficult can this be?

My K1 came with a post K3 head and member Tews provided me with a cherry KO cylinder and head so I could have a correct restoration...now probably ruined and requiring sleeves. If I was going to resleeve I would have ordered a 915 kit instead of an 836 piston kit....arggggggggggggggg.. sorry for the rant!

I think I should be asking for a refund for the boring portion of the invoice PLUS the cost of ordering new sleeves and shipping/taxes. NO WAY an I going to let the shop butcher another set of sleeves. My drag engine machinist is going to hook me up with a snowmobile engine machinist.

Tell me if I am out of line asking for this and whether I should go with a  915 kit and sell the 836 pistons.

[calj737]

If the third party does verify his initial findings, then you are entirely correct to request a refund. I'd be surprised if they covered the re-sleeves, but you never know.

If you do have to re-sleeve, why not stick with the 836? You've got the pistons already, it's a great upgrade and you can move forward on your build without delay.

Dreadful to hear your experience. Fortunately here in the states, shipping work off to Mike Rieck is very affordable and the quality is the highest.

[KayOne]

Thanks for the advice calj737. I would be willing to pay shipping costs but when something crosses the border twice we get screwed with import charges. I would love to access the talent you guys have south of the border.

Took a closer look at the head. Honda spec the seat width .040 to .050 mine are all .060. Contacts and widths on the valves faces are all over the place. Two out of eight valves have a centered, correct width. All this for three hours labor on the head. I would have been better off just lapping the new valves myself.

[MRieck]

Thanks for the advice calj737. I would be willing to pay shipping costs but when something crosses the border twice we get screwed with import charges. I would love to access the talent you guys have south of the border.

Took a closer look at the head. Honda spec the seat width .040 to .050 mine are all .060. Contacts and widths on the valves faces are all over the place. Two out of eight valves have a centered, correct width. All this for three hours labor on the head. I would have been better off just lapping the new valves myself.

Very sorry to hear about your experience. I have spare sleeves on hand if you need some. I can help you out with any machining and guarantee it is exactly what it is supposed to be. Shipping is a pain but I recently had a fella in your neck of the woods ship down a cylinder and head for work.
 A quick question...did you replace the guides? It is impossible to do a good valve job with loose guides BUT if they were/are loose the shop should tell you.

[KayOne]

Thanks mike, my F3 barrel and head will be heading your way on my next build regardless of shipping costs.

The head was in very good shape and the guides showed very little wear. It was a KO head so it supposedly has stellite guides.

My drag race machine shop measures the bores and thank God they were undersized. One bore was correct and the other three were between .0011" and .0007" tight. It would have surely seized a couple of pistons. #1 had .0009 clearance when it should have has .002"!!!!

Any way, the shop can clean and the machine shop supervisor personally honed the bores to spec (verified by my shop). He also surfaced the head a couple of thou and refunded $150 off the bill. The seats were virgin and it appears they just barely touched them with the stone. They are near .060 wide whereas Honda calls for .040" to .050? Do you think this will be OK Mike?

My drag machinist inspected the head and said it would be ok for my purposes. Next time it will have a correct Serdi job from you.

Again, thanks for your offer Mike, it is much appreciated.

[calj737]

That's a great outcome to an initial boondoggle. Glad to hear you're back on your way-

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

That's a great outcome to an initial boondoggle. Glad to hear you're back on your way-

Every one of these setbacks is unfortunate but temporary.

[MRieck]

Thanks mike, my F3 barrel and head will be heading your way on my next build regardless of shipping costs.

The head was in very good shape and the guides showed very little wear. It was a KO head so it supposedly has stellite guides.

My drag race machine shop measures the bores and thank God they were undersized. One bore was correct and the other three were between .0011" and .0007" tight. It would have surely seized a couple of pistons. #1 had .0009 clearance when it should have has .002"!!!!

Any way, the shop can clean and the machine shop supervisor personally honed the bores to spec (verified by my shop). He also surfaced the head a couple of thou and refunded $150 off the bill. The seats were virgin and it appears they just barely touched them with the stone. They are near .060 wide whereas Honda calls for .040" to .050? Do you think this will be OK Mike?

My drag machinist inspected the head and said it would be ok for my purposes. Next time it will have a correct Serdi job from you.

Again, thanks for your offer Mike, it is much appreciated.

It will work OK....the extra width just kills flow. Good thing the bore size was picked up on!