Author Topic: Gun question for the Australians (Read 4206 times)

Noel · « **on:** September 08, 2006, 05:42:28 PM »

So I'm looking for a particular holster made by a company called Hellweg, based in Australia. The model is the 12R. I've contacted the two places that supposedly sell Hellweg stuff in the U.S.; one can't get it and the other won't reply to my emails. I contaced Hellweg's "worldwide" distributor and they won't write back either. Hellweg.com also isn't answering emails (do I have cooties or something?) and doesn't list any Australian retailers. Their website says, essentially, "There are lots. Try calling around".

So I'm wondering if any Aussies around here know anything about the company or its Australian distributors, or at the very least can provide me with some phone numbers of local gun shops for me to try.

TIA!

seaweb11 · « **Reply #1 on:** September 08, 2006, 06:54:45 PM »

Noel. I assume you went to their company home page http://www.hellweg.com.au/

Rocking-M · « **Reply #2 on:** September 08, 2006, 07:10:33 PM »

Brownells handles their products, don't shoot yourself in the foot now

http://www.brownells.com/

BobbyR · « **Reply #3 on:** September 08, 2006, 08:12:16 PM »

I looked at their holsters, they look fairly coomon. Which one are you looking for. They are pretty easy to make actually.

Noel · « **Reply #4 on:** September 09, 2006, 12:17:52 AM »

Yep, contacted Hellweg.au.com; got no reply. Tried Brownell's; they only carry a few competition holsters and can't/won't make a special order. The holster I'm looking for is the 12R, the "Border Patrol" style. This is actually an extremely close copy of the Bill Jordan border patrol holster as made by Don Hume et al. Was very popular years ago and is now made by pretty much nobody. I was very happy to find it on the Hellweg website; learning how hard it is to actually get one has been sort of a letdown. I've got the S&W model 19 and the Jordan Trooper custom grips and the autographed first edition of "No Second Place Winner". Now I just need the holster...

kghost · « **Reply #5 on:** September 09, 2006, 12:26:41 AM »

Google Derry Gallagher.

Good guy made a couple of my rigs. Lives in the same town as I do maybe he can whip ya one up

BobbyR · « **Reply #6 on:** September 09, 2006, 05:06:37 PM »

Quote from: Noel on September 09, 2006, 12:17:52 AM

Yep, contacted Hellweg.au.com; got no reply. Tried Brownell's; they only carry a few competition holsters and can't/won't make a special order. The holster I'm looking for is the 12R, the "Border Patrol" style. This is actually an extremely close copy of the Bill Jordan border patrol holster as made by Don Hume et al. Was very popular years ago and is now made by pretty much nobody. I was very happy to find it on the Hellweg website; learning how hard it is to actually get one has been sort of a letdown. I've got the S&W model 19 and the Jordan Trooper custom grips and the autographed first edition of "No Second Place Winner". Now I just need the holster...

Noel, the Jordan style holster is excellent and was the standard when I did some peace officer work. It is not really hard to make, I had made several. You can assemble the supples and do it yourself. The Mod 19 is a very good piece. You start with a piece of cardboard and a scissor.

GroovieGhoulie · « **Reply #7 on:** September 09, 2006, 05:45:29 PM »

I too have been looking for a Border Patrol holster for my model 19. Found some used in excellent shape at gunshows, but the problem? I need a Sinistrous version. Rare as hen's teeth I tell you.

sparty · « **Reply #8 on:** September 09, 2006, 07:11:36 PM »

Glad to see others on this site understand firearms. I have found that firearm manufactures often don't understand how to make a proper holster for their handguns. I have often looked for specialty holster makers for my sidearms. I recently purchased a handgun for my fly fishing trip to Alaska - for bear protection. I was surprised to find that the firearm maker actually was able to design a decent holster for this weapon. It doesn't happen too often. Here are some pics of what I found.

Sparty

cbjunkie · « **Reply #9 on:** September 09, 2006, 07:36:34 PM »

that's gorgeous...

but it's letting the bear get a little too close don't you think - why not a good old 12" K body S&W 44 - better accuracy and better stopping power...

you'd be lucky to hit a bear with that little snubby and you sure aren't gonna bring him down with a 45 before he puts a paw on you - the last thing you ever feel...

sparty · « **Reply #10 on:** September 10, 2006, 06:23:26 AM »

It is a .454 Casull 360 grain.
(See pic below)

When we fly fish in Alaska, we fish in groups of three or four. Everyone carries a heavy caliber handgun on their hip – so we have safety in numbers – we even buddy up to take a crap. Two years ago, we all drew our weapons and had our beads on a large brown bear that popped out on us at 20 yards – I nearly soiled my drawers. I agree with what you say, but I carried a longer barreled version of the same caliber and it was too heavy and cumbersome.
I would actually hate to kill one of those beautiful bears; my Ruger is a last resort. I have yelled and waved my arms at browns and they turn and run. Most often that is enough.

Sparty

Rocking-M · « **Reply #11 on:** September 10, 2006, 07:17:46 PM »

on making a holster, make your patterns, sew it up, put your gun in a plastic bag (a good one),
wet your new holster good. Best way is to put it in the sink and fill it till the holster is under water.
When it quits bubbling its wet through. Then put your bagged gun in the holster.
and put the works in one of those vacume baggers and draw a vacume on it.
That will form the holster to the gun. Give it a few minutes then take it out, and carefully remove
the gun from the still wet holster. Hang the holster to dry.
(or if you know you have your gun well protected let it dry in the sun with the gun in it)

Noel · « **Reply #12 on:** September 10, 2006, 08:00:47 PM »

I won't be attempting to make my own holster. I'm a fan of top quality materials and workmanship when it comes to gunleather, and I am unlikely to find the former and utterly incapable of the latter. But thanks for the advice.

I have a few more emails out at the moment and will probably attempt some really, really long distance phone calls tomorrow. That the holster I'm looking for is shown on half a dozen websites and unavailable on any of them is mildly infuriating, so I'm a long way from giving up. Honestly, it seems almost as if Hellweg is doing their level best to avoid selling any holsters!

Noel · « **Reply #13 on:** September 10, 2006, 08:13:58 PM »

Ghoulie --

Quote

I too have been looking for a Border Patrol holster for my model 19. Found some used in excellent shape at gunshows, but the problem? I need a Sinistrous version. Rare as hen's teeth I tell you.

The gun shows in SoCal suck out loud. Beef jerky and steel cased blasting ammo, with the same people selling the same stuff in two or three different booths. I spent a couple of years going to the shows, never buying anything more than corncob media for the tumbler once in a while, and finally quit wasting my money on entry fees. I figure I could spend a hundred years at those places looking for a Jordan holster; fifty just trying to find someone who knew what they are. (Side note: I contacted El Paso Saddlery, who supposedly took over from Don Hume, and they wrote back to say that they weren't familiar with the Jordan border patrol holster but if I sent a picture they could tell me if they made anything like it. There aren't enough eyeroll icons in the universe...)

What's the "Sinistrous version" anyway?

Noel · « **Reply #14 on:** September 10, 2006, 08:19:08 PM »

Quote

but it's letting the bear get a little too close don't you think - why not a good old 12" K body S&W 44 - better accuracy and better stopping power...

you'd be lucky to hit a bear with that little snubby and you sure aren't gonna bring him down with a 45 before he puts a paw on you - the last thing you ever feel...

Probably not much fun to fire, at any rate. But the five shot .45 Colt loads (with essentially the same ballistics as the .454) have taken the African Big Five. Anything that can handle a Cape buffalo ought to do for brown bear. Of course, if I knew I was going to get into a fight with an annoyed bear, I'd prefer a .416, or maybe a .577!

kghost · « **Reply #15 on:** September 10, 2006, 08:20:46 PM »

I'd prefer a tank.

Alas they won't let me buy one.

ofreen · « **Reply #16 on:** September 10, 2006, 08:27:46 PM »

Quote from: kghost on September 10, 2006, 08:20:46 PM

I'd prefer a tank.

Alas they won't let me buy one.

Damned liberals.

Noel · « **Reply #17 on:** September 10, 2006, 08:49:57 PM »

Gotta love the internet. These nice folks have a number of different tanks for sale, plus MIG 21s and Hind gunships.

http://www.tankride.com/Russian_Tanks_For_Sale.html

Those bears are f*cked!

kghost · « **Reply #18 on:** September 10, 2006, 11:18:17 PM »

Hind Gunship's (Czech) For Sale

Condition: Display or Major work to Fly

Price: $20,000 + shipping

2 Left for sale (05/28/06)

Damn I gotta fix it? hell I have a PT-22 in the hanger that still needs fixing.

The shipping would kill me.

eldar · « **Reply #19 on:** September 11, 2006, 08:35:40 AM »

Kinda funny to look for a holster in a country where they destroyed all the guns of law-abiding people so the criminals could rob you easier.

cbjunkie · « **Reply #20 on:** September 11, 2006, 08:38:08 AM »

just pull it up to the bank and cast your fly out of the turret...

seaweb11 · « **Reply #21 on:** September 11, 2006, 06:44:32 PM »

New winter project?

??

Still cheaper than a Harley!

$19,000 for a fixer upper

BobbyR · « **Reply #22 on:** September 11, 2006, 07:27:31 PM »

Quote from: Noel on September 10, 2006, 08:00:47 PM

I won't be attempting to make my own holster. I'm a fan of top quality materials and workmanship when it comes to gunleather, and I am unlikely to find the former and utterly incapable of the latter. But thanks for the advice.

I have a few more emails out at the moment and will probably attempt some really, really long distance phone calls tomorrow. That the holster I'm looking for is shown on half a dozen websites and unavailable on any of them is mildly infuriating, so I'm a long way from giving up. Honestly, it seems almost as if Hellweg is doing their level best to avoid selling any holsters!

I think you underestimate your talents. Making a holster is easier than what you did to your bike. Tandy sells everything you need. The Jordan Border Holster is not that molded. It is meant for smooth draw and protection of the piece, comfort and duability. It is best to use 7-8 oz cowhide.

Noel · « **Reply #23 on:** September 11, 2006, 07:47:17 PM »

Aye, but the bike is metal. Metal I understand. Leather is...different. Artistry. And I haven't got an artistic bone in my body. And like the wise man said, "A man has got to know his limitations."

So I probably spent $20 on the phone with Australia today. And guess what? They don't make the bloody thing anymore. Looks like they have a handful left in the warehouse, though. Maybe I'll buy up the last of their stock and make a killing when Bill Jordan becomes fashionable again. Ha!

cbjunkie · « **Reply #24 on:** September 11, 2006, 11:18:46 PM »

somebody help a brother out...

in this melange of personas we have to have a leathersmith...c'mon...

Rocking-M · « **Reply #25 on:** September 12, 2006, 04:31:56 AM »

Hey I told him how to do it.

dusterdude · « **Reply #26 on:** September 12, 2006, 08:03:57 AM »

do it for him and make some money.

Rocking-M · « **Reply #27 on:** September 12, 2006, 03:52:00 PM »

send me your gun

Noel · « **Reply #28 on:** September 12, 2006, 07:53:47 PM »

So another expensive and clumsy international phone call has resulted in a holster in the mail. I hope. It's the last one they have in the warehouse, and if it gets lost in the mail or sent to Tanzania I'm going to be a mighty unhappy camper.

Thanks for all the replies!

GroovieGhoulie · « **Reply #29 on:** September 21, 2006, 09:47:35 AM »

Quote from: Noel on September 10, 2006, 08:13:58 PM

What's the "Sinistrous version" anyway?

It's a mouthy way of saying Left-Handed.

Lefties used to be regarded as evil, so the word "Sinister" was derived from the words Sinistrous and Sinistral, which mean "left-handed".

I'm actually functionally ambidextrous, but left-eye dominant, so I shoot left-handed.

Egil · « **Reply #30 on:** September 21, 2006, 01:21:07 PM »

If you send a plastic copy of your gun and a picture of the holster , I`L see what I can do for you ,

I made a few to my self and freinds both knives and handguns.

73 - La2vPa. Egil

Noel · « **Reply #31 on:** September 21, 2006, 03:17:06 PM »

Appreciate the offer, but the holster showed up in the mail yesterday, and it's just what I was after. Would be nice if had cost less than $150, but oh well. $:-\$

Noel · « **Reply #32 on:** September 21, 2006, 03:24:06 PM »

Ghoolie --

You learn something every day, eh?

If you're feeling rich, give Hellweg a call. I believe the nice lady on the phone mentioned a left hand model still in stock. It's @#$! expensive, but is an exact replica as far as I can tell, with the exception of the lack of snap on the back side with which to secure the hammer strap completely out of the way.

cbjunkie · « **Reply #33 on:** September 22, 2006, 10:16:11 AM »

so, show us a pic...

Noel · « **Reply #34 on:** September 22, 2006, 11:10:22 AM »

Key points include the open trigger guard, the medium drop, the slight foward cant, and the steel shank sewn in which can be bent to creat a perfect vertical hang, following the contour of the hip, and getting the gun butt away from the body for a clean draw. The strap can also be worn around the "leading edge" of the holster for quick draw work, or removed entirely (snaps on both the front and back) if one never intends to get into a scuffle. I was hoping for tan or at least plain black, but the basketweave was the only thing left and beggars can't be choosers.

Not much different from the older Threepersons design, with the exception of the steel shank, which is key for us "Bill Jordan" wannabees. And for as simple and common as it appears, apparently there is nobody left on the planet making this exact model. $:-\$

cbjunkie · « **Reply #35 on:** September 22, 2006, 11:17:33 AM »

i guess old bill was pretty fast, .27 on the draw, but how in the heck did they even measure that?? was he still shooting on the advent of digital timers?

would love to see some footage of him, if there is any...

Noel · « **Reply #36 on:** September 22, 2006, 11:25:02 AM »

If you get a copy of "No Second Place Winner" he's included some shots of his timing sytem. It was essentially an old analog stopwatch electrically connected to a delay timer, a light bulb, and a stop plate switch. He pressed the button on the delay timer, which, after a few seconds, activated the light and the stopwatch. The shooter reacts to the light, and the impact of his bullet on the stop plate turned off the timer. A very similar system is in use by the "fast draw" competitors these days. http://www.fastdraw.org/ (Check out some of the competition videos. These guys are almost too fast for belief.)

I have ordered a copy of the "Fast and Fancy Shooters" video which is supposed to contain footage of Jordan, among others. http://www.ftfindustries.com/gunvideo/fast_and_fancy_shooters.htm

cbjunkie · « **Reply #37 on:** September 22, 2006, 11:55:47 AM »

thanks for the links - i probably won't get the book, but i am going to watch some vids...do you compete?

Noel · « **Reply #38 on:** September 22, 2006, 12:35:09 PM »

Used to do a lot of Bianchi Cup (NRA action) shooting, but haven't been in a few years. Right now this "Jordan method" stuff has caught my eye, but there really isn't any suitable competition for it. So I do a lot of wax bullet hip shooting and fast draw work in my garage while pretending to be patrolling the Rio Grande.

I've had a more than passing interest in the fast draw competitions for a number of years now. Figure some day I'll give it a try.

So what's your game?

News:

Author Topic: Gun question for the Australians (Read 4206 times)

Rocking-M

Rocking-M

eldar

Rocking-M

Rocking-M