Topic: Self-centering steering?

[raymond10078]

Tore down the front end to do a number of things (new forks, dual brakes, alls balls tapered bearings) - and found that the existing race/bearing set must be dented up pretty bad.

http://youtu.be/8hAxn7U0g24

The fork ears "snap" to the center position when pushed close to center.  Takes a bit of pressure to move off center.  Surprised that I didn't notice it when riding.

[seanbarney41]

that has got to be the worst example of that malady ever seen   You actually rode this bike in this condition?

[MCRider]

There have been many threads on the "dead center detent". This is a classic indication your races are shot.

We can learn to deal with it as it comes on over time. A little more effort to hold true, flip side to side, etc.

Once fixed you should be amazed at how much more true will be your lines thru the curves, etc.

PS: yes that vid is scary. Not only do you have the DCD, but the ease of movement is gone. The fork should glide nearly effortlessly from lock to lock.

[Powderman]

Post pics of the balls and races when you pull them. I'm curious.

[Don R]

I had one with damaged roller bearings, the flat spots would line up on occasion and it was difficult to not wobble down the street. If I stopped and turned left to right several times the flats would mix up and it rode fine for a while.

[bjbuchanan]

My friends kz550 is just like yours. You need to push it thru that center. It is uncomfortable feeling going from my bike to his

[MCRider]

Post pics of the balls and races when you pull them. I'm curious.

It happens from long distance in a straight line on bumpy roads.. The balls pound themselves into the races, leaving visible dots or detents in the races. They look like they were meant to be there. Not so much to see in the balls. They lose their shininess that's about all.

[raymond10078]

Post pics of the balls and races when you pull them. I'm curious.

Will do.

[IBleedHondaRed]

dads 500 frame does the same

[Powderman]

Post pics of the balls and races when you pull them. I'm curious.

It happens from long distance in a straight line on bumpy roads.. The balls pound themselves into the races, leaving visible dots or detents in the races. They look like they were meant to be there. Not so much to see in the balls. They lose their shininess that's about all.

I know what causes it. Just want to see how visibly bad his are.

[74750k4]

Torn down the front end to do a number of things (new forks, dual brakes, alls balls tapered bearings) - and found that the existing race/bearing set must be dented up pretty bad.

http://youtu.be/8hAxn7U0g24

The fork ears "snap" to the center position when pushed close to center.  Takes a bit of pressure to move off center.  Surprised that I didn't notice it when riding.

Great video.
I'm pretty certain one of my bikes is in similar condition...  probably should not ride it til' it's fixed.

Can you make some more vids as you go along???

[raymond10078]

Post pics of the balls and races when you pull them. I'm curious.

Took pics of the bearing races.  Surprising to find - well, not much.  Thought the gouges would be extreme.  Not really.  Couldn't catch a gouge with a fingernail, either.

Lower Inner Race (only these marks on one side - not all the way around)



Lower Outer Race (only these marks on one side - not all the way around)



Upper Inner Race (marks all around)



Upper Outer Race (marks all around)

[scottly]

My thoughts are the nut that adjusts the bearing preload was extremely over-tightened, causing the audible snap when the balls dropped into the grooves. When the balls aren't in the grooves, the triple has a fair amount of resistance to movement. This was most likely done after the grooves were already worn, possibly in an attempt to correct handling issues.

[andrewk]

Only because it hasn't been mentioned-  replace those with tapered bearings.  One of the best things you can do.  You might already know this, sorry if it's a dead horse.

[MCRider]

Only because it hasn't been mentioned-  replace those with tapered bearings.  One of the best things you can do.  You might already know this, sorry if it's a dead horse.

He mentioned it in his first post. Part of the plan. 

[raymond10078]

My thoughts are the nut that adjusts the bearing preload was extremely over-tightened, causing the audible snap when the balls dropped into the grooves. When the balls aren't in the grooves, the triple has a fair amount of resistance to movement. This was most likely done after the grooves were already worn, possibly in an attempt to correct handling issues.

You are correct.  When I loosened the top nut, the triples turned much easier.  The notch was noticeable - but not nearly so.  The grease had the consistency of dried red clay.  Bike only has 15k on it.

[MCRider]

My thoughts are the nut that adjusts the bearing preload was extremely over-tightened, causing the audible snap when the balls dropped into the grooves. When the balls aren't in the grooves, the triple has a fair amount of resistance to movement. This was most likely done after the grooves were already worn, possibly in an attempt to correct handling issues.

You are correct.  When I loosened the top nut, the triples turned much easier.  The notch was noticeable - but not nearly so.  The grease had the consistency of dried red clay.  Bike only has 15k on it.

Any notch feeling is too much BTW.

Another example of how its no longer enough to be low mileage. Sheer age ruins stuff like grease, rubber, tires, plastic, etc.

[andrewk]

Only because it hasn't been mentioned-  replace those with tapered bearings.  One of the best things you can do.  You might already know this, sorry if it's a dead horse.

He mentioned it in his first post. Part of the plan. 

I either can't read or was in before the edit.  Both equally possible.

I agree on the low mileage part.  It's almost better to find a well maintained 30k miler than a 10k example that has never been apart.  ~40 years is a long time to use the same grease!