Topic: SL350K0 Forks....how to get the damned things apart?

[fendersrule]

Assemble in reverse. I use a very thin layer of WD-40 or fork oil.



One question. One of the pistons spin freely around the fork. The other one is much tighter. Is this normal, or should they both be able to spin freely (with new clips) at assembly? Obviously, everything is perfectly in place and correctly reassembled.

[fendersrule]

Help needed. Please see video:

http://youtu.be/g3rR7pOzwRc

[fendersrule]

I've been stuck on the step seen in the video for a week. Not sure if I should proceed or not…

The fork piston is under some friction due to the end clip. Because once you remove the end clip, it rotates freely. So I'm sure if this is something to be concerned about.

[FuZZie]

I'd guess one may be a bit more worn than the other due to the earlier clip issue?

What happens if you switch them, does the issue follow one part maybe like if one was just a touch out of round (bent/warped)?

[fendersrule]

I reinserted a used end clip (not sure which side it came off initially) and the friction was almost worse.

Not sure if by design they should rotate freely, or have some friction. OR if it makes no difference. Almost need a fork expert, but this is holding me up for proceeding because I'd hate to do this again. I'm just noticing a difference, but not sure if this is a problem or not.

[FuZZie]

Yea but I mean the piston it's self or the tube. I could see that causing issues later and one was jammed, may have been the original cause of all this?
 

[fendersrule]

One of the pistons was "jammed" inside of the fork leg along with the clip when I removed it. But not sure if that was due to my "yanking" or if it was like that. I believe the piston just slid off because I was yanking on it. Who knows though.

When I remove the end clip, the piston rotates freely. As soon as I put the clip on, it has some friction, no matter what end clip I use (new or the old one).

The reason is because the piston ends up a little bit too close to the "groove" for the cir clip. Pistons shouldn't get "longer"? What keeps the piston positioned there is another clip (which is brand new) and is properly in the groove. Everything is orientated correctly.

I would think the tube would be fine because the piston rotates freely on it without the clip.

So yea…you can see why I'm a bit confused…urgh!

[FuZZie]

Yep, but if i couldn't find anything out of round I'd give them a go.
But I'm same as you, no fork expert either.

[fendersrule]

Another option is to buy a new piston...

Seems like I should remove it and check for roundness internally.

[fendersrule]

If I do choose to replace the piston:

1) Can I just replace the piston on one side without having to do both?

2) Do I have to replace the piston "spacer" as well?

I removed the piston and didn't notice anything strange. Doesn't "appear" to be warped, sits flat on a glass table on both sides. My regular caliper didn't notice anything out of wack.

[754]

The piston steadies the fork in the bore. .does not spin,nor pass oil thru internally. The clips are to install and hold it.
 Circlip are stamped from sheet. Often this result in one side having rounded edges, the other more sharp or slightly curled. The curled edge may be dragging on piston. Flip it around lightly stone off other edge.
Either way it should work as is..

[fendersrule]

754 just saved the day....

Didn't realize that. Swapped the clip around and now it has a perfect amount of drag....VERY slight...seems ideal. can easily turn it by two fingers now with same hand.

[fendersrule]

The clip for the springs have no "groove" to sit in. What stops the springs from moving up is when the clips hit the top bolt threads. Does that make sense?

No groove (look past the large threads for the top bolt):


With them installed where I "think" they go, the top bolt threads keep the clip from moving any higher:


This MUST be right because there isn't any other option. I'm just used to seeing specific grooves for clips, so this is a first for me.

Also, for some reason I cannot get this top bolt down on one of the forks any lower. Maybe I should ignore this and try tightening when it's installed? It feels like a "hard" stop, but there's no reason that I can think of that it does this. Threads look good:


For the bottom JIS screws, I've been getting them hand tight with some blue thread lock.

I'm usually able to tighten down the top bolt with the forks off, but not sure if I should continue to figure that out, or ignore it and try it with the tube mounted in place.

[fendersrule]

Mounted fork on bike, still couldn't get bolt to go down with some "decent" force.

Swapped bolts, still couldn't get bolt to go down.

Removed the spring clip, still couldn't get the bolt to go down.

What the hell gives? The threads inside look good. I did notice that the previous owner of the bike didn't have the spacer nut in-between the c-clamp. The fork tube however appears to be straight and good.

So, am I doing something stupid? Should I just give it hell? If I had the right tap, I would run a tap through it. Running a tap through it implies that I would need to dissemble everything.

These are the forks from hell.

EDIT: there's a bracket for the gauges that go in-between the fork top and the top fork bolt. That is some weird #$%* to smoke.

[fendersrule]

Once these forks are assembled and filled, I get about 1" of free movement moving the fork leg up the fork tube before pressure happens. Is this normal for these types of shocks?

[754]

Did you insert damper rod into forktube, before adding spring?
 Think that is how they go. Are you using a manual, or just winging it?

[fendersrule]

Using manual, but it's always not the best at explaining.

These forks don't have dampening rods...they are unlike anything I've done before.

http://www.westernhillshondayamaha.com/OEMpartfinder.htm#/Honda/SL350_A__MOTORCYCLE%2c_JPN%2c_VIN%23_SL350-1000001/FRONT_FORK/SL350-JPN-A/2Y13340SF13340S04A

Assembly I've done after cleaning:

Finish fork tubes (pistons, clips, etc).

Insert "base" into fork tubes. This is the peice that's at the bottom that the screw goes into.

Insert fork tubes into fork legs using some oil.

Slip on seal spacer/holder sleeves.

Drive in seals.

Install seal clips.

Install springs (just drop them inside).

Install spring clips (no grooves as I've shown)

Fill with oil.

Install caps.

[grcamna2]

Fenders,
I'm sure,given the chance that you'd trade these forks for a pr. of SL350K2 forks in a heartbeat !        I looked at the online parts description diagrams...

[fendersrule]

I saw this "play" before I tore them down.

Maybe it's normal for Motosport shocks?

[grcamna2]

Fenders,
When I looked at the parts description diagram of your K0 compared to the K2 I was thinking if it was me I'd be tempted to see if I could find a pr. for the K2...,if that K0 was my 'keeper'. You keeping it or 'flippin' ?

[fendersrule]

What's bad about the K0 Forks? Please inform me because I want to learn!

I'm going to just assume that the K0 forks do not have tensioner rods. I'm also assuming that because of this design, there should be some free play before the tension occurs...

[grcamna2]

Fenders,
if it was ME...I would prefer the K2 forks.  I think they're a more modern design,more like the sohc4's. Try comparing the 2 diagrams on the parts description breakdowns and you'll see what I mean;they have less clips & snap rings,etc. I like the K2's more anyway  imo

[fendersrule]

Just got off the phone with a master Honda guy.

He said that the K0 forks are actually amazing forks…and they are cloned from some famous forks….

He found the issue. The issue is that my springs are worn…

So now I'm looking for new springs. I could "shim" them if I wanted to, but would rather just get new springs.

[754]

Shim them for now, easy to change. Later..

[fendersrule]

Well, It was decided that my springs have some sag. About 15mm of it, actually. So I took a trip to the hardware store and got these three items, all which measures up to 15mm:



QUICKLY welded them together, and did some clean up work. The "extruding" side of the shim will go against the spring to keep it centered. Works pretty well, actually!




Dropped them in, and now they take up for the space that was missing. In fact, it "pushes" on the spring just a hair bit, so it's actually a perfect fit:



Forks passed the bench test. Man, they are the best looking forks in the garage now:



Done! While the "shimming" is really a temporary thing, they probably will get me by for a few more years. This is a novelty bike at best for me, so it's not going to be used much. Eventually, new springs will be going in, but they are operating satisfactory right now and will do great.

The reason to me that the "rodded" fork is better is because when you do get sag in the springs (oh, it will happen!), you can can just tighten the nut on the rod to make up for it. Doesn't help that the springs still have sag, but you can at least remove the play. With these older forks, when you get sag, you get play and there's NOTHING to adjust. That is why a shim is needed. There is no more play anymore, so I guess a job well done...

Thanks all.

And thanks to Hondaman for forcing me to do this myself. Took awhile, though.