Topic: 1971 CL70 Project..... 117cc *Updates* and now a CL90, too!

[MoMo]

cool project, the little Hondas were indestructible as long as maintenance was performed regularly and they do command high prices  on the open market, at least around here(Philly area west).

[Scott S]

 Lots of pics from Terry at Fire Power Minis! Won't be long and I'll be putting her back together!



 6V 4 speed taper, old, and new 9.5mm stroker.





 Swell OEM 4 speed.





HD clutch plates
 HV oil pump
 HD cam chain
 51mm stroker
 54mm aluminum jug, hi-comp piston
 25/22 race head
 New fasteners, seals, gaskets

[Scott S]

 Getting closer! Soon, I'll be able to experience 117cc of Fury!





 My drive chain is about 4 or 5 links too short with the new sprockets. I'll have to order another. I have one bullet connecter to repair, charge the battery, install fuel lines and change the headlight bulb.
 It won't be long now!

 One thing that has me stumped is that the throttle doesn't snap back as it should. Nothing is binding and the spring in the carb is new and strong. I'm guessing it's just the old cable and internal friction is causing it to not snap back. I'll probably try a new throttle cable and see if that helps.

[strynboen]

is there a contra valve before the iol cooler..so it not emtyes.vhen stopped engine...otherveise there are a problem,,,as the pump must fill the cooler,before the oil comes to the cam ..an unnessery delay of luberikasion...
if the head are a nev type vith bearings...there are no problem...but the orginal have no bearing..the can runs direkt in the head..ve have a lot of vear problems vith the cd 50 in denmark...specily if they run at low oil level...they often did...

[KayOne]

Nice build! I have a '68 S90 that put a 104cc big bore kit, cam and ported head. Be careful, you are going to find out how marginal your brakes are 

Have fun, you are going to have a blast.

[Scott S]

is there a contra valve before the iol cooler..so it not emtyes.vhen stopped engine...otherveise there are a problem,,,as the pump must fill the cooler,before the oil comes to the cam ..an unnessery delay of luberikasion...
if the head are a nev type vith bearings...there are no problem...but the orginal have no bearing..the can runs direkt in the head..ve have a lot of vear problems vith the cd 50 in denmark...specily if they run at low oil level...they often did...

 The engine kit included a new race head and a high volume oil pump. Hopefully, it should be OK. I talked to Terry at FPM about running a cooler and he didn't recommend against it.

[strynboen]

i can see the cam at last photo..it are  a all bearing cam....so no problem..they can run almost at oil fumes

[Scott S]

 She LIVES!

 Still need to adjust carb/cable and get the idle right. Just a few more things to wrap up before the first test ride!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3lRm7ndWNQ&feature=youtu.be

[hoodellyhoo]

Congrats! Sounds mean! (at least as mean as 117cc can sound )

[Scott S]

 Update time!

 I got the bike running and ran into a problem with first gear. Terry at FPM stepped up and fixed everything. It now has a TRX70 shift shaft, forks, etc., so it's 4-up now. Everything works great!

 Got her running again and WHOA!, the power! It promptly dumped me! I put 500 miles on my ZRX1100 last weekend without a scratch and didn't make it 50 feet on the CL70/117!  The front end is SOOO light and the power! Oh, man! The power!

 Little bit of road rash on my knee and elbow, but the bike is no worse for wear.

 It ran great when I first rode it. The only time I noticed any cutting out or stumbling was at WOT on a top speed run. I saw 60+ on the speedo!

 Let it sit in the driveway for a couple of hours while me and some friends wrenched, drank beers, etc. Went to start it up again and had to kick it, like, 50 times. The plug was carbon fouled. Dry, not oily or gas fouled. Cleaned the plug and got it going and now it seems to run poorly over half throttle.
 It runs well at lower RPM's but seems to miss or cut out at higher RPM's.

 I cleaned the plug again today and added some fresh gas. This is how the plug looked after a plug chop. I took it to higher RPM's in 2nd, killed the power and pulled in the clutch. Coasted back to the garage and pulled the plug.
 Looks maybe a little lean? I'd actually be OK with that tan color if it wasn't running poorly on the top end.
 The carb came with extra jets. Should I go bigger on the main? Maybe check to make sure the points or timing didn't get out of whack?
 Suggestions?

[strynboen]

thange  the plug..this hondas eats the plugs...so have alvays some ekstra on the bike...the elektrode make short to frame...gas/oil can make it..a glassblast of the plugt often lives them up...

http://www.gsparkplug.com/shop/spark-plugs/spark-plugs/bosch-u3cc.html....
here are some alternative plugs ngk is not 100 %positive ...i have before used nippon denso..they are better...think bosch are top kvality

[KayOne]

Try a plug chop in a higher gear with a new plug to get a true indication before you make any main jet changes. BTW, if that was a plug chop with a new plug, it would be too rich. My S90 ate a pile of plugs till I got the needle and main jet close.

[Scott S]

 I went to my local shop for spark plugs and asked the mechanic for advice.
 Gave it a tune up: valve adjustment (they were a little loose), points and timing. I set the points to open right on the F mark and the gap is correct.
 Installed a new plug and gave it a chop and it showed LEAN.

 Pulled the carb and it was clean as a whistle. Checked float height: 22mm. Went from 88 to 92 on the main and that seemed to help up top, but it's still not easy to start and it wants to die when I'm coming to a stop. The plug now looks nice. Tan on the electrode and clean on the porcelain after a 2nd gear plug chop.
 I checked to make sure the air filter isn't smothering the intake on the mouth of the carb for the low speed circuits....it's not.
 The air screw is somewhere around 1.24-15 turns out. I played with it a bit and don't remember exactly where I left it at this point.

 Any ideas?

 One thing that I'm wondering about: I can actually start to see some of the spring on the idle screw. Not the idle mixture/air screw, but the actual idle screw.
 Is it possible that I have the cable adjusted in such a way that I have the idle screw backed out too far and there is air getting by? Guess I should've checked for a vacuum leak while I was messing with it earlier.

 Otherwise.....what next?

[Scott S]

I think I got it!

 The air screw/idle mixture screw was too far out. I screwed it in....it only likes about 1/2 a turn out, maybe a tad less....and it seems to be doing fine. No more dying at idle or when coming to a stop. Easier to crank, too.
 I bet I could have gone a little fatter on the main jet, but it seems to be doing fine.

[Davidov]

Hope you guys don't mind me posting this here...HEY! It IS a SOHC.... 

 The plan all along was to keep the patina. The tank had some varnish and minor rust inside, so I started to clean it using my tried and true methods.
 Here are all the fluids I needed.

Did the Marine Clean get most of the inside gunk off?

Glad to see you built up the Honda engine instead of using the Chinese junk.

[Scott S]

 The Marine clean did a pretty good job. There was a little bit left in the very bottom creases. I could've probably kept working on it and gotten it all out, but I'll just run an external filter on this one.

 I've used "The Works" method several times and gotten tanks clean enough to run the stock petcock filter and no external filters.

[Scott S]

[Scott S]

 Well, I kept blowing up the 117cc engine. After the third time, I pushed it to the back of the garage. Terry at Firepower Minis offered to give it a once over for free so, after sitting for a few months, I shipped it to him.
 He's close to getting it back together. It was definitely running hot and blew the head gasket the last go 'round, but we can't really determine why. He's used the same combo many, many times. The jetting was really fat and the plug looked OK, etc., etc.
  He's going to take out a little compression and install a cam with a little more duration. I'm also going to go up one tooth on the front sprocket. This thing had PLENTY of torque. I could hardly keep the front wheel on the ground.
 Hopefully, I'll have it back soon.

 In the meantime, I picked up a basket case '67 CL90. And I do mean basket case!
 Long story short, it was given to a friend for free. He bought a bunch of parts, including new tires, wiring harness, cables, etc., and then threw in the towel. I bought it from him for less than the price of the parts.
 This thing looks like it sat at the bottom of a lake for a while. But that's OK. I'm going with a full on patina look to sorta match the CL70. I'll make all the important stuff work properly but keep it looking like crap....LOL.
 I didn't even bother with the engine. The plan is to install a Lifan 125 eventually.

 Here's how it was when he got it. Rough. ROUGH>

[Scott S]

 It came with brand new knobbies, already mounted.

[Scott S]

 Here's basically what I started with, plus a Rubbermade bin full of parts.



 After a couple of afternoons of wrenching, I had this:

[Scott S]

  On any rusty parts, I sanded or wire brushed them and treated with rust converter. I'm leaving them with that look when possible. Installed new seals and rebuilt the forks. Installed new steering stem bearings. Greased everything that needed greasing. Etc., etc.

 Redid the brakes.

[Scott S]

 Repaired some pinholes in the tank and lined it with POR 15. The tank was originally silver on these bikes, so I primed it, sprayed with silver, fogged with black, then a metallic silver. I then lightly sanded with 600 grit to give it a faux patina to match the rest of the frame.

[Scott S]

 Here's how it sits right now. I need to pull the new wiring harness and I have a small shopping list for the swap meet at Barber.
 Once it's a complete roller sans engine I'll look into what it takes to bolt up the 125.

 The plan is to eventually have the CL70/117 and CL90/125 as runabouts that we can load up into Creepy Van and then take into town when we camp, etc. They both should easily do 55-60 mph+ when done.

[Scott S]

 It seems that Terry at Fire Power has gone out of business and now refuses to return my engine.....anyone near Flint, Michigan want to go Brimmer him and get my #$%* back?

 I have a lead on a complete, titled S90 from a co-worker that only needs the kick start shaft replaced. That will probably take the place of the basket case CL90.
 I'll probably go through with the original plan of a Lifan 125 or Piranha 140 in the CL70.

[Scott S]

OK, bringing this one back to life....

 I found a brand new Lifan 125 semi-automatic for a great price. I would have preferred the full manual, but I can get a really great deal on this one. I know that there have been a million swaps done but the more I read, the less I know.

 Here's a pic of the actual engine and a copy/paste of the specs:



FROM PCC MOTOR:  Brand New LIFAN 1P54FMI 125cc high performance race engine. Upgrade your stock 50cc to this 125cc monster, you can feel the power difference immediately. Ride faster, jump higher.

LIFAN offers with this engine of the newest generation all tuning- and racing-fans best quality and highest performance state-of-the-art!

The engine comes with a high-quality cylinder head made from aluminum, a reinforced kick starter axle and extra large valves and canals!

Furthermore it comes with a high-quality 4-disc clutch!

With 7.4 kW by 7500 rpm the engine reaches more than the triple performance of a standard CRF50 engine. Best of all, it comes with 22MM  racing carburetor. and alloy performance head!!
Specifications:

Single cylinder, 4-stroke, 2 valves, OHC racing head, air cooled, 125cc
Bore x Stroke: 54mm x 54mm, this is a 'square' engine for best balance between power and torque

Dimension: 17"X11"X9"
Valve Sizes: 27mm intake, 23mm exhaust
Displacement: 123.7cc
Compression Ratio: 9.47:1
Carburettor: 22mm racing carburetor
Ignition: CDI, 12 volt, permanent magnetic stator
Maximum Power: 8.5 Kw DIN @ 9,500 rpm 
Rated Power: 6.5 Kw @ 7,500 rpm
Torque: at least 8.8 Nm @ 5,500 rpm 
Gears: 4-speed, semi auto clutch, 4 up.
Gear Ratios: 1st 2.833:1, 2nd 1.706:1, 3rd 1.238:1, 4th 0.958:1
Final Drive: 14 tooth #420 front sprocket included (we have other sprocket on sale too!!)
Lubrication: 900ml, 10W/40 4-stroke motorcycle oil, pressure and splash
Fuel: Unleaded

Package Contains:

Buyer will receive Lifan 125CC Motor, 22MM Carburetor, Intake manifold, intake gaskets, Shifter, Kick Starter, Wiring Harness, CDI, Spark Plug and Ignition Coil. This package has almost everything, excepts a bike to bolt on.

From the wiring diagrams I could find online, the five-wire CDI, which this has, has the 12-volt output wire for lights & charging. Is that correct? Does this engine have the lighting coil?
 I want to run and charge a battery. I want to run head and tail/brake lights. I think all I need is a regulator and, of course, a new 12v battery and bulbs.