Author Topic: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.  (Read 2292 times)

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Offline ebrown0104

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1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« on: June 02, 2014, 08:33:34 PM »
Started out as this:



I work at a Harley dealership, and we got this thing on trade-in.  The sales manager knows I like weird stuff so he asked if I wanted to buy it for $400.  Well hell yeah,with only 25,000 miles it's worth that in parts at least.  It cranked over fine, but didn't run.  I had originally planned on just getting it running, selling it for a few bucks, and taking the profit and putting it towards a 750K or F.  The more I started working on it though, the more I liked it.  It was in really good condition - no rusted screws, the exhaust was in good shape, seat looked good, etc.  It was a way nicer bike than it should've been for $400.  Plus, even in decent shape the A models aren't worth much, and to find a comparable K or F model I was looking at $3000.  Against my better judgement, I decided I was gonna build Herman to my liking.



I had originally planned a cafe-type build, but since it's never gonna be a vintage road-racer I kinda changed my plans.  I still like the stripped-down "add lightness" idea of a cafe, but the big seat cowl, clip-ons, and upside-down front end doesn't really fit the character of a motorcycle with 2 gears and 50 horsepower.  I kept looking at the chrome fenders and decided I needed to use those, since they were in such good shape.  So, my idea had changed to making this thing a sporty-looking boulevard cruiser.  I wanted to keep the nice-but-well-worn look that the bike was already sporting instead of opting for a full-out restoration.  The flaking paint from the engine cases and the faded paint added character (not to mention a lot less money).  I was also inspired by these grips, and decided that I needed them.  They are very 70's, and the color complements the red/purple/faded brown paint well.



I decided that the stock seat needed to go, it's huge, heavy, and doesn't follow the shape of the bike.  So, out comes the fiberglass:



After getting the seat molded (which mounts using the original hinge and lock assembly) and sent off to a friend of mine who does upholstery, I started on the chassis.  The original suspension looks more suited for a dual-sport than a low-and-slow street machine, so I decided to drop it down.  In the front, I took a 3/4" wheel spacer and cut it to 1-1/2" long.  I then stuck this between the damper tube and top-out spring, effectively starting the forks with 1-1/2" of compression.  As an added bonus, it adds preload to the fairly flimsy factory springs.  Here's a comparison pic between lowered and not lowered:



I pulled the trees apart, lost about half of the bearings, and cleaned out the 35-year-old grease.  Unsurprisingly, after reassembly with much newer grease the front end no longer had a notchy feel.  The original chandelier-sized front signals needed to go, and along with them the overly-ornate triple tree covers.  A set of $10 headlight brackets fixed both problems with ease.  My next issue was that the headlight now sat much lower down the fork tubes and left a big gap between it and the gauges (plus the gauges just stuck up really high anyway).  Some longer bolts, a few chrome spacers, and there you have it - everything on the front of the bike was successfully lowered (minus the handlebars, but that's coming soon).  I also slid the forks up 1/2" in the trees, dropping the front a total of 2".  I replaced the brake line with a black braided one while I was at it, deciding not to trust my well-being on an old rubber hose full of old fluid.  Took the master cylinder and caliper apart, cleaned, and bolted back on:



Lowering the front made everything look better.  The front wheel looks better, bigger even.  I originally hated the front fender with it's whale tail mudflap, but with it lowered I actually like it a lot.  Crazy how things like that happen.

Here's the bars.  Bikemaster Superbike bars (pay no attention to my walls that don't exist!):



Next up was the rear end.  The junk battery that was in the bike had been leaking onto the swingarm and ate the paint off.  So, out comes the swingarm, and while I was at it I decided to remove the chain guard mounts.  All of them.  From the swingarm and from the frame.  A few coats of gloss black and everything's well again.  I soaked the original 630 chain and sprockets in Purple Power, scrubbed them down, got high on fumes, and re-used them for now.  They should probably be replaced, so when I do I'll move to the much more common 530 setup.  Took the back brake apart, freed the stuck parts, lubed, and re-assembled.  Added a set of 11" eBay shocks to drop the back the matching 2", and now we're getting somewhere:



In case you were wondering why the bike was parked on a 2x4, with the bike now 2" lower my kickstand was 2" too long.  This was remedied by chopping it in half, removing the offending portion, and then welding it back together.  A few more generous coats of gloss black, and the bike is back to the proper lean angle.  The center stand was removed because it's ugly.  Functional, but ugly.  And it's weight that's not necessary.  Mainly cause it's ugly though.  It's like having jackstands welded to your car's bumper.

Now that the chassis is properly sorted, I need to get this thing running properly.  I took the carbs apart approximately 15 times trying to get it right (that's only sort of an exaggeration).  One day it would run great, and then the next day it would barely idle with full choke.  Found a tear in the accelerator pump, which means it worked sometimes but not others.  Replaced float needles after I came home to a puddle of gas in my garage when I forgot to shut off the petcock.  This sorted my carb issues out, but it still wasn't running great.  I decided to check other things and determined that one of my spark plug caps was broken, but again, only sometimes.  It certainly explains some of the problems I'm having.  For $3 each I replaced all four of them to be safe, along with some new NGK D8EA's.  Removed the valve cover, checked valve clearances, and reinstalled with some Hondabond to fix the leak that was filling the spark plug holes up with oily gunk.  Set points gap, got it timed properly, and that helped a little.  Dropped the oil pan, cleaned it out (it looked pretty good actually).  So one day I started messing with it again, and it just started working how it should.  So naturally, now that it's running OK, I decided to buy a set of 77-78 K model carbs, get rid of the airbox, and order a Mac 4-1 exhaust.  If it's broken, you fix it, and then break it again, right?



These are the stock carbs (I haven't rebuilt the K carbs yet), but the K setup will look the same.  Everyone says that pod filters are no good, but why?  Cause no velocity stacks, that's why.  I yanked the stacks out of the airbox, clamped them on, and threw on some foam headphone pads as filters.  They fit perfectly.  Changed my pilot jets to 42, mains to 130, 2-1/4 turns on the mixture screws, and shimmed the needles up.  Fires up from cold with 1/2 choke and only needs to warm up for a minute before you can take off the choke completely.  No pops, backfires, hesitation, flat spots, nothing.  It runs better than my 2007 fuel-injected Ducati Monster at up to 1/4 throttle.  Once I get the bigger K carbs situated, this bike should scoot pretty well.

Now comes the exhaust.  Since it's designed to fit K and F models, it's not concerned with things like oil pans hanging off the bottom of the engine.  This, obviously, is a problem, since the oil pan is occupying the same area that the exhaust header wants to reside.  Where there's a will there's a way, though, so out came a hammer and die grinder (and some busted knuckles and lots of expletives) and after about 6 hours of messing around I got that son of a B on there:



I drilled a few holes in the baffle to get a little more noise, but it's still fairly docile.

So now all that's left is some electrical stuff.  I added mini LED signals to the front, a new tail light/turn signal/license plate mount combo to the back fender (bonus points for being able to use the original mounting holes), an EP35 flasher so my signals will blink, new lithium ion battery, and moved the horn under the seat.

Speaking of seat, it was about this time my seat was getting finished up:



Yes sir/madam, my buddy Mike was able to match the seat to those funky brown grips.  I was geeked when I went to pick it up, and even more geeked when I got it mounted:



Bonus points if you noticed the push button fuel door release.  It's actually a Harley item (part #53919-04A), and it fit without modification.  Seriously, I just screwed it in place of the original (missing) lock, and it works great.

So, I got the seat on, spent some time polishing the aluminum (but not too much, since I want it to still look kinda old and funky), waxed the paint, modified my side covers to open up the area around the carbs, and got it all running for the maiden voyage on June 1, 2014.  After more than 2 months of nearly-constant work during my free time, I finally got it done.  And it runs awesome.  Herman is the coolest bike I've ever owned, and it cost me less than $2000 to build it.







This picture was before I chopped up the side covers, you can see it sorta reaches out to nowhere:



... and that's better:



I think that I accomplished my goal of making a cool-looking comfortable semi-cruiser that has some cafe elements without being a cafe racer and also looks simultaneously worn-out and well-taken-care-of and has some Frisco bobber thrown in there too and is stripped of anything superfluous.

I'm planning on a new cam over the winter.  Maybe a set of 836 pistons.  New chain and sprockets.  Maybe sell it.  Who knows.  If you actually read all of that, thanks!  You're a better person than I am.  If you click on the pictures, they'll get bigger.  I don't know why they are so small.

Anyway, let me know what you think!
« Last Edit: June 02, 2014, 09:17:56 PM by ebrown0104 »

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2014, 09:15:27 PM »
That's the best looking Hondamatic I've seen. Great budget too.
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline zl_havoc

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Re: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2014, 01:00:23 AM »
That is one nice bike. I had a 77 Hondamatic that was no where near as cool as that bike. Great build!!

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Offline BPellerine

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Re: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2014, 06:14:43 PM »
very nice and some fresh ideas too!the seat changes everything!bill
1978 CB 750K ard and webers
another anfob

Offline ebrown0104

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Re: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2014, 08:18:22 PM »
Thanks everyone. I've been having a blast riding this thing. But, like everything old I've had a few problems pop up. The master cylinder is starting to seep from near the lever. It still stops ok, but it looks like I'll need a rebuild kit. No biggie. Also I have a leak near the front sprocket. Probably the output seal, haven't checked it yet. Still no biggie. The rear shocks are either way too hard or way too soft, cause it crashes over sharp bumps. Plus the seat is kinda thin and my ass bones bottom out on the seat pan. So I'm gonna have a gel pad put in the front seat and if that doesn't fix it maybe look for different/better shocks.

Here's a picture with my other bike:

« Last Edit: June 07, 2014, 08:22:59 PM by ebrown0104 »

Offline BPellerine

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Re: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2014, 06:23:51 PM »
two cool bikes!maybe just a surface mount gel pad so you can keep the seat the same?bill
1978 CB 750K ard and webers
another anfob

Offline ebrown0104

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Re: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2014, 03:48:56 PM »
I got the new 1977 K carbs installed and it screams now.  OK, not really, but it did wake it up some.  The needles are adjustable, so I set them at the center groove (they were on the highest groove originally).  I have 45 pilots and 135 mains in there, but I run out of power after 65mph, so I'm gonna go up to 140 mains.  Up to 3/4 throttle though it runs great.  I have the timing advanced some, it seems to help throttle response from a stop.

I put on new sprockets and chain.  I went with a 530 x-ring and 17/45 sprockets (stock is 17/48).  It stretches out the gearing a little without killing low end power.  I made a 170-mile run on Sunday at 55-60mph and got about 40mpg.  When I eventually go with a cam and big bore I may drop to a 42 rear sprocket.

I also ordered a set of Hagon shocks, same length (11.4").  That should hopefully get the back of my bike to ride nice and smooth.  Once I get them I'll let everyone know.

Offline Feragos

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Re: 1978 750 Hondamatic, AKA Herman the Honda.
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2017, 03:49:07 AM »
That's some awesome job. Congratulations it's really inspiring.
I haven't even though of dropping the forks before I read your post.
Thanks.