Topic: Newbie starts on a 1972 Honda CB500 Four

[asnark]

Hello everyone,

First off I want to say thanks to everyone here. I've had this bike for just a few days and this forum is invaluable to me.

I recently got a 1974 1972 Honda CB500 Four. I'm very excited as I'm a new rider and new to all things mechanical in general. I come from an IT background so it's great to get my hands dirty.

The bike cold started fine from the kick start when I got it.

Here's a gallery of the bike: http://imgur.com/a/KjJgm.

It came with:

• a 750 550 tank
• racer bars & the original ones
• no front fender
• bigger headlamp - 7in I believe
• a clymer's manual!

Some challenges to work on:

• dirty/rusty gas tank
• dead/destroyed battery
• leaks oil from oil pan
• oil filter screw is stripped
• some weirdness with the clutch - not wanting to switch to neutral while running
• speedometer is not attached well - e.g. attached with zip ties
• carb clamps aren't tight at all

Right now I'm:

• Cleaning the gas tank
• Doing my best to get this frickin' stripped bolt off. I hear this is a right of passage with these bikes.
• Purchased a new battery. I think the old one was cooked by the PO with a car charger.
• Drained the oil.

Over the next few days I hope to:

• get an inline fuel filter
• finish cleaning the gas tank
• replace the oil filter and get a new bolt
• actually ride the bike a bit!

Happy to hear any advice/suggestions, as I'm new to all of this.

[rb550four]

Welcome.
  Stuck bolts and Phillips? Got to get an impact driver, propane torch for a touch of heat and PB Blaster or equal.
   A hair dryer for the rubber parts.

[Stev-o]

First off, welcome.   Looks like a 550 tank to me, how are you cleaning it?

Buy a new battery, I like the Scorpions...

http://www.batterystuff.com/powersports-batteries/sYT12C.html

[goldarrow]

1. Evaporust
2. New sealed battery scorpion like stev-o suggest
3. Oil pan seal still available from honda
4. I just use locking pliers.
5. May be a feature, may be time to replace clutch, but try adjust first
6. Need new cable? Nuts and bolts?
7. Home Depot sells clamps

[dave500]

once you get the oil filter bolt out grind whats left of the hex down to a circle so a larger nut fits over it and have it tack welded on,only just nip it up in future.

[Bankerdanny]

To release the stuck bolt on my 550 I used a cold chisel and a mallet. The chisel bit into the flange of the nut nicely and after a few good whacks it started to turn and because I was carefull there was no damage to the housing.

I replaced the bolt with a new one with a larger 17MM head (readily available on eBay).

[asnark]

Can't believe how fast time flies. I was in such a rush to buy the bike now I'm lagging on actually riding it!


Finally got the stuck bolt off. Ended up grinding it a bit + working at it with a cold chisel. 

Started with:



Vice grips and a file + equal parts enthusiasm and inexperience let me with:



Finally broke down and bought a dremel:



Replaced the head with a 17mm I found off of ebay. Thanks Bankerdanny!


As far as the battery goes, man, I should have listened/searched this forum first. I ended up getting another clone of the same battery: XT12N12A-4A-1 Xtreme Battery. But just the thought of having a sealed battery makes me sigh a bit.




Replaced the oil pan gasket.

Emptied the oil and put in 20w-50. I know this is a bit of a contentious topic, but I thought 20w-50 would be best for the time being. I plan on changing the oil soon again at any rate.

Replaced the oil filter. It was black as hell and extremely brittle.

Clamped up the carbs.

Replaced the brass gaskets around the exhaust. I was not planning on this - but I had some from the PO, and I ended up taking off the exhaust in order to work on the oil filter bolt easier.

Bike seems to run idle well so long as there is enough gas in the tank. Starts fine from the electric start. Kickstart is a different story - but I think I just need to get the hang of it.

First off, welcome.   Looks like a 550 tank to me, how are you cleaning it?

Could well be a 550 tank. PO said 750 so that's what I was repeating.

Here's a picture of the gas tank before. I tried to clean it with vinegar but was unaware of the flash rusting affect:




Ending up cleaning the rest of it out with evaporust.


A few more things to do:

1) rpm cable was being held on with zip ties - need to get another/or secure it somehow. There is also a weird sound near where the RPM cable connects. I assume I hear that because I don't have the cable connected.  I might record the sound it and post it here if it continues once I replace the cable.

2) clutch cable need to be adjusted. Seems to grind when I shift to first - doesn't want to shift back to neutral. Didn't ride the bike much as I wasn't comfortable with the sounds the clutch was making. I think if I adjust it right it will be fine. I was messing with it earlier trying to make the clutch softer/easier to pull and ended up making it worse.

3) I put on a fuel filter - but it was plastic and I was afraid it would melt against the engine. I think i'll get something along the lines of this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-4-6mm-Chrome-Glass-Universal-ATV-DIRT-BIKE-Oil-Cleaner-Inline-Fuel-Filter-New-/181431340941?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AHonda%7CModel%3ACB500&hash=item2a3e268f8d&vxp=mtr I think I cleaned the tank decently enough but the plastic filter caught quite a few metal/junk filaments.

4) I'm about 5'4" so the bike is a little tall for me. Eventually I might try to replace or shave down the current seat.

[Stev-o]

Yeah, these bikes seem to run better with gas in the tank. 

Sounds like you need to clean the tank better.

I hope you are using motorcycle oil.

You may want to replace the the clutch cable.  And the rpm cable?

Did you know Honda did not make a 1974 CB500??

http://www.sohc4.net/cb500/

[calj737]

Did you know Honda did not make a 1974 CB500??

I thought I might have slipped bourbon in my coffee instead of cream when I read that. Thanks, Stev-o.

[asnark]

Did you know Honda did not make a 1974 CB500??

http://www.sohc4.net/cb500/

Hrm - well the title says 1974. Looking at the engine number it corresponds to CB500 K1 1972 here: http://www.sohc4.net/cb500-model-guide/.

[wowbagger]

Look at the VIN on the neck. It's most likely a CB550 frame with a CB500 engine in it.

[Stev-o]

Did you know Honda did not make a 1974 CB500??

http://www.sohc4.net/cb500/

Hrm - well the title says 1974. Looking at the engine number it corresponds to CB500 K1 1972 here: http://www.sohc4.net/cb500-model-guide/.

So, then it's a '72 model.  It may have sat on the dealer floor and not sold 'till '74 [or got lost on the bottom of a ship?!]. 
That was common back then, my '71 was titled as a '72.

I pointed that out so you don't get confused when ordering parts.

[asnark]

Think this could have caused my shifting problems? That and a spring that seemed completely extended...

I've been searching for the part, but I can't find a spare. Also - what do you call it? "clutch arm lever assembly" ? "clutch adjuster" ?

Edit - found it -  sled clutch lifter 22810323000 -  http://www.cmsnl.com/cb500-four-k1-england_model14660/sled-cluh-lifter_22810323000/#.U7SXbvldV8E

[asnark]

So, then it's a '72 model.  It may have sat on the dealer floor and not sold 'till '74 [or got lost on the bottom of a ship?!]. 
That was common back then, my '71 was titled as a '72.

I pointed that out so you don't get confused when ordering parts.

Thanks! I did get puzzled a few times when I was searching for 1974 Honda CB500 and wasn't finding anything....

[calj737]

Should be part #3 in this diagram:
http://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb500-500-four-k1-1972-usa_model460/partslist/E++11.html#results

Clutch Lifter Sled

You might make a bookmark to that site as they have very good exploded views of the assemblies and part names.

[2strokeTrush]

Good luck on the clutch rod lifter, Its a never ending battle on my 71 500. Been all summer and I'v gotten nowhere.

[Stev-o]

Yes, that could be part of your issue.  That part is NLA, but here is one on eBay....


http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-OEM-HONDA-THREAD-CLUTCH-LIFTER-CB500-500-FOUR-22810-323-000-/121370442561?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c423dfb41&vxp=mtr

[calj737]

You might check with Bill Benton. Runor is, he has at least 1 of everything Honda ever produced lying about in his shop-

[asnark]

Found one on ebay used but a bit cheaper than the rest: http://www.ebay.com/itm/360976390554?item=360976390554&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME:L:OC:US:3160&vxp=mtr

I figure I should take out the pushrod too and measure it. I'm guess it could be a bit short from reading Number13's clutch thread.

[calj737]

If you need a replacement push rod, let me know. I recently made up 2 from 303 stainless, and have an extra.

[asnark]

If you need a replacement push rod, let me know. I recently made up 2 from 303 stainless, and have an extra.

Thanks calj737. I pulled the push rod out today, and it's maybe a hair under 10 and 1/8 inches. But notice some of the wear on the left clutch cover side. I've seen other push rods on this forum sheared off in about that same area. Should I replace it? Go with it? What would you like for the push rod?




The fact that the push rod is long enough kinda troubles me. My clutch cable is super hard to pull, plus some shifting issues. If I loosen it up, it won't engage. After thinking about it last night, it seemed to me the only thing that would cause the hard pull, and the not engaging would be a worn/short push rod. Now that I know it's not that, I guess it has to be the sled or the cable itself.

The cable was laid against the engine and the covering has been melted. It's also a bit long for the cafe bars. But if I remove the clutch cable from the sled it pulls just fine. Leading me to think it's the worn sled.

edit - nevermind. I feel a little silly - but I just noticed the clutch cable is badly damaged. This was surely it:

[asnark]

...

Sounds like you need to clean the tank better.

I hope you are using motorcycle oil.

...

A friend told me I should use a sealant after doing the tank clean, if particles are still coming out.

I'm not using motorcycle oil. Here's what I got. http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/ORO0/20505QT/N0430.oap?ck=Search_N0430_-1_-1&pt=N0430&ppt=C0162

I've been reading more about how conventional motor oil is bad for the clutch plates, gaskets, etc, so I'll be changing it to motorcycle oil soon.

[calj737]

When you removed the left side cover, did you locate and re-install the steel ball? Without it, you will never get it adjusted properly. You also mention the cable being long. If too long, you'll need to adjust the cable so tight that you'll have no "free play" which will prevent the clutch plates from fully engaging, and incomplete disengagement while operating. This will make it very hard to shift...

I'd only be concerned about the viability of the rod if it shows signs of wear and/or metal burrs. The end is steel, pressed onto an alloy shaft. They often break at that union. If you are nervous about yours, I'll happily send one along. PM me your address. But find that steel ball for the left side end!

[asnark]

Yes - I do have the ball bearing.

I'll PM you calj737, thanks!

[asnark]

Quick update here:

Not sure if its calj737's push rod [THANKS!], a new(er) clutch sled, and a shorter clutch cable, or a combination there of, but the bike shifts a whole heck of a lot better now.

I'm still missing a lot of power though. It seems like I have to turn the throttle all the way in 2nd and 3rd and even then I'm not getting much more than 2k or 3k rpms. I'm going to adjust the throttle play and fuel lines to make it pop a bit more.