Author Topic: 1976 550K Project  (Read 24196 times)

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Offline calj737

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #50 on: December 12, 2014, 10:12:56 AM »
Running points? I'd check the ignition over really well....
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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of it's victim may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #51 on: December 12, 2014, 01:12:26 PM »
I readjusted all the valves and points and everything was going well until this happened...



I was hoping it wouldn't leak any oil but after idling for a few second it started to weep out, so another is on its way from 4into1.com. When it gets here I'm gonna check the timing again (didn't do that today), but after that I'm not sure where to go if the revs are still hanging up.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline goldarrow

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #52 on: December 12, 2014, 06:54:21 PM »
At least now you know your top end is getting oil
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Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #53 on: December 12, 2014, 07:19:24 PM »
I know a vacuum leak will cause the revs to hang up, but will it also cause it to misfire and struggle up hills? Or is this more related to a timing issue?
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #54 on: December 17, 2014, 10:11:10 PM »
Set the timing statically, got it as close as i could and I'm pretty sure that fixed the misfire. Replaced the broken tappet cover today too. It's still running on 3 cylinders, and I'm pretty sure it's a carburetor issue. I replaced the float needle, but maybe it's something else? If i leave the fuel on it'll slowly drip fuel out of the overflow lines for the #4 carb still, which indicates a float issue. I'll get it figured out eventually haha.

Question: will running lean/rich cause the revs to hang up as if it has a vacuum leak?
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline seanbarney41

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #55 on: December 18, 2014, 03:25:38 AM »
Dude, your float needle looked to be mechanically fine...but think your problems might have anything to do with your carbs being filthy?  Pull them off and rebuild before wasting any more time.  I am guessing your idle jet will be plugged on #4.
If it works good, it looks good...

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #56 on: December 23, 2014, 04:15:21 PM »
Yep, you're right. Chalk that one up to my inexperience with the carburetors. The original #4 carb was damaged and I replaced it with a soda blasted one from Harisluv, so if anything is wrong it's definitely not the carb body (and now the float needle). So i can at least mark those off the list of things that could be causing the fuel flow issue.

When I get some time I'll pull the bowl off again and go over the idle/main jets meticulously, then check the needle and emulsifier tube again. If it's none of those all that's left is the floats themselves.

Edit: I replaced the #1 carb body, not the #4. So one of the small orifices could very well be plugged somewhere in the #4 carb.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 01:47:25 PM by mrfish2 »
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #57 on: January 07, 2015, 04:48:34 PM »
Replaced every brass piece in the carb but to no avail, she still won't fire on that cylinder. Ordered a set of OEM floats because that's the only part left to replace that might be bad. If i get the float swapped out and that's not the culprit then there must be some orifice in the body that's blocking fuel flow to the bowl.

Checked on the o-rings behind the intakes and they're soft and squishy (very surprising for being so old) so they're not responsible for my vacuum leak. I'm thinking maybe one of the clamps around one of the boots was too tight causing a boot to pinch and allow air in, that's the only other explanation i have for the leak. On a lighter side, it only took me 20 minutes to get the carbs off the bike this time haha. One i figured out the trick it's not too bad now.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #58 on: January 17, 2015, 12:03:56 PM »
Updated a lot of the screws around the bike, including the seat buckles.

Out with the old


In with the new


Put the carb rack back on the bike today and am still trying to sort through the cylinder not firing. Pretty sure it's not fuel related anymore because the #4 plug was fouled. Might be time to replace the plug caps.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #59 on: January 22, 2015, 04:47:02 PM »
Replaced the plug caps with new NGK's and that seemed to help a lot. Two of the spark plugs were foulded too. Measured the resistance on the old plugs and got 10.5, infinity, 13.2, and 9.7 (first number corresponds to first cylinder and so on). So the new caps helped the idle tremendously, but the #4 cylinder is still cold.

My parents visited me this past weekend and my dad noticed the bike was blowing a little bit of blue smoke out the back, so i have a compression gauge on the way (none of the local places had the right size that would fit the spark plug holes). It might be time to replace the rings, and I'll probably drop in the 650 cam while I'm at it.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #60 on: January 31, 2015, 09:47:44 PM »
Still having trouble getting it to run right and it's no where near in the shape I want it in, but on my way home tonight I just had to stop and snap a quick pic with my phone of the cool streetlight scenery. Enjoy.



1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #61 on: February 21, 2015, 11:25:20 AM »
Small victory today: finally have the use of my electric start! No, I didn't rebuild the right hand controls (though that is on the to-do list). Thanks to the guys at Cognito Moto I got a small push-button switch that I could wire in place of my original starter switch. Please don't yell at me for drilling a hole in the headlight bucket haha, I was gonna mount it in on the headlight ears where I had taken the turn signals off, but it was too small to fit well.

1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline rb550four

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #62 on: February 21, 2015, 12:38:17 PM »
Is there fuel in the #4 bowl ? When the bowl drain is open, does the fuel run strong out the bottom?
If you lay a plugged in spark plug across the head on #4 do you get steady spark? What color? and is #1 pipe as hot as  #2 and 3?
+1 on the carb clean if it hasn't been done yet. New needles and brass bits....in a dirty carb doesn't make much sense. Do a good cleaning. Blow out every orifice , then do it again. examine every piece ,every O ring, make sure each open orifice blows air out the other side especially the fuel supply in #4. Set your float height on each correctly and button them up. A nice vacuum sync never hurts either.
  If it isn't carbs , it would be spark, check all the plugs ,caps, and wires(especially if someone cut them short)make sure they are all sparking with a spare (new plug that works)
Have you changed out the 40 yr old condensers ? just wondering.

Soryy, I just read back a page , didn't Cal mention all of this already?
« Last Edit: February 21, 2015, 12:51:14 PM by rb550four »
A few Honda 500's, a few Honda 550's, a few Honda 650's, '72 cb 450, a couple 500/550/650 hybrids, and 2001 750. 
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  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,101678.0.html             
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,137317.msg1550907.html#msg1550907

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #63 on: February 22, 2015, 11:59:54 AM »
Is there fuel in the #4 bowl ? When the bowl drain is open, does the fuel run strong out the bottom?
If you lay a plugged in spark plug across the head on #4 do you get steady spark? What color? and is #1 pipe as hot as  #2 and 3?

Have you changed out the 40 yr old condensers ? just wondering.

Fuel does run strongly out of the bottom. I've still got to find some time to check the float level by the clear tube method, but now I've got other worries as I'm getting gas in my oil.

It sparks a strong blue spark across all four plugs, but after riding up the road the cylinder is still cooler than the other 3. And yes, #1 is just as hot as #2 and #3. I'm starting to think it might be a valve issue.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline rb550four

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #64 on: February 22, 2015, 04:55:53 PM »
Valve issue? Why? Have you given it a compression test and found very low to nothing in #4?
How much fuel was on the #4 plug after the ride?
 Are your overflow tubes plugged? You need to set those floats correctly  and if you think the float pin is hanging it up , clean the floats were the pin goes through , polish the brass pin so it slides nicely into the floats. This hang up wouldn't have anything to do with plyer marks would it? Is that the needle we are talking about? If it isn't, and we are talking about a seating issue with the float valve, there is a toothpaste trick somewhere on this forum that would help it seat better if it's sticking.
Sounds like a carb clean is in order again if you haven't done it already. You are using compressed air right?
  My guess is your carbs are still dirty, the overflow is clogged,and either the float pin has been boogered up to where it won't allow the floats to operate properly or the float valve is not seating or is installed upsidedown....in any event I think your over flow  is flowing down the #4 cylinder, passing through the rings and ending up in your oil while is rests and fowling the plug when you run...that's my guess. Have you checked your oil ,does it smell like fuel?
  And if this is all or partly true,  you  need to address these problems before they turn into a BIG problem.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2015, 05:01:34 PM by rb550four »
A few Honda 500's, a few Honda 550's, a few Honda 650's, '72 cb 450, a couple 500/550/650 hybrids, and 2001 750. 
  550 Snowbike -Somebody had to do it.
  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,101678.0.html             
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,137317.msg1550907.html#msg1550907

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #65 on: March 09, 2015, 02:27:46 PM »
Valve issue? Why? Have you given it a compression test and found very low to nothing in #4?
Compression test proved nothing was wrong, I was wrong to assume a valve issue.

How much fuel was on the #4 plug after the ride?
Quite a bit, it was wet with gas.

Are your overflow tubes plugged? You need to set those floats correctly  and if you think the float pin is hanging it up , clean the floats were the pin goes through , polish the brass pin so it slides nicely into the floats. This hang up wouldn't have anything to do with plyer marks would it? Is that the needle we are talking about? If it isn't, and we are talking about a seating issue with the float valve, there is a toothpaste trick somewhere on this forum that would help it seat better if it's sticking.
All the brass has since been polished up and carbs have been cleaned as noted below. I didn't find any plier marks either, everything was smooth. The needles are original parts, but the float valve needles are new (and have been cleaned again).

  My guess is your carbs are still dirty, the overflow is clogged,and either the float pin has been boogered up to where it won't allow the floats to operate properly or the float valve is not seating or is installed upsidedown....in any event I think your over flow  is flowing down the #4 cylinder, passing through the rings and ending up in your oil while is rests and fowling the plug when you run...that's my guess. Have you checked your oil ,does it smell like fuel?
  And if this is all or partly true,  you  need to address these problems before they turn into a BIG problem.
I make sure to turn the petcock off when I park the bike, but I think you're right about it getting past the rings somehow. And yes, the oil smelled strongly of gas. I have since drained it.


I've done quite a bit of work over the past couple days. Bought a gallon can of Gunk Carb Dip and proceeded to tear down the carbs again for a nice soak. They cleaned up better than I expected. After I reinstall them on the bike I'll be checking I set the float level accurately with the clear tube method.







While they were soaking I started to tear down the top of the motor to go ahead and do my 650 cam swap. Upon trying to loosen the cam chain tensioner I realiezed it was stuck. I let it soak overnight from PB Blaster but it still wouldn't loosen up. Ended up having to cut the nut and screw off.



Now I'm waiting on another bracket to come in the mail so I can replace the broken screw and put my cylinder head back on. I'm also waiting on my buddy to get here to help me get the head off. I'm hoping I don't find anything unusual once I get it pulled off. And hopefully I can reuse the head gasket too, my budget is tight right now.

Also decided to cut the front off the front fender. The orginal owner laid it over once and it ground the fender stay and fender a little bit on the side. I have to say I'm happy with the result of cutting the fender, it looks a little bit better. Just used tape to mark where I wanted to cut and used a Dremel to do the cutting.





Oh yeah, when I was reassembling the carbs I had a scare of tightening one of the pilot jets too tight and it sheared off in its hole. I ended up being able to get it out with a small tapered tap.





All of the gas-smelling oil has been drained out of the bike. I still need to get some more oil to cycle through it and get the rest of the old oil out, but that'll happen later this week. I've also been gathering parts to do a dual disc conversion with 750 brakes and a GL1000 master cylinder. That might have to wait till the summer though.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2015, 02:35:09 PM by mrfish2 »
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #66 on: March 10, 2015, 04:19:41 PM »
Pulled the head off the bike to discover (per Hondaman's observant eye) that the #4 piston rings weren't sealing at all, so it's confirmed that's how I was getting gas in my oil. (#4 valves are on the far right)



Measure the cylinders to check that they were within the spec limits (they were), then proceeded to check the ring gaps as well. Almost immediately broke the top ring off of one of the pistons when I tried to remove it....



And this is how she sits now. Gotta finish getting the old base gasket off before I can go any further.



So now I've got a set of rings on the way (the $40 set on ebay from Cruzin Image) and when they get here I'll hone the cylinders as well. I was trying to avoid putting new rings on but in the end it's the smart thing to do. I went from a simple cam swap to an almost top end rebuild...
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline Stev-o

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #67 on: March 10, 2015, 05:17:08 PM »
Did you measure your cylinders?  Might be time for a big bore kit!
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #68 on: March 10, 2015, 05:25:07 PM »
I think they were in spec according to his post.  That said, it might make sense to do the cruzin image 600cc kit while you have it torn apart.  Only $120 for the whole piston kit.  That combined with a port job will wake up the motor.
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #69 on: March 10, 2015, 05:29:09 PM »
I really want to do the big bore CruzinImage kit, but can't afford it at the moment. The cheapest I've been able to get a local machine shop to quote me on boring and honing the cylinders was around 400 total. I've read good stuff about that kit on this site so I'll be saving up to do it in the future.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline calj737

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #70 on: March 10, 2015, 05:37:22 PM »
$400! Send them up to me, $40/hole is what the local shop charges me. $400, that's robbery!
'74 550 Build http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=126401.0
'73 500 Build http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132935.0

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of it's victim may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

Offline Stev-o

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #71 on: March 10, 2015, 05:54:55 PM »
$400! Send them up to me, $40/hole is what the local shop charges me. $400, that's robbery!

+1.  I just paid $50/hole for my H1 and that included chamfering the ports (2 stroke)
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #72 on: March 10, 2015, 06:03:07 PM »
Hmm...maybe they didn't understand what I wanted done. Still, even if I found a place to do it for $50/hole I couldn't do it for a while.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #73 on: March 10, 2015, 06:04:48 PM »
You should think about Cal's offer. I just sent him my cruzinimage pistons for thermal barrier and dry film lubricant coatings. Much cheaper than anywhere here local.
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline mrfish2

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Re: 1976 550K Project
« Reply #74 on: March 14, 2015, 05:45:15 PM »
If it comes to that then I might consider it, I appreciate the offer.

Anyway, the rings got here today, a lot quicker than I thought, so i went ahead and installed them along with honing the cylinders. I had spent the last couple days cleaning off the old base gasket material. Put the new base gasket on, installed the rings, and put everything back together. Sorry I don't have any pics, it was getting dark and I was excited to have everything back together. I stopped after I got the new 650 camshaft installed, so tomorrow I'll be putting the rocker cover back on along with the carbs and checking them via the clear tube method. I'll also cycle some oil through it to make sure I've got all the old gas-stained oil out, then drain that and put fresh oil back in it. So just another day's work and it should be back to running condition, I just hope I did everything right and nothing unexpected happens. Still waiting on some copper crush gaskets to get here for the exhaust.

On a side note, DO NOT buy the Advance Auto brand honing tool, it was a piece of junk. I made it work for what little I needed it for, then returned it. I can't even describe how much of a piece of junk that thing was. It's entire design was piss poor.
1976 CB550K            1979 XS1100
1980 CB650C - Sold

It's a little motor and likes having the tits revved off it.