Topic: Swing Arm Bushing replacement

[Tiek101]

I just removed my old bushings (used the hacksaw trick) and it was no problem getting them out, however I thought they were some non-metalic material, mine were definately metal (see pic).  Do you think they were once replaced with these metal ones?  ...Also, do you think I can re-use my old pivot tube (whatever it's called)? ...see pics.  Click for bigguns  ----->

[Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er]

Again, as someone previously mentioned - GET IN TOUCH WITH HONDAMAN

Hondaman will custom make your bushings, set the clearance to the correct figure based on the 2 bushings and the wear of the other piece involved. Not just new bushings with slop due to wear of the other piece.  No slop.

[Hop on a Honda]

I have just done mine on a K5 CB750.
The grease nipple is in the center.
1/ Using the pivot bolt make a steel bush , slide it down the Axle shaft and press then buggars out.
leave the swing arm in the sun for a hour or so (helps) and presto.
Clean and reassemble.
2/Check the axle/ pivot bolt it is bound to be corroded. If so ther are two things you can do .
1/ have it hard chrome to the origional size.14mm??? use a good if not great lubricant.Wheel bearing grease.
This will last longer than you, or buy a new one at your local HONDA Shop
I have zero play at all.

[HondaMan]

I just removed my old bushings (used the hacksaw trick) and it was no problem getting them out, however I thought they were some non-metalic material, mine were definately metal (see pic).  Do you think they were once replaced with these metal ones?  ...Also, do you think I can re-use my old pivot tube (whatever it's called)?

Take some steel wool (and a big, cold drink...) and work off the black stuff from the pivot shaft so you can measure the actual metal. The black stuff is a mix of old grease and powder made from the bushing(s) as it wore. Measure the O.D. of that shaft in at least 4 positions to see if it is round. If not, it should be turned down to be round. Then, you can either have it hard-chrome plated to "grow" it a little, then turn it round again to make it stock O.D., and buy some Honda bushings and rebuild, or you can buy a new one (maybe) from Honda, then stock bushings, and rebuild.

Or,.... Jeffro and I make it all fit by making bushings to fit the reconditioned O.D. of the pivot shaft and the (usually) warped I.D. of the swingarm's tube. This is a little trickier, because we have to "split the difference" of I.D. in the ovalled and non-ovalled sections to get the O.D. of the bushing, and often I have to finish hone the I.D. of the installed bushings to get them round again (in bad cases). In one case (my CB750K2), I honed the swingarm tube FIRST to get it more round before we started, then I still had to hone out .002" in the end, as well. But, my bike's got LOTS of miles with HEAVY touring loads, and at mostly high (i.e., illegal) speeds, plus some years of racing thrown it, too boot. It was worked pretty hard... 

[amattel]

Hey there HONDAMAN,

I would like to have you do a swingarm for my cb750k2

I am looking around for a junkyard swingarm, however, if you happen to have one that would fit a 750k2 perhaps I could just include some extra $$ to cover it.

PM me if you have one and what you would want for the whole deal, or if you don't I will scrounge one up and paypal you $100 for the work.

Thanks for offerring your expertise to the community!

Adam

[ken74-550K0]

You really can't go wrong with Mark setting up your swing arm with new bushings.  He just finished up replacing the bushings for my 74 550, the job came out great, I could not believe the difference it made in the handling and ride of the bike.  Additionally, he's a great guy to do business with - he communicates with you throughout the course of the job.  You will be 110% satisfied with the results.

[HondaMan]

Hey there HONDAMAN,

I would like to have you do a swingarm for my cb750k2

I am looking around for a junkyard swingarm, however, if you happen to have one that would fit a 750k2 perhaps I could just include some extra $$ to cover it.

PM me if you have one and what you would want for the whole deal, or if you don't I will scrounge one up and paypal you $100 for the work.

Thanks for offerring your expertise to the community!

Adam

I have a K4 arm, and one of the other guys just offered up his old 750 arm for a "recycle" program like this. I'll find his e-mail for you: maybe you guys could work out a good deal. He got a junkyard arm, we rebuilt it, then he ended up with a spare.

I could probably sell you my extra K4 arm, too: I really don't know what they're worth. Maybe $20? It could use some paint: it was outside a long time before I got it.

[HondaMan]

You really can't go wrong with Mark setting up your swing arm with new bushings.  He just finished up replacing the bushings for my 74 550, the job came out great, I could not believe the difference it made in the handling and ride of the bike.  Additionally, he's a great guy to do business with - he communicates with you throughout the course of the job.  You will be 110% satisfied with the results.

Thanks for the plug, Ken! I'm actually running a little behind at the moment, because the machinist has been tied up with Cub Scouts (he's the Scoutmaster), in their Fall Jamboree stuff. We'll get caught up again pretty soon.

Like they say, nice guys finish last... 

[scunny]

I have just installed a set of bushings a friend made for me, he also cleaned up the pivot, my question is, how tight should that pivot be in the bushings when installed,mine needs a light tap into place,but can't be turned by hand. I see that Hondaman suggests 0.008 clearance but I have no way of measuring this, ideas.

[HondaMan]

I have just installed a set of bushings a friend made for me, he also cleaned up the pivot, my question is, how tight should that pivot be in the bushings when installed,mine needs a light tap into place,but can't be turned by hand. I see that Hondaman suggests 0.008 clearance but I have no way of measuring this, ideas.

Since you can't directly measure it, try this:

Try removing the shaft and turning it around, then slide it into place a little at a time until you find the tight spot(s). Get a 2-stone hone, like for brake cylinders, and an electric drill and patiently hone (oil it well) a little at a time until it just barely slides in and can turn by  hand.

Occasionally, Honda's welders would overheat these swingarm tubes during construction and put a slight kink in them near one side or the other. If you find that this is the case (just one tight spot), then grease it well, put it all together and operate the arm up and down a bunch, like 20-30 times, to see if it will start to loosen up slightly. If so, then ride for about 100 miles and loosen the mounting bolt, grease it again and reassemble. This should wear a groove in just that one tight spot, leaving the rest of the bushing for support. Then it will work out OK.

[Jv550]

I just lubed my swingarm - first time with this bike. Seemd to take the play out, though I'll need bearings soon enought too. As I was pumping grease into it, a long yellow turd came squirting slowly out the other side. Ever heard of lubing a swingarm with mustard? Or is that some ancient petroleum product?

[puppytrax]

Ever heard of lubing a swingarm with mustard? Or is that some ancient petroleum product?

I think it's OEM Honda grease...My front & rear wheel bearings (on the good wheels) were greased with it...

I feel the yellow grease is a good sign...it means the metal didn't wear much and leave filings in the grease, else the grease would have turned black... 

[scunny]

cheers Hondaman, honing the bushings in place worked a treat, I could see the high spots being removed as I did this.

[HondaMan]

Good, Scunny, glad that helped! It's interesting to watch the pattern show up, isn't it?   


That "mustard grease" you-all're talking about is a secret formula:

(real grease + water + alkaline soap at $0.25 per squirt) = mustard grease.

[seaweb11]

Wow!! Almost 3200 views. I just had a simple question a year ago. This post should be re-named "HondaMan on Bushings"
Looks like you have helped a lot of people along the way

Good on ya.

[Jv550]

That "mustard grease" you-all're talking about is a secret formula:

(real grease + water + alkaline soap at $0.25 per squirt) = mustard grease.

Why though? Is that good stuff for the swingarm?

[scunny]

I think he means water and a cleaning agent get forced into where they aren't meant to be by water blasters

[HondaMan]

Yeah, what he said....it's the same reason I got through college: the 25-cent car washes kept a steady stream of electrically-challenged bikes in my bike shop, where I was the resident Electrical Engineer and Head Mechanic. I think I actually fixed more electrical problems than mechanical those 3 years, and it was always related to water being inside those places.   

[pae]

Great thread this, just got my old bushes out ready for blasting/painting after Xmas. Easy to do with the instructions, if it helps anyone else here's a couple of pictures (sorry about the lack of focus on some of them  ). The bushes are very easy to cut, and you can hear the tone of the blade change as you start to cut into the steel of the swingarm.

Swingarm fixed into my 'universal axle stands' with additional bit of wood hammered in to hold it all steady.



2 cuts made, about 6 and 8 o'clock in the picture



2 radial cuts made in the flange head to allow the small piece to come out easily.



Finally the small piece hammered out. Then just work around the flange with a screwdriver, the rest just falls apart/out.

[HondaMan]

Nice shots, PAE! That looks a lot like how I take them out. You can use a 12" long hacksaw or one of those shorty jobs where the blade sticks out a couple of inches. Or, if you're REAL careful, a jigsaw (or maybe sawzall), but these seriously limit the "feel" of when you're hitting the steel. And, you need an extra-long blade or else it breaks off (expensive..) when you're about halfway through the bushing.

I have an old axle that I put in a vise to hold the other end of the arm steady. Whatever you do, hold them steady or you'll find it flying all over your shop while you saw.   

[xtalon]

There is some great information in this thread!  So, thanks to all, but I must say, I'm still a little confused for some reason.  Maybe it's because I haven't dismantled my own swingarm yet to get a better understanding of all the pieces and how they go together.  I do have a 1977 CB750K swingarm that I purchased off of eBay, but with not taking the part off the bike, I'm having having a hard time figuring out what parts I still need to put this on my bike.  If someone is willing to answer a few questions, I am definitely willing to listen and hopefully understand. 

Once I obtain another pivot bolt, I will probably send the whole thing to Hondaman to re-work, but I still wanted to have a better understanding of all this.

1.  IF I understand correctly, there are two types of bushings that could be used.  One is the 'tophat' kind (all one piece) and the other is a cylinder that has a felt ring and a top hat looking retainer (thrust bush?).  Is this correct?

2.  Below are two pictures of the '77 CB750K swingarm.  I assume this is the cylindrical kind?  In the first picture, I have marked areas I am unsure about. What is #1?  A magnet doesn't seem to like it nearly as much as the swingarm or the pivot bush.  Also, what is #2 simply part of the swingarm?

3.  When using the hacksaw to cutout the bushings, how does the center collar not get damaged (cut)?  Or maybe it is and is simply replaced with the bushings?

4.  Do the pivot bushings fit over the ends of the center color or merely bump flush up against?

I beg for forgiveness for my complete ignorance in advance!   





--xTalon

[Raul CB750K1]

My two cents, here, for my CB350 I ordered new bushings from Honda. Originals were made of plastic, and with the same part number I received metal bushings.

I have a spare axle, and I plan to machine it to install modern grease nipples. I tried making some kind of "adaptor" but the result was not much satisfying....

[pae]

2.  Below are two pictures of the '77 CB750K swingarm.  I assume this is the cylindrical kind?  In the first picture, I have marked areas I am unsure about. What is #1?  A magnet doesn't seem to like it nearly as much as the swingarm or the pivot bush.  Also, what is #2 simply part of the swingarm?

3.  When using the hacksaw to cutout the bushings, how does the center collar not get damaged (cut)?  Or maybe it is and is simply replaced with the bushings?

4.  Do the pivot bushings fit over the ends of the center color or merely bump flush up against?

I beg for forgiveness for my complete ignorance in advance!   

--xTalon

Going from memory here, so I hope i don't give you a bad steer...

From what you have, the metal centre tube in your pics should run right the way through the top hat bushes, which is what you have here. Push the centre tube straight out of the bushes - it should be a fairly easy to remove it. You are then left with your swing-arm with a 'plastic' top-hat bush at each end.
The top-hat, or flange, of the bushes is what you've marked as #1 in your pictures. Thats what you can cut/break/drift out from each end - see my earlier pics. I'm pretty certain that the item you've marked as #2 is part of the main swingarm ....... in fact, it is, I've just run out to the garage to have a look at mine. If you look again at my cutting operation, there's a definite ring around the swingarm tube - that's the same one you've marked as #2, it is NOT the flange on the top-hat. Look here...

regards, Phil

[xtalon]

Thanks Phil!  That cleared up a lot!!!

I see now that the center collar is inside the bushings and goes from end to end in the swingarm.  For some stupid reason, I thought the center collar was between the bushings on the ends (for clarification, I thought the silver metal showing on the end was the bushing, but now I see that is the actual center collar - see... told you I was ignorant). 

Thanks again!

--xTalon

[pae]

You're welcome. And your ignorance is only a few weeks behind mine - I thought exactly the same thing when I first looked at mine over Xmas..  . It took this thread to get me looking at it again and again before I figured it out.

regards, Phil