Topic: Patina Hyena - 550/650 674cc Hybrid Cafe Build

[DaveBarbier]

Thanks David, this is what you're referring to, right? http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,27159.200.html

Mine will have to be different because the 650 doesn't have a manifold that bolts to the head like the 550 does. It's more or less like the 750.

 

You can see the manifold above. So rubbers go on the manifold but the CR's have spigots that thread into the carb which are supposed to fit in the rubber insulators.

Now, I do have a small lathe and have been getting some practice making stuff, so it's really a question of my skill and what's ultimately the best solution.

[DaveBarbier]

Essentially, I'll have to make one of these:



But with a tapered ID to go from carb to head and possibly longer to clear the petcock. 

[RAFster122s]

Doesn't Geoffry sell a complete CR carb setup for the 550.  Maybe he could be talked out of a set of the tgreaded adapters he uses.  Or, Frank 754 could probably make you a set.
David

[DaveBarbier]

Godffery, does make a set. And he was curious why I didn't want the spigots he sells when I ordered the rack from him, haha. That's an interesting thought...maybe he has blanks I could machine. I wouldn't want anyone to make me a set, at least until I know if they have to be elongated or not. Obviously I want a well made piece, but I also would like more machining practice. Once I fail at this I'll give Frank a PM, haha.

Thanks for the idea, David!

[RAFster122s]

You are aware of HondaMan's thoughts when talking about the 750F and 650 and exhaust valve & guide problems...
Need to run the exhaust valves with loose setting...

[DaveBarbier]

You are aware of HondaMan's thoughts when talking about the 750F and 650 and exhaust valve & guide problems...
Need to run the exhaust valves with loose setting...

Meaning tappet clearance? Yeah, even on my 550 I go about .004" and .003". I'll see what MRieck recommends when I get down to it. I have aftermarket bits in this head from cam, hard welded rockers, springs and such. Thanks for looking out!

[RAFster122s]

Yes, but even wider is recommended. Like .006

See Thoughts of Hondaman thread.

[DaveBarbier]

Yes, but even wider is recommended. Like .006

See Thoughts of Hondaman thread.

Hm, interesting. That's a lot of clearance. I'll save that reading for tomorrow morning when I'm on the throne.

[RAFster122s]

Very true Cal...

[bill440cars]

       Just now getting into this build and, after seeing the "Index" and how it was laid out, so you could go to any particular area, really blew me away!  With this kind of effort and detail, on the "Index" really encourages me to check out the entire build, page by page. Such a fantastic job, that I know the build is going to be really worth going through.   

[DaveBarbier]

Haha, thanks Bill! That reminds me, I need to update that with my recent work of sealing up the cases on the 650. Have a look around, browsing is recommended

[bill440cars]

Haha, thanks Bill! That reminds me, I need to update that with my recent work of sealing up the cases on the 650. Have a look around, browsing is recommended

           Oh, I am working on it, as I can, I promise you. I started on a CB550 Café Build, once upon a time, after watching another fellow SOHC4er DougID (I think that was his name) built his and documented it on here. But "Life" happened and I got off track and hoping to be able to get things lined out and back on it. Anyway, you keep on trucking and I will get through what you have already done, while I try to catch up. 

[DaveBarbier]

Haha, thanks Bill! That reminds me, I need to update that with my recent work of sealing up the cases on the 650. Have a look around, browsing is recommended

           Oh, I am working on it, as I can, I promise you. I started on a CB550 Café Build, once upon a time, after watching another fellow SOHC4er DougID (I think that was his name) built his and documented it on here. But "Life" happened and I got off track and hoping to be able to get things lined out and back on it. Anyway, you keep on trucking and I will get through what you have already done, while I try to catch up. 

Deal

[DaveBarbier]

Here's a list of all the seals, o-rings, chains, gaskets and misc. consumables that I replaced on the 650. Some part numbers have an “X#” after them; that’s the quantity. And o-rings are measured with only two measurements, the ID and the cross section diameter. This is very close to every suggested replaceable item for rebuilding a 650 motor. Hope it helps someone in the future. Don't hesitate to ask for assistance.

Bottom End Seals
• Output shaft oil seal-36x57x13
91205-426-013
• Clutch lever oil seal-12x22x5
91201-965-000
• Shift drum oil seal-12x25x4.5
91202-426-003
• Gear shaft oil seal-12.5x25x8
91204-425-003
• Crank Seal-30x42x8
91201-300-003
• Crank Seal- 30x45x8
91201-323-005

Top End Seals
• Tach drive oil seal
91256-425-003

Bottom End O-Rings
• Starter output o-ring-24.4x3.1
91312-MG7-003
• Oil strainer o-ring-15x2.5
91302-377-000 X2
• Primary chain oiler o-ring-7x1.7
91312-107-000
• Advancer shaft o-ring-6x2.3
91301-300-000
• Clutch adj. cap o-ring-23.5x2.6
91305-425-003
• Oil pump o-ring-46x2**
91305-426-003
**not correct, use 53x3 between pump body and engine case. McMaster Carr pn:9262K306**
• Oil pump o-ring-13.8x2.5
91303-MG7-003 X2
• Oil valve o-ring-7x1.7
91312-107-000
• Oil gallery plug o-ring-15x2.5
91302-377-000 X2
• Oil gallery plug o-ring-19.4x2.8
91306-425-003 X2

Top End O-Rings
• Head gasket o-ring-4.9x2.5
91301-426-010 X2
• Cylinder sleeve o-ring-61.8x2
91304-286-000 X4
• Base gasket o-ring-11x2.5
91310-426-000 X2
• Tach drive o-ring-11x2.5
91310-426-000
• Rocker shaft end bolt o-rings-9x1.6
91305-028-900 X4

Gaskets
• Oil pan gasket
11398-426-000
• Base gasket
12191-426-306
• Breather cover gasket
12329-426-000
• Valve cover gasket
12391-460-770
• Tappet cover gasket
12395-426-000
• Tappet cover gasket
12396-426-000

Miscellaneous Consumables
• Primary sprocket damper
23114-426-300 X8
• Primary chain
23131-426-003
• Rubber sealing pucks
91318-300-013 X6
• Cam chain
14401-426-024
• Breather cover bolt seal
90541-425-000
• Short head bolts X10
90023-MW3-600
• Long head bolts X2
90036-426-004

[RAFster122s]

Thanks for the list, very useful information.  Maybe create a sticky post or add to the hime page's information on the 650.
David

[DaveBarbier]

Yeah I hope someone can use it in the future as a good starting point. Not hard to compile it yourself but this should make it faster.

[Godffery]

 Dave, have you come up with a solution for your Carb to Manifold Spigots yet?
If not, I could send you a set of the Spigots that come with the RC Carbs from SUDCO.  They are too small for the 550 / 650 rubber manifolds, but you may be able to use them for the threaded portion and bore out the rest to press in a home made Spigot to match what you need.
 Just a thought.

[DaveBarbier]

Dave, have you come up with a solution for your Carb to Manifold Spigots yet?
If not, I could send you a set of the Spigots that come with the RC Carbs from SUDCO.  They are too small for the 550 / 650 rubber manifolds, but you may be able to use them for the threaded portion and bore out the rest to press in a home made Spigot to match what you need.
 Just a thought.

Are those spigots different than the one's that came with my carbs? I think the one's I have are for the 350/400.

That's an interesting idea, though. But if I need the carbs to be held farther back from the motor I'd want the spigots to be one piece for strength.

But no, I don't have a solution yet. I haven't gotten the motor together and in the frame so I don't know how the carbs are going to fit...or not. One good thing with the 650 insulators is that each one is has a slight 'jog' to it. That means I can aim them all down, for example, and make the rack about 1 cm lower from the tank. That could help.

I won't have the motor fully assembled for a couple more weeks I think, realistically.

[Godffery]

 Okay, I couldn't remember if I sent those with your kit.
If your concerted about the press fit slipping, you could use red loctite, as well as securing the back of the carbs to the frame for extra support.

[DaveBarbier]

Okay, I couldn't remember if I sent those with your kit.
If your concerted about the press fit slipping, you could use red loctite, as well as securing the back of the carbs to the frame for extra support.

True, I'll probably support the back of the carbs anyway with some sort of rubber mount.

We'll see what happens when I get the motor in and mock up the carbs.

[DaveBarbier]

Finally some pictures of the cam, rockers and cam gear. Beautiful stuff, thanks Mike!

[joeyvans]

Queue the orgasm guy.....




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[DaveBarbier]

Queue the orgasm guy.....




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Rob Schneider is the orgasm guy?

[joeyvans]

Rob Schneider is the orgasm guy?

Yeah... before SNL sucked.



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[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

I know that cam! I will try to catch up to you Dave with all the other stuff.