Topic: Patina Hyena - 550/650 674cc Hybrid Cafe Build

[DaveBarbier]

theres generally an aluminium washer on those plugs,you can put copper washers on them,bending that mouth back will have to done very gingerly its likely to crack?id try gently tapping it back placed on wood with a lump of brass?

Oh really? Hm, interesting, I'll look into getting the washers. Would it not be a good idea to use a rubber o-ring if I can't find a copper or aluminum washer?

Yeah I'm scared of it cracking. Don't know if I'm going to mess with it. Maybe as a last resort...

Thanks Dave


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1978 Honda CB550K

[dave500]

an o ring will just fatten and disort,theyre meant to be in a groove set up so they only get crushed partially.

[DaveBarbier]

an o ring will just fatten and disort,theyre meant to be in a groove set up so they only get crushed partially.

Ok, that makes sense. I'll look for something. But what do you think? If these screws aren't sealing that could be causing an air leak, right?


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1978 Honda CB550K

[dave500]

if they do leak without a washer itll be about as much as an ants fart?

[DaveBarbier]

if they do leak without a washer itll be about as much as an ants fart?

...I was hoping for a bison or some other cloven hoofed ungulate.


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1978 Honda CB550K

[DaveBarbier]

Which way are these supposed to go? Does the double ribbed part face the head or carb?

Any ideas anyone? I was searching around and couldn't find anything yet.


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1978 Honda CB550K

[DaveBarbier]

Also I couldn't find any aluminum washers but I did find nylon ones. I can tighten them pretty good and they're not cracking or distorting.

No idea if this actually was the problem. I'm leaning towards no, but it makes me feel better.




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1978 Honda CB550K

[MickB]

I should work provided it gives an air tight seal, it looks ok on the photo.
What does the schematic show regards the boots orientation?

[DaveBarbier]

I should work provided it gives an air tight seal, it looks ok on the photo.
What does the schematic show regards the boots orientation?

Can't tell from the picture. I also remember a post I've been trying to find that someone said they had an air leak because they had the insulators on backwards.




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1978 Honda CB550K

[DaveBarbier]

Ok, never mind. The double ribbed part goes towards the head. I realized the openings are different sizes. It'll only go on one way.


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1978 Honda CB550K

[MickB]

Problem solved.

[DaveBarbier]

Carbs are back on. Didn't find anything weird during this removal and installation that could point to an obvious air leak. I traded the stainless band clamps on the pods in favor of stainless safety wire. When I started to tighten the bands the pods would start to slide off the carbs.




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1978 Honda CB550K

[calj737]

If tightening the clamps squeezes them off the carb, they're the wrong size boots. Ditch the safety wire, band clamps!

[Maurice]

Why do you think you have an air leak? Running pods is going to run lean at stock settings. For idle, assuming you have the stock idle jets, you need to crank the mix screws out quite a bit, 2.5 to 3 turns. Maybe more, in which case you might as well up the idle jet size. Do it in increments until you get good idle/throttle response.

For main jets and needles it's a PITA to get the right ones. You can get them to run more or less, with tradeoffs. Expect to invest in brass. But don't look for problems just yet, I think what you see is to be expected. Been there...

[DaveBarbier]

If tightening the clamps squeezes them off the carb, they're the wrong size boots. Ditch the safety wire, band clamps!

I don't know what it is, the pods are the one's recommended for these carbs. I forget the size but they slide on well with no wiggling. Maybe it's just the bands being too wide? But I can't tighten them down as well as I think they should be or they start to slide off...especially on that one carb where the mouth is bent. I might have to build it up with JB Weld or something so it has a flat surface to clamp on. I don't know what I'm going to do yet.

The safety wire seems to work well. Although having band clamps would be more convenient for removal.


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1978 Honda CB550K

[Tews19]

Are those emgo pods? If yes those are really cheap. Not as well designed as K&Ns

[MickB]

Dave the boots I bought from David silver or Z1 Parts were really tight.

Send them back and get your money back.

[DaveBarbier]

Why do you think you have an air leak? Running pods is going to run lean at stock settings. For idle, assuming you have the stock idle jets, you need to crank the mix screws out quite a bit, 2.5 to 3 turns. Maybe more, in which case you might as well up the idle jet size. Do it in increments until you get good idle/throttle response.

For main jets and needles it's a PITA to get the right ones. You can get them to run more or less, with tradeoffs. Expect to invest in brass. But don't look for problems just yet, I think what you see is to be expected. Been there...

I am guessing I have an air leak, but I really have no idea. It's just been offered up by several people who have a lot of knowledge.

The idle jets are stock and the mains have been upped to 110s with the idle mixture screw set to 1.5 with the needle in the 3rd position from top per Harrisuluv's recommendations.

I have larger aftermarket idle jets...which when you look through them compared to the factory ones the hole is significantly smaller...not sure how that works. And I have a few other sizes of mains too. I bought these in preparation for jetting.

You think I should focus on the IMS instead of an air leak? I could try that next during the week hopefully. Would pulling the plugs after idling a little while be the real way to tell my mixture?


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1978 Honda CB550K

[DaveBarbier]

Are those emgo pods? If yes those are really cheap. Not as well designed as K&Ns

No they're UNIs. I stayed away from the Emgo ones after reading multiple posts. I heard the UNIs are pretty good too and a lot cheaper than K&Ns.


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1978 Honda CB550K

[DaveBarbier]

Dave the boots I bought from David silver or Z1 Parts were really tight.

Send them back and get your money back.

The boots? You mean pods?


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1978 Honda CB550K

[calj737]

No, the rubber boots. They should be quite snug fitting on the carb mouths.

[MickB]

Dave if you think it's sucking air try putting something light where it's sucking and see if it's sucked on to the manifold

[MickB]

Dave I remember getting the rubber and clamps from 4 into 1 not Z1Parts, but they might have them also.
Best

[DaveBarbier]

Dave I remember getting the rubber and clamps from 4 into 1 not Z1Parts, but they might have them also.
Best

Ok, sorry, when you say rubber, do you mean the rubber pod filters or the rubber insulators between the carb and head? I'm using pods so I don't need the rubber that's between carb and airbox and my rubber insulators seem fine.

I'd like to get K&N pod filters instead of the UNIs but the cheapest I found was $140...and all the way up to $214!

What I plan on doing next is remove the safety wire and pods. Then, as a test, see how tight the factory airbox rubber boots fit on the carb mouths just to get a feel of how it should be compared to my pods.

Assuming the pods are still good I'll use the factory screw clamps instead of the worm gear type. The ones that came with my pods are wider and I think that's contributing to them squeezing off as I tighten them.

Then, I'm going to turn the IMS to 2.5 turns out and fire it up. See if that helps.


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1978 Honda CB550K

[DaveBarbier]

Ditch the safety wire, band clamps!

Done!

The OEM band clamps work better for me than the worm gear that came with the UNI pods. I can clamp them tightly and they don't slide off. I attribute that to the worm gear ones were wider. In either case, safety wire gone! Haha




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1978 Honda CB550K