Topic: Patina Hyena - 550/650 674cc Hybrid Cafe Build

[GV1390]

It takes a modified cover for sure. I once typed a lengthy how-to re degreeing, but so did Sean Condon years ago. Try searching to find something on here Dave, if no luck I'll try to help out.

PM sent too.

Does milling the cover render it not usable for the bike permanently? Or would it make it weaker in any way? Have a picture by chance?

[flatlander]

How much do you have to spend with CMSNL to get the drinking buddy? One main bearing seal? 

CMSNL is cheap nowadays so with the handful of orders I put in, no CMSNL guy, bummer! But Flatlander was nice enough to send me one. Only thing he asked in return was for me to call him Papa Bear. A little strange but hell, I'll take it.

hey you forgot the other thing: he's used to belgian beers and gets very cranky when not sufficiently lubricated!

[flatlander]

Does milling the cover render it not usable for the bike permanently? Or would it make it weaker in any way? Have a picture by chance?

yes, it's only usable during cam degreeing but a huge help then. for riding you need to install an unmolested one.

[joeyvans]

Oh, and I did just buy a cover off eBay for $50, free shipping. Comes with rockers too. Hopefully a local machine shop can mill the hump off as I wait.

My thinking is if anyone on the forum wants to use it for a 650 build (seems to be getting more popular) I'll happily ship it to them.

Great idea! I'm sure many on here would love to do a 650 swap someday. Me included.

Curious.... what was a stock sohc 650 rated at for HP and what are you hoping to gain with the updates? Sorry if this has already been addressed.



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[DaveBarbier]

How much do you have to spend with CMSNL to get the drinking buddy? One main bearing seal? 

CMSNL is cheap nowadays so with the handful of orders I put in, no CMSNL guy, bummer! But Flatlander was nice enough to send me one. Only thing he asked in return was for me to call him Papa Bear. A little strange but hell, I'll take it.

hey you forgot the other thing: he's used to belgian beers and gets very cranky when not sufficiently lubricated!

Uh oh, we've been drinking whiskey. I'll buy a 6 pack of Leffe Brown maybe

[DaveBarbier]

Oh, and I did just buy a cover off eBay for $50, free shipping. Comes with rockers too. Hopefully a local machine shop can mill the hump off as I wait.

My thinking is if anyone on the forum wants to use it for a 650 build (seems to be getting more popular) I'll happily ship it to them.

Great idea! I'm sure many on here would love to do a 650 swap someday. Me included.

Curious.... what was a stock sohc 650 rated at for HP and what are you hoping to gain with the updates? Sorry if this has already been addressed.



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It was rated at about 63hp. Not sure what it actually would be if you put it on a dyno. I'd imagine mid-low 50's? How much more power would these make? No idea, haha. I plan on bringing it to a dyno to get numbers once its completed.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Oh, and I did just buy a cover off eBay for $50, free shipping. Comes with rockers too. Hopefully a local machine shop can mill the hump off as I wait.

My thinking is if anyone on the forum wants to use it for a 650 build (seems to be getting more popular) I'll happily ship it to them.

Great idea! I'm sure many on here would love to do a 650 swap someday. Me included.

Curious.... what was a stock sohc 650 rated at for HP and what are you hoping to gain with the updates? Sorry if this has already been addressed.



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CB650 -- 63 hp at 9000 rpm
CB750 -- 67 hp at 8000 rpm

I think the 650 engine is 85-90 lbs lighter than the 750
Think about that when going to a 674cc high compression piston kit, porting and cam and you should be getting comparable performance to a stout 836 performance engine when considering weight, too.  The big plus is that you have a LOT less inertia.

[joeyvans]

^^^^^ Like


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[bwaller]

Honda claimed 50hp for the 550. That was supposedly at the crank. Most here with good stock engines see 37 as high as 40 RWHP for a really good one. With this in mind I expect a stock 650 would be in the
50 RWHP range. Good stock 750's have shown 58 RWHP. My wifes 550/592 with a mild 358a, 1:10.1CR, mild porting, stock valves & PD carbs makes 51 at the wheel. Just for some comparison numbers.

[DaveBarbier]

40hp to 51hp on your wife's bike? That's really nice. A 27.5% increase in hp. If I could translate that into my build going from 50hp that would bring me to just under 64hp. But could be more of an increase with CR carbs, hotter cam and MRieck's magic stage 2+ port job. That makes me happy.

[bwaller]

There you go. 

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

The manufacturer's always do have optimistic dyno numbers!

[DaveBarbier]

Now if you could only ride as well as Mrs Brent does! 

I don't think there's any chance of that happening any time soon, haha.

[flatlander]

How much do you have to spend with CMSNL to get the drinking buddy? One main bearing seal? 

CMSNL is cheap nowadays so with the handful of orders I put in, no CMSNL guy, bummer! But Flatlander was nice enough to send me one. Only thing he asked in return was for me to call him Papa Bear. A little strange but hell, I'll take it.

hey you forgot the other thing: he's used to belgian beers and gets very cranky when not sufficiently lubricated!

Uh oh, we've been drinking whiskey. I'll buy a 6 pack of Leffe Brown maybe

glad you keep him well supplied. while i had him here, i always kept the whiskey for myself!

[DaveBarbier]

Got two things a couple days ago: the rocker cover to modify and the flu .

I posted a question above, but may have gotten overlooked. Would it be ok to not install all rockers for when I degree this cam with the modded rocker cover? I was thinking of just using the rockers for cylinder 1 but curious if that could tweak anything.

Also, the flu sucks. Really bad. Hope you're all feeling good!

[flatlander]

i don't know coz i never tried it, but would feel better if there was more even pressure. if you want to skip something, maybe install them on 1 and 4 to at least be symmetrical. but honestly, how hard is it to transfer all rockers?

flu sucks. i've had it for 2 weeks and an eye infection on top of it! hope you get better soon.

[DaveBarbier]

You're right, not hard to transfer all rockers.

2 weeks!? Wow, that sucks. I feel like I'm on the road to recovery. Hopefully it's not just a calm before the storm. Thanks!

[bwaller]

If you install rockers for only one cylinder and clearances are just adequate, you'll be wishing you could have checked them all. Non stock pistons....better safe than sorry! Keep notes....

[DaveBarbier]

If you install rockers for only one cylinder and clearances are just adequate, you'll be wishing you could have checked them all. Non stock pistons....better safe than sorry! Keep notes....

Oh, so you'd check valve clearances on all pistons, eh? I wouldn't think there'd be that much variation across the board.

[bwaller]

With a new cam & pistons, yes I leave nothing to chance. If cyl 1 is cool then you only need to check at 10 degrees for the other cylinders. 

[DaveBarbier]

With a new cam & pistons, yes I leave nothing to chance. If cyl 1 is cool then you only need to check at 10 degrees for the other cylinders.

Being thorough. I like it.

[DaveBarbier]

Even while feeling like a giant pile of excrement I had to go out in the shop and cut out the hump on this cover. Just used a dremel with a reinforced cutoff wheel.

[RAFster122s]

It is too bad a sloppy cover from a early model does not work well for degreeing the can, or can it be used?
Are you merely using the cover to provide the upper cam surface?  Maybe I am confused, as opposed to being Confucious.

Any wise grasshoppers want to offer uses for early cam covers with sloppy rocker shafts?

[joeyvans]

It is too bad a sloppy cover from a early model does not work well for degreeing the can, or can it be used?
Are you merely using the cover to provide the upper cam surface?  Maybe I am confused, as opposed to being Confucious.

Any wise grasshoppers want to offer uses for early cam covers with sloppy rocker shafts?

There was a problem with the early 650's too?  Or are you referring to the early 550 covers w/out the pinned shafts?


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[RAFster122s]

You are right Joey I forgot this was a 650... had 550 on the brain.