Author Topic: CB750K 'Sport Tourer' (Read 23652 times)

calj737 · « **Reply #50 on:** March 20, 2015, 01:45:32 PM »

Yes on rim, no on spokes (probably). Stock pattern is spokes laced from outside and inside, in an overlapping pattern. Due the width of the hub, the "outside" spokes are added to the inside to avoid conflict on the backside of the caliper.

Buchanan's knows this hub, and can provide spokes for it.

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #51 on:** March 20, 2015, 04:15:46 PM »

Quote from: calj737 on March 20, 2015, 01:45:32 PM

Yes on rim, no on spokes (probably). Stock pattern is spokes laced from outside and inside, in an overlapping pattern. Due the width of the hub, the "outside" spokes are added to the inside to avoid conflict on the backside of the caliper.

Buchanan's knows this hub, and can provide spokes for it.

Good to know!

knottedknickers · « **Reply #52 on:** March 25, 2015, 08:00:30 AM »

Quote from: knottedknickers on March 20, 2015, 11:29:02 AM

While I'm asking, anyone know what the stock numbers are for the CB750K6? Fork length, rake/trail, offset, etc.?

I found some of this info in the 'dimensional drawing' on p. 3 of the CB750K service manual (a reasonable place to look...

):
Rake: 27º (90º - 63º [caster angle] = 27º)
Trail: 95 mm / 3.74 in
And some I worked out on my own:
Fork length: 754 mm (from centre of axle to top of tube; *off the bike, uncompressed*)
Offset: ~ 60 mm
Getting there... But for accuracy, I'm thinking the fork length measurement should be taken with the forks on the bike. Could someone with a stock 750K6 (or similar) measure that? I'd appreciate it!

By way of comparison, the '97 GSXR 750 dimensions (again, from the '96-99 GSXR 750 service manual, p. 1-9):
Rake: 24º (90º - 66º [caster] = 24º)
Trail: 96 mm / 3.8 in
Fork length: 729 mm
Offset: 30 mm

Of course, the big things are fork length and offset, since it will be going on the CB750 frame with its 27º rake...

knottedknickers · « **Reply #53 on:** April 02, 2015, 01:04:31 PM »

Well, I bit the bullet and picked up a '97 GSX-R front end: forks, triples, clip-ons, calipers, rotors, and axle for CAD$200 (USD$160). One of the forks is out 15 thou, but otherwise they're in really good nick. I figured I could try my luck straightening the bend and if that doesn't work just pick up a straight one online. From prices I've seen elsewhere (one guy wanted CAD$1000 for the same parts...

), I think I've got a bit of 'front end' budget left.

The forks need new seals and oil, so I've started stripping them down. Every day's a new adventure! Learning is good!

I've got a machinist friend who has a lathe at home, so I'm thinking of turning a plug to lengthen the GSX-R stem. Other than that, pick up a CognitoMoto hub and start putting it together. Happy!

Edit: I found a good step-by-step tear-down of inverted / upside down (USD) forks at a Kawasaki forum. Just what I needed, and I figured the reference might be what someone else needs down the road. The 'special tool' used to compress the springs is worth the link--I was wondering how I was going to do that!

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #54 on:** April 02, 2015, 01:49:18 PM »

Quote from: knottedknickers on April 02, 2015, 01:04:31 PM

Well, I bit the bullet and picked up a '97 GSX-R front end: forks, triples, clip-ons, calipers, rotors, and axle for CAD$200 (USD$160). One of the forks is out 15 thou, but otherwise they're in really good nick. I figured I could try my luck straightening the bend and if that doesn't work just pick up a straight one online. From prices I've seen elsewhere (one guy wanted CAD$1000 for the same parts... ), I think I've got a bit of 'front end' budget left. The forks need new seals and oil, so I've started stripping them down. Every day's a new adventure! Learning is good!

I've got a machinist friend who has a lathe at home, so I'm thinking of turning a plug to lengthen the GSX-R stem. Other than that, pick up a CognitoMoto hub and start putting it together. Happy!

If you have a machinist friend, just have him turn a complete longer stem.

calj737 · « **Reply #55 on:** April 02, 2015, 03:25:30 PM »

Or get one at the same time form CognitoMoto when you buy your hub...

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #56 on:** April 02, 2015, 03:44:33 PM »

Quote from: calj737 on April 02, 2015, 03:25:30 PM

Or get one at the same time form CognitoMoto when you buy your hub...

True. Devin has these good to go.

http://cognitomoto.com/collections/fork-conversion-parts/products/gsx-r-fork-on-honda-cb750-frame-conversion-stem

knottedknickers · « **Reply #57 on:** April 02, 2015, 05:33:20 PM »

I've seen those. They're very nice! It's just that right now the Canadian dollar is sucking wind against yours, and my budget isn't unlimited...

The hub (with bearings and spacers) will put a bit of bread on Devin's table and not keep too much from mine!

Thanks for the suggestions, though--I appreciate the input!

knottedknickers · « **Reply #58 on:** May 15, 2015, 12:04:20 PM »

I've got a question about the notorious 'cylinder stud bolt gaskets'. I ordered a gasket set from CycleX, and it came with a nice set of o-rings and rubbers. Unfortunately, one of the cylinder stud bolt rubbers is an oddball:

Left: CycleX oddball (x 1); Middle: CycleX set (x 7); Right: 'original' (at least, what was in the bike).

Here they are in place:

Left front: CycleX oddball; Left/Right Rear: CycleX set; Right Front: original. As you can see, the 'oddball' sits very proud; the 'set' are a bit lower; and the 'originals' are the lowest (though they certainly look adequate). The 'originals' are very pliable, so I wouldn't hesitate to use them for that reason. But what would you recommend? Do I write CycleX and try to get the 'oddball' swapped out for a matched 'set'? Or do I just stick the originals back in? I haven't decked the cylinders / head, for whatever that's worth.

knottedknickers · « **Reply #59 on:** May 15, 2015, 02:43:48 PM »

I just had a thought... It's a bit of a different story with the head gasket in place:

Left front: CycleX oddball; Left/Right rear: CycleX set; Right front: original. Now the original looks a bit low, the CycleX set look marginal, and the CycleX oddball doesn't look so out of place... Thoughts?

knottedknickers · « **Reply #60 on:** May 17, 2015, 08:46:20 AM »

My just-turned-thirteen year old son asked if he could help today (YES!)

First we torqued the clutch nut. We used the handles of a large set of 'channel-locks' wedged into the flanges of the clutch basket, then laced a pry bar between the channel-lock handles to hold the clutch from spinning, while I turned the torque wrench with a handy dandy clutch nut tool built to Dino's specs (7/8" socket notched out with a grinder to a four-point 'tool'; see Hackaweek #21, 1:30). Then we put on the clutch lifter plate and the clutch cover. Nice to see that side covered up--with new screws, even!

On the other side we put the alternator cover on. We had to scrape a bunch of silicone off from the previous gasket job... New gaskets and seals (where applicable) are in place.

On my own I pulled the rear wheel bearings and gave them some fresh grease. The aluminum 'bearing retaining rings'--both on the hub and the flange--were real bears to remove. The PO used a punch in the slots / holes to remove them previously, since another PO had peened the threads of both to 'set' them. I found my angle grinder tool (the one for removing the keeper nut) fit the holes on the flange retaining ring perfectly!

The retaining ring on the hub, unfortunately, is a mess... They'll probably have to be replaced the next time the bearings are serviced.

I also lapped the valves and put them back together. This little home-made tool helped a lot!

A piece of 33 mm o.d. x 26 mm i.d. PVC pipe with a notch cut out to get the keepers in.

I've written to CycleX about the cylinder stud bolt rubbers. Hope to hear back from them next week. I'd really like to get to work buttoning up the top end, but I've come to the conclusion that I really don't want to have a set of mixed-size rubbers between the head and the cylinders--just too much chance for an oil leak to develop from the different heights.

Anyway, it's nice to see some progress after having been out of country for three weeks!

riverfever · « **Reply #61 on:** May 17, 2015, 06:43:16 PM »

Great progress. I had a similar goal for the back of my bike. I didn't care for the bulky fender and light. This is what I did.

knottedknickers · « **Reply #62 on:** June 18, 2015, 03:44:53 PM »

I'm pleased to report that CycleX sent me a matching 'cylinder stud bolt gasket'! So I screwed up my courage and got busy putting the head on. It went very well--except for one thing that could have turned out very badly...

There are 16 'cylinder head nuts' and 6 'cylinder head bolts'. The 8 mm nuts need to be torqued to 15 ft/lbs; the 6 mm bolts to 8 ft/lbs. Silly me, I'm looking at the handy dandy diagram showing the torque sequence and merrily go from #16 to #17, the last nut to the first bolt, even changing from a 12 mm to a 10 mm socket along the way. DON'T DO THIS, KIDS!!! YOU WILL NOT BE HAPPY WHEN ONE OF THE 6 mm BOLTS SNAPS!!! Thankfully, I had started tightening at 7 ft/lbs, stepped up to 10, and then 13 before the final 15 ft/lbs. I got everything torqued to 10 ft/lbs, went through the 16 nuts at 13 ft/lbs, and then switched sockets and moved on to the bolts. Something just didn't feel right with the first bolt--turning, turning, turning, more and more gingerly, and the torque wrench just wasn't clicking... And then it hit me! Aaaaauuuuugh! They're not supposed to go so tight! I immediately backed all the bolts off and set them to the 8 ft/lbs they're supposed to be. But what a tragedy narrowly averted!

Rookie mistake, I know... I'm just so glad I didn't snap a bolt off! I don't think I did any harm taking them all up to 10 ft/lbs (and the one up to 12?), but I guess I'll know if anything leaks.

Speaking of leaks, I decided to go with some Permatex on the head gasket. I had asked about applying some sort of sealant here, and got a few responses (both from builders who didn't add anything), but figured I follow brandEn and HondaMan's advice by applying a very thin layer around the oil passages and cam chain tunnel. I guess I view it as insurance. Here's hoping!

GizmoDuck · « **Reply #63 on:** June 18, 2015, 06:26:20 PM »

Quote from: riverfever on May 17, 2015, 06:43:16 PM

Great progress. I had a similar goal for the back of my bike. I didn't care for the bulky fender and light. This is what I did.

Any other pics of where the bolts go through the fender? Wanted to do this to keep the rolled lip on the fender.

riverfever · « **Reply #64 on:** June 19, 2015, 04:31:12 PM »

I don't think so but I can get some later on.

riverfever · « **Reply #65 on:** June 19, 2015, 08:55:02 PM »

Gizmo...here you can see how I cut the fender. It's still mounted in the stock locations.

I drilled the fender on the sides and used rubber bushings between the fender and frame. Had to get a bit more creative for the other mounting holes. I used some brass tubing as a spacer.

Sorry for the hijack KK.

knottedknickers · « **Reply #66 on:** June 20, 2015, 07:00:59 AM »

Quote from: riverfever on June 19, 2015, 08:55:02 PM

Gizmo...here you can see how I cut the fender. It's still mounted in the stock locations.

Sorry for the hijack KK.

Hey, no worries! Builders helping builders--that's who we are.

Maybe I'll just throw in a few of my own pictures to re-stake my claim here.

Here are a couple of the head installed:

I loosened the head nuts / bolts and re-torqued after 24 hrs, per some peoples' advice. I remembered the different settings for the nuts / bolts this time!

I'm away for a week, so I won't be able to put the valve train together for a while. I've also ordered a few bits from CognitoMoto, so I can get going on the GSX-R front end swap when I get back (you can see the forks from a '96 GSX-R750 in the second picture).

knottedknickers · « **Reply #67 on:** July 05, 2015, 03:04:15 PM »

I'm going to need this some day soon: http://www.thumpertalk.com/blog/7/entry-140-how-to-true-a-dirt-bike-wheel-yourself/. Just putting the link here so I can find it later (and maybe help someone else down the line).

On the subject of wheels... Here's a better picture of the 1996 GSX-R 750 forks I found:

I had to replace the seals and the oil (I went with 5W), which was a lot easier with some help from LarryJ. A few things I like about them: the silver / silver colour (rather than gold / silver or black / silver of some others [just my preference!]); the 'clean' (i.e., symmetrical and basic) top triple clamp; the price was decent (forks, top & bottom triples, calipers & rotors for CAD$225). I've got a CognitoMoto hub on the way, so once I figure out what to do with the stem (lengthen or turn a new one), I can get busy putting the front end together.

knottedknickers · « **Reply #68 on:** July 05, 2015, 03:15:15 PM »

Made some progress this weekend! Got the engine closed up:

Replaced the oil pump o-rings (old one on the left, new on the right):

Got the engine back in the frame (laid the engine on its side and lowered the frame over it) and then back on the stand:

So what's next?!

knottedknickers · « **Reply #69 on:** July 07, 2015, 08:04:14 AM »

Quote from: knottedknickers on July 05, 2015, 03:15:15 PM

So what's next?!

Well, here's what came next:
- attached centre stand (hooked both ends of the spring on the tangs, lined up the holes to insert the shaft, added the cotter pin, and tightened the pinch bolts--quite effortless without the swing arm in place)
- installed swing arm (used the stock shocks, for now; had to put a washer under the grease zerk to get it to point down; hope grease doesn't squirt all over...)
- added driver foot pegs
- fitted rear brake shaft [EDIT: install this before the swing arm as the arm on the shaft won't be able to swing forward of the swing arm without hitting it (which is where it needs to be; see Fig. 14-16, p. 148 of the CB750 Shop Manual)]
- hung oil tank (replaced o-rings)

It's coming along!

knottedknickers · « **Reply #70 on:** July 08, 2015, 12:15:43 PM »

Hmmm... Having problems with posting pictures of late. I'm using OneDrive: click picture, click 'View Original', copy URL, and paste it between

tags in my message. The pictures show up when I 'Preview' my message, and usually for the next day, but after that, they're gone... But that's only been since my post of 20 June; all my earlier pictures--hosted in the same OneDrive folder--show up in the forum. Weird...

knottedknickers · « **Reply #71 on:** July 09, 2015, 06:24:11 AM »

Quote from: knottedknickers on July 08, 2015, 12:15:43 PM

Hmmm... Having problems with posting pictures of late. I'm using OneDrive: click picture, click 'View Original', copy URL, and paste it between tags in my message. The pictures show up when I 'Preview' my message, and usually for the next day, but after that, they're gone... But that's only been since my post of 20 June; all my earlier pictures--hosted in the same OneDrive folder--show up in the forum. Weird...

Like yesterday, I added a picture to Reply #69 and today I can't see it. The image URL is https://kxv5mw.bn1301.livefilestore.com/y2pQ_OoVUd1Y42dqN19IDZDF1GKfoI-WXAnA6nVP22lBUl6wdqK2gF5IpkW5dgbSDFC-3UKcrrViaXMFPfu3689_fxjIkQAaVahXoY-mmf5chu7RQGgP4LMhFdIztLzsy_HplTtHZGvnUgaZcFPWv8Pi8Je4iMqZZm1inkGy0sx9qo/IMG_9091.JPG?psid=1, and if I look it up in a browser it says the image cannot be displayed because it contains errors. I went to the picture in OneDrive again and grabbed the URL again using right-click > "copy image location"; it has changed to https://kxv5mw.bn1301.livefilestore.com/y3pLedRGwTY9UUdjbb8Yzs6SORv7OzbI9pZ1wGR6OceSvhSUhgVeBgeIhnBi529A8eULYw5tlj3U2GACXgErWsTdOZSXE2UjXvuNjYzC7oXKHB105WT8pBaop9RZAP9hMmQ3iX2pG5rZk082GL4XlGFY9kapiPrq0xraFeybmNiHC8/IMG_9091.JPG?psid=1. Interestingly, the URL in the address bar is: https://vaj2hq.bn1301.livefilestore.com/y3p9A3DlleoD0cc2QpMRWN5AOgG4gLjCI_7iSmw3BtG1LdAvrF1LdFW1DDEYzgeglg-tYm1Buy0i3tUSjzWZuk6Ukjaytv-43RotO4qRtofyeMxEyoklyREl5qyO0inXX7obrMktuZJ7idui36Kechq2w/IMG_9091.JPG?psid=1. Should I just use that one?

riverfever · « **Reply #72 on:** July 09, 2015, 08:18:17 AM »

I've noticed that about your thread and the pics. I started to look into it last night but got side tracked. The first link you just provided doesn't work for me. I get redirected but then there's nothing. I use photo bucket and never have an issue posting pictures. I grab the URL link and paste it into my thread and done.

knottedknickers · « **Reply #73 on:** July 15, 2015, 07:55:47 AM »

Quote from: riverfever on July 09, 2015, 08:18:17 AM

I've noticed that about your thread and the pics. I started to look into it last night but got side tracked. The first link you just provided doesn't work for me. I get redirected but then there's nothing. I use photo bucket and never have an issue posting pictures. I grab the URL link and paste it into my thread and done.

Yeah, the links are all quite dead... Really weird, since my other picture links are still working!

Edit: apparently, Microsoft has abandoned static URLs for pictures hosted on OneDrive... See http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/onedrive/forum/odwork-odshare/url-of-files-on-onedrive-changing/91770f99-d819-49f2-a69a-7ed53be8f7f2?page=1&tm=1437233640561. If you use OneDrive to host your pictures you might want to let your voice be heard on the issue here: https://onedrive.uservoice.com/forums/262982-onedrive/suggestions/8437309-bring-back-static-urls-for-image-files-currently. Or use a different photo hosting service. I've gone back to photobucket.

knottedknickers · « **Reply #74 on:** July 15, 2015, 07:58:28 AM »

Those of you who have done a GSX-R front end: did you stick with original controls on the clip-ons (i.e., throttle, clutch, signals, kill switch)? If so, did you have to use shorter cables? I just found that my original 'throttle pull' cable is frayed--so it has to be replaced--but I'm not sure if I should got with stock length, or something shorter...

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Author Topic: CB750K 'Sport Tourer' (Read 23652 times)