Author Topic: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K  (Read 176744 times)

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Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #125 on: October 31, 2014, 08:11:02 AM »
As a reminder, be ready to drill out some or all of the screws that hold on the countershaft bearing holder. Those puppies are staked in there pretty tight and don't like to give up very easily, even with an impact driver there is a good chance you will strip the heads.
Just out of curiosity, do you guys use regular metric Philips head screwdrivers or did you purchase some of the JIS screwdrivers?  I'm asking because I've ordered some of the JIS ones and I'm waiting on them to arrive.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 09:01:16 AM by Restoration Fan »
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

Logan's Reward - CB500 and CB550 Cafes    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,147787.0.html

Offline AintNoEasyWay

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #126 on: October 31, 2014, 09:49:02 AM »
I have just one JIS screwdriver that has really saved me a lot of pain. I also have a JIS impact driver that has saved me from even more trouble.

Offline Stoli

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #127 on: October 31, 2014, 10:26:02 AM »
Not sure what type of bit I have but it is decent quality (edges are still nice and sharp). Don't think it is a JIS bit though. The driver itself is a craftsman but I think the original bit that came with it broke at some point. Those screws are kind of soft so they strip pretty easy. The good thing is that they are easy to drill out because they are so soft.
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Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #128 on: October 31, 2014, 05:50:52 PM »
Center stand is still tacky to touch so I left it drying in the garage but the top & bottom trees and the kickstand are ready.  The kid is doing pretty decently with the rattle can.


Took the wheels to a local bike tire dealer today and they removed the tires for $5 per tire.  I also purchased another gallon of Metal Rescue, but looking at the spokes more closely, I'm not sure the spokes are going to clean up enough to be passable, even if the Metal Rescue removes all the rust.



Got several items almost ready to be painted.  The prep stage is what takes so long but you guys were 100% correct.  It makes all the difference in the world in how the final product looks.  How do you guys surface your front rotors?  I checked and the minimum thickness spec is 6 mm and this one is over 7 mm, so I have plenty of thickness but I'd like to get rid of the rings on the surface of the rotor.


Finally, got my baby back from the mechanics today.  Going to be sorry to see her go but I've dumped too much money into trying to get her back working properly and it's time to sell her and get me a truck.  Gotta have something to bring home the next bike after this one is finished.  ::)



« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 06:01:09 PM by Restoration Fan »
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #129 on: October 31, 2014, 06:36:15 PM »
Also, I asked the guy at the tire shop what tire he recommended.  I told him I'd mostly be riding the bike around town and on weekend rides up into the mountains.  He recommended the Dunlop D404's.  Anyone have experience with these tires and have opinion one way or the other?
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline Stev-o

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #130 on: October 31, 2014, 07:02:20 PM »
I'd replace the spokes with either stock units or stainless units from Buchanan's.


+1.  I'd consider new rims too, if in the budget.  I had Dunlop 404's on my K8, good tire.  I prefer the BT45 that I have on my K4 though. Roadriders are great tires too. 
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #131 on: October 31, 2014, 07:14:07 PM »
I'd replace the spokes with either stock units or stainless units from Buchanan's.

Love the Benz!

I am partial to the Avon RoadRider or Metzlers. Lots use Bridgestones, Dunlops and others Shinkos. You choose!

Thanks, I love that car too.  I blew the motor in it almost a year ago and had it rebuilt.  Long story short but after dumping 5 grand into it, it's still not running right.  If someone has the knowledge and time, they're going to get a steal on this car when I sell it.

Any idea where I can get the stainless steel for the 17" rear rim I have?  I only see 16" and 18" on this site.

http://www.buchananspokes.com/products/spoke_kits_honda_cb.asp
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline knottedknickers

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #132 on: October 31, 2014, 07:39:56 PM »
<snip>

You do want to remove the gearshift mechanism. Still no oil seals that I am aware of but if memory serves, you wouldn't be able to remove the transmission unless you took off the gearshift mechanism. Take lots of pics while you do that. Will make reassembly easier.

What oil seals are you referring to grcamna?
Could it be the seal in the counter shaft oiler? Seems it's pretty important to replace that one for smooth shifting. See here for details.
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Offline Stoli

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #133 on: October 31, 2014, 09:33:00 PM »
Since the 77 and 78 Ks had a different rim than the earlier models, Buchanan's categorizes them as custom instead of a pre-packaged kit. You can read about my experience with that in my first build thread. If you aren't in a rush, I'd call them, order the customs and hope for the best. If they don't fit, then you can send them back and have them adjusted. I'd say there is a 75% chance that they will fit the first time.

Make sure you inspect your rims. You want to be sure that there is sufficient metal left where the nipples seat. It looks OK in the pic but make sure the rust hasn't eaten too much away.
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Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #134 on: November 01, 2014, 12:29:54 PM »
OK, so we've made up our minds that we're going to replace the spokes with stainless steel spokes from Buchanan's once we can get them on the phone on Monday.  But Logan brought up an interesting question that I thought I'd raise to you guys:
We'll use metal rescue on the rims themselves to get rid of the rust on them.  After doing that, since the rims are trued right now, if we remove one spoke at a time and replace it with a new spoke, then tighten that down before starting on another spoke, shouldn't that mean that the wheel will be pretty much trued at the end of the replacement?  For insurance sake, we could always replace the spokes in pretty much a criss-cross pattern sort of like you do when you're torqueing something down. 

Am I crazy or does this actually make sense?
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline grcamna2

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #135 on: November 01, 2014, 01:56:18 PM »
No. Relieving the pressure on a spoke at a time will knock your rim out of true. Release them all, and install them and true later.

Truing is pretty easy, and take a few pictures of their pattern for reference later. Mark the valve location at 6/12:00 for a visual guide. Tension equally, bit by bit upon install.

+1
 You can true it best w/ a truing stand(I have one for bikes but will also fit M/C wheels)and you can make one from wood.Then remember to initially start tightening the spokes w/ an equal amount of threads showing on each spoke and go a 1/2 -1 turn on each one equally until your wheel is tensioned...from that point you can begin truing it from side to side and up and down.
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Offline Tsunami

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #136 on: November 01, 2014, 05:16:47 PM »
Just read through your build, super way to bond with you son.  I once did a similar thing with a car with a blown engine.  He worked the summer to raise the money for the parts and we worked together to fix it.  He was then able to drive off to school in the mid west.

My CB is a 78 as well haven't inventoried the worthwhile parts I will not be using but if you find something you need give me a holler and see if I have it.

Looks like your saving one more from the graveyard, best of luck. I'll keep on watching.
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Offline Stoli

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #137 on: November 01, 2014, 05:32:09 PM »
In theory, your idea of replacing one spoke at a time would probably get you in the ballpark of a straight wheel, that needed minimal tweaking to make true, but the problem is that it is impossible. To remove just one spoke, you would have to cut it and there is no way to replace it without bending the new one into an unusable state. You'll see what I mean when you start disassembling the wheel.

Doing it yourself isn't particularly difficult, but it requires some patience and $75 to $100 in tools. A decent truing stand is about $60-$70 and you'll need a decent spoke wrench. You can also use the stand to balance the wheel when you're done. Buchanan's makes a really nice wrench - a bit pricey but I'm really glad I splurged on it. As an alternative, you can ship them your hubs and rims and have them do it.

There is a decent tutorial on the forum.  Also, considering the nature of your project, another skill learned would be in keeping with the goals of your build. It's a rewarding experience... "Ya, my son and I rebuilt and trued the wheels after we rebuilt the engine..."

I think I have a link to the tutorial in my first project thread.
My Project Threads:
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Project #3 - http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=123831.0  Long and Low

Offline Old Scrambler

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #138 on: November 01, 2014, 06:06:16 PM »
Neat thread :) :) :)

A few comments..............hope to help out............just remember, its YOUR money ;)

Wheels.........Lots of front wheels in much better condition could be had for less than SS spoke package.  All good advice on lacing..........but could use the rear swingarm set in a vice as a truing-stand.

All of the other tires are preferred over 404s.............they're not bad tires, they just don't look right ;)  Maybe that's because I see so many of them on H-D products.
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Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #139 on: November 01, 2014, 07:08:05 PM »
Neat thread :) :) :)

A few comments..............hope to help out............just remember, its YOUR money ;)

Wheels.........Lots of front wheels in much better condition could be had for less than SS spoke package.  All good advice on lacing..........but could use the rear swingarm set in a vice as a truing-stand.

All of the other tires are preferred over 404s.............they're not bad tires, they just don't look right ;)  Maybe that's because I see so many of them on H-D products.

Ha.  Well the guy who recommended them, both him and his wife are Harley riders.  So you're likely correct in your reasoning.  :)

The guy did say that they have a fellow who trues wheels for them for $175 each to lace and true.  If I lace it, he'll true for $100 per wheel.  Still sounds like a lot to me and I've got the SOHC bug 100% now, so I'm almost certain this won't be the last bike that I end up working on after Logan has gone off to college (assuming I can afford other bikes with 2 kids in college at the same time).  So I think Stoli is right...this is another skill we're going to acquire. 

I'll go buy a truing stand and spoke wrench and we'll give it a go.

Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #140 on: November 01, 2014, 07:12:36 PM »
Just read through your build, super way to bond with you son.  I once did a similar thing with a car with a blown engine.  He worked the summer to raise the money for the parts and we worked together to fix it.  He was then able to drive off to school in the mid west.

My CB is a 78 as well haven't inventoried the worthwhile parts I will not be using but if you find something you need give me a holler and see if I have it.

Looks like your saving one more from the graveyard, best of luck. I'll keep on watching.

That's a very generous offer.  Toytuff made a similarly kind offer earlier in the thread and I'll definitely keep both of you in mind if we come across something that you guys might have.

By the way, very envious of your location Tsunami.  That area up around Sacramento is some of the most beautiful country I've ever seen.
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

Logan's Reward - CB500 and CB550 Cafes    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,147787.0.html

Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #141 on: November 01, 2014, 07:19:26 PM »
One other note for the night:  we were able to get the gearshift assembly apart without having to drill out any of the screws.  The good old Craftsman impact screwdriver and a bit of PB Blaster worked wonders.  We're going to try leaving the rotor on as we get to splitting the cases tomorrow. 

We promised my buddy (Logan's project facilitator) that we'd wait until he and his son are here tomorrow before we split the cases.  His son is a freshman in college but he is really interested in the project as well.  So tomorrow afternoon we expect to finally be able to get in to the kickstarter mechanism to see what was going on with it.

Once we get that sorted, hopefully we can start prepping the cases for paint and get the gaskets to start buttoning the engine back up and start reassembly.  ;D
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline grcamna2

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #142 on: November 01, 2014, 07:24:53 PM »
Neat thread :) :) :)

A few comments..............hope to help out............just remember, its YOUR money ;)

Wheels.........Lots of front wheels in much better condition could be had for less than SS spoke package.  All good advice on lacing..........but could use the rear swingarm set in a vice as a truing-stand.

All of the other tires are preferred over 404s.............they're not bad tires, they just don't look right ;)  Maybe that's because I see so many of them on H-D products.

Ha.  Well the guy who recommended them, both him and his wife are Harley riders.  So you're likely correct in your reasoning.  :)

The guy did say that they have a fellow who trues wheels for them for $175 each to lace and true.  If I lace it, he'll true for $100 per wheel.  Still sounds like a lot to me and I've got the SOHC bug 100% now, so I'm almost certain this won't be the last bike that I end up working on after Logan has gone off to college (assuming I can afford other bikes with 2 kids in college at the same time).  So I think Stoli is right...this is another skill we're going to acquire. 

I'll go buy a truing stand and spoke wrench and we'll give it a go.

+1 Ron  ;) ,it's nice to get every spoke evenly torqued to 'spec' and trued up so they roll real nice; do you think you'll put some alloy rims on'er and polish them up to a high shine ?
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #143 on: November 01, 2014, 07:46:57 PM »

+1 Ron  ;) ,it's nice to get every spoke evenly torqued to 'spec' and trued up so they roll real nice; do you think you'll put some alloy rims on'er and polish them up to a high shine ?

It's not out of the question but I honestly don't know where to buy alloy rims from or how much they cost.  I've got literally dozens of parts links saved in my browser but I don't remember seeing them.
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline grcamna2

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #144 on: November 01, 2014, 08:25:00 PM »
Some members here might have a couple or know of where some good used? ones might be had.I know lot's of vintage folks like the shouldered rim Akront type because they speak 'Vintage Classic Quality'... at least they do to me  8)  :)
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
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Offline Stev-o

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #145 on: November 02, 2014, 05:19:54 AM »
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline Restoration Fan

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #146 on: November 02, 2014, 06:10:25 AM »
FYI - DSS sells aftermarket rims for $55...

https://www.davidsilverspares.com/CB750K-FOUR-1977-USA/part_192961/

The good news is that my rear rim looks to be in much better shape than the front rim although I believe that both will clean up just fine.  My only real concern with the front rim is that there is indeed some rust where the spokes join the rim.  The rubber seal was holding moisture in and let it get some rust there.  We'll soak it in some Metal Rescue and hit it lightly with the wire wheel to see how much is left after the rust is all gone.  If it's an issue, I'll definitely buy one of these from DSS.

You can see in the attached photo that it appears that it will clean up in the 2 or 3 places where I hit it with a wire wheel.

The bad news is that DSS also seems to not carry the 17" rear rim. 

While I'm thinking about it, how big of a deal would it be if I replaced the 17" rear wheel with an 18" rear wheel?  What geometry does that affect?  The 18" seems to be much more standardly available and also means I could buy the Bridgestone Spitfires with the raised white letters, which both Logan and I really prefer.  Bridgestone carries the 17" rear rim but only in a black side wall with no white lettering.  I know it's a small and trivial detail...and not a deal breaker long term...but it sure would be nice.  8)
« Last Edit: November 02, 2014, 06:12:56 AM by Restoration Fan »
Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

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Offline toytuff

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #147 on: November 02, 2014, 10:08:10 AM »
I have a front rim for shipping.

tt

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #148 on: November 02, 2014, 12:51:47 PM »
I have a front rim for shipping.

tt

I might need it; I'm not sure.  The front rim cleaned up decently.



However, there are these areas where the rim looks weird.  I can't tell if it was welded there or what it is but it doesn't look like rust.  When you grind that area with a wire wheel, it just gets darker.



Ron

Stella - Logan's Senior Project    78 750K http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=141761.0

Logan's Reward - CB500 and CB550 Cafes    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,147787.0.html

Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: Senior project for high school - 78 CB750K
« Reply #149 on: November 02, 2014, 12:55:40 PM »
Thats pitting from rust mate, looks like a couple of holes right through the rim as well, I wouldn't use them ... ;)....
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