Author Topic: Chronicals of my 550 rebuild - over a month in with one day to go! PICS! (Read 6191 times)

Tim. · « **on:** October 08, 2006, 04:20:18 PM »

My intrepid 550F is coming back from the dead. After tearing the engine down at the end of August, and waiting weeks and weeks for shipments of pistons and gaskets from the US (would you belive both Classic Cycle Parts and Western Hills Honda forgot to ship my stuff for 2 weeks!) I'm THIS CLOSE to getting it back on the road.

Today I put the new pistons and jugs on. Changed out two studs, drained the oil, new filter, dropped the oil pan etc. I had to drop the pan as a stubby 12mm wrench I was using slipped and jumped straight into the engine!

Tuesday I pick up the head. Unfortunately the head wasn't ready on Friday, and it's a long weekend up here which just makes things even more frustrating. That and unseasonably warm weather. Sheesh.

Tim. · « **Reply #1 on:** October 08, 2006, 04:21:19 PM »

More pics

Tim. · « **Reply #2 on:** October 08, 2006, 04:21:49 PM »

bwaller · « **Reply #3 on:** October 08, 2006, 05:24:44 PM »

Looks like things are coming together, too bad you missed out on riding today, it sure was a beauty. Hopefully there will be more days like this one.
It seems like you haven't used any oil on reassembly. Maybe you took some dry photos first?

Tim. · « **Reply #4 on:** October 08, 2006, 06:08:49 PM »

I've been using oil, but not loads and loads of it. Maybe not enough - this is the first time I've done this. Last time I paid to have it done (was only 3 hours extra on top of an already huge bill and the bike was in pieces at the shop, so not much choice!).

I was concerned with slathering the pistons/cylinders with oil, but maybe more concerned than I should have been. By the time I got to putting it together, everything in my garage including me had a nice layer of oil on it, so things went together pretty smooth.

I did slather oil all over the rods and wrist pins and gave the rings a nice coating as well as the piston sides and the bottom end of the cylinders.

I didn't use a ring compressor - didn't have one that fit in the tight space and that could be taken apart to remove. Most are designed to let you push them into the cylinders from above. How on earth does one rebuild a V8 engine anyhow?

I'm looking forward to getting the head back. I just want to ride. I've got a Dyna ignition in the meantime, but will add that on later. I'm replacing the carbs with a fresh set as well, and don't want to change too much all at once. The timing and points/condensers were all done new last spring.

bwaller · « **Reply #5 on:** October 08, 2006, 06:21:01 PM »

Good work, you don't need much oil. Hopefully you'll have better luck this time around.

Jinxracing · « **Reply #6 on:** October 08, 2006, 10:05:34 PM »

Quote from: tintin on October 08, 2006, 06:08:49 PM

How on earth does one rebuild a V8 engine anyhow?

Never done a V8 myself, but when I've seen it done they let the rod hang from the wristpin and insert the piston/rod assembly from the top end with a ring compressor. Once that's in, then fit the big end of the rod on the crank and attach the cap. Needless to say, lots of rags and a steady hand are a good idea to keep that rod end from banging into the cylinder walls and crank journals!

Sam Green Racing · « **Reply #7 on:** October 08, 2006, 10:12:04 PM »

Jinx, I think you'll find there a bit tougher than that

....have you ever seen a top fuel drag crew rebuilb a motor.

If you think the cars are fast, just watch the mechanics

Sam.

Roastem · « **Reply #8 on:** October 09, 2006, 06:18:11 AM »

man all I have ever rebuilt is V8 engines, i got a stang runnin low twelves... but lookin at those pics, i am tryin to figure out if I am goin in over my head rebuilding the 550 engine.....

Tim. · « **Reply #9 on:** October 09, 2006, 09:13:28 AM »

I've NEVER done this before, and it took me 1/2 hour to put all the pistons on the rods and swap out two studs. Then some fiddling with the cylinders - no ring compressors. Would have been a lot easier and faster with ring compressors, but my fingers and the tapered ends of the sleeves got the job done alright.

Just anxiously awaiting the head - will pick up tomorrow and then maybe tomorrow night I get it running again.

MotoRico · « **Reply #10 on:** October 09, 2006, 10:17:07 AM »

Did you put the new pistons and cylinders in with the motor still in the frame?

dusterdude · « **Reply #11 on:** October 09, 2006, 11:47:30 AM »

Quote from: Roastem on October 09, 2006, 06:18:11 AM

man all I have ever rebuilt is V8 engines, i got a stang runnin low twelves... but lookin at those pics, i am tryin to figure out if I am goin in over my head rebuilding the 550 engine.....

OH GOD NOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

Tim. · « **Reply #12 on:** October 09, 2006, 02:54:27 PM »

Quote from: MotoRico on October 09, 2006, 10:17:07 AM

Did you put the new pistons and cylinders in with the motor still in the frame?

Yep - beauty of the 500/550 design. There's plenty of clearance to work - no reason to pull the engine.

Tim. · « **Reply #13 on:** October 09, 2006, 04:45:06 PM »

Got distracted this morning and bought this for my wife, who has finally realized the appeal to 2 wheeled travel.

MotoRico · « **Reply #14 on:** October 09, 2006, 07:14:04 PM »

Quote from: tintin on October 09, 2006, 04:45:06 PM

Got distracted this morning and bought this for my wife, who has finally realized the appeal to 2 wheeled travel.

Does the Hot Wheels sticker make it faster?

Jinxracing · « **Reply #15 on:** October 09, 2006, 07:49:03 PM »

Quote from: samcr750 on October 08, 2006, 10:12:04 PM

Jinx, I think you'll find there a bit tougher than that ....have you ever seen a top fuel drag crew rebuilb a motor.

If you think the cars are fast, just watch the mechanics

Sam.

I've tried to watch them, but they move so effing fast all I can see is a blur! The only time I've ever gotten into a bottom end was in my old '64 VW van...oh yeah, rebuilt the motor too.

putnaja1 · « **Reply #16 on:** October 09, 2006, 09:25:45 PM »

Hey, CB lookin good tintin! While we're on the topic of 550 motor rebuild,

Can someone explain to me why you have to hold up all the valve tappets when you put the valve cover on? I know it's so you won't bend a valve, but how could a cover that can be in place when the motor is running possibly push down the valves when you are tightening it?

Tim. · « **Reply #17 on:** October 09, 2006, 10:35:24 PM »

Because when the cover is off, all the valves are in the closed position, which is never the case when the engine is all in one piece.

You'd be forcing the valves into open positions, at least some of them if you simply put the valve cover back on without backing off the tappets. Because the tappets and valves aren't aligned properly when you're moving the valve cover around, they will likely bind and you'll end up bending stems.

The only way to do it really properly is to back off all the tappets completely and then work through the valve clearance procedure to tighten them all back down to their proper positions as you run through TDC for each piston.

Tim. · « **Reply #18 on:** October 14, 2006, 09:25:32 PM »

Well, we're getting there! One more session and it should be back on the road. Took me 5+ hours to do the following:

Tim. · « **Reply #19 on:** October 14, 2006, 09:26:51 PM »

Tim. · « **Reply #20 on:** October 14, 2006, 09:27:50 PM »

Tim. · « **Reply #21 on:** October 14, 2006, 09:28:22 PM »

Tim. · « **Reply #22 on:** October 14, 2006, 09:30:13 PM »

Tim. · « **Reply #23 on:** October 14, 2006, 09:31:25 PM »

More!

Tim. · « **Reply #24 on:** October 14, 2006, 09:35:30 PM »

So in summary, for my 5 hours I got a decent amount done - took my time, but it's getting there and no issues thus far.

I have a Dyna in the box, but don't want to introduce too many variables into getting it running again. I'm using a newly rebuilt set of carbs that I've never run, along with a new MAC muffler I picked up. The points/condensers/timing were all done 2000 miles ago, so I know they're in good shape. Will put the Dyna on in the spring I think.

mrbreeze · « **Reply #25 on:** October 14, 2006, 10:23:44 PM »

Why wait till spring? I'd throw that Dyna in there now(JUST AN OPINION!!!!!) Peace!!!!

paulages · « **Reply #26 on:** October 15, 2006, 12:32:03 AM »

except that it only takes about 30 minutes to do and completely eliminates one variable when diagnosing potential problems. if it were me, i'd drop it in. but i understand wanting to get back on the road before the weather turns totally sour. my tank, seat and sidecovers got stuck at the painter for over two weeks in august. that was painful...i was stuck riding my 750.

Tim. · « **Reply #27 on:** October 15, 2006, 05:25:53 AM »

I'd sure like to pop it on, but will see if it fires up immediately later today once I get it all done and new fuel lines on.

I haven't spent a lot of time looking at the Dyna, but know I need to run the red power wire to it from a switched source. What's the preferred location for this?

Also, once it's on, what do you use to turn the crank to TDC etc.? Put it in 1st and use the rear wheel? Kick starter doesn't offer the fine adjustment that a wrench on the end of the crankshaft does, but without that big 'nut' on the end, how else does one do it? Or am I being completely obtuse?

One last question if anyone knows - the two black tubes running off the backside of the carbs - not fuel lines - about 12 inches long and pretty small diameter.

What on earth are these? They're listed as Fuel tubes, but they're 3.5mm and don't go anywhere.

Jonesy · « **Reply #28 on:** October 15, 2006, 05:41:06 AM »

The Dyna system gets the power feed from the coil power (black wire with white stripe). I just ran mine along the wire harness section that carries the blue/yellow wires for the points. It is recommended that you solder the red wire, rather than use the cheap wire tap provided in the kit.

Also, on the advance mechanism, all you replace is the breaker cam. The rest of the advance unit and the special endcap nut stays the same. You can still move the engine with a large socket is you have to.

It looks like the hoses are the carb bowl vent tubes (just like the ones on the CB750, but I can't directly compare to my 550 as I have the '78 no-smog model.).

paulages · « **Reply #29 on:** October 15, 2006, 10:32:26 AM »

tintin-

i can't remember exactly where i tied mine in as it is now buried beneath the (originally non-existent) airbox, but it was really easy to find where to do it. i want to say that there was already a bl/wh, blue, and yellow connection in the exact same place that just needed to be tied into. in any case, it works behind the elec. panel.

those carb hoses are indeed the bowl vent tubes, which supply atmospheric pressure the the headspace in the bowls. this pressure needs to be as constant as possible so that fuel will want to climb the jets when there is low pressure in the carbs on the intake stroke. if they are not routed to where they are supposed to be in front of the rear wheel, the jetting could get wacky when you get going fast, and that pressure changes.

Tim. · « **Reply #30 on:** October 15, 2006, 01:42:17 PM »

I would have thought the overflow tubes would have provided the venting. Is there any reason tubes are required on the vents? The parts manual specifies ~300 mm long tubes, which is a foot or so. I'm likely going to put long ones on and zip-tie them in with the overflow tubes, but perhaps too-long might be a problem?

Tim. · « **Reply #31 on:** October 15, 2006, 09:12:55 PM »

So, got the rest of it bolted together and set the tappets.

Seems I have some stuck or failed fuel valves in my carbs, as a couple of them immediately overflowed - no big deal.

Didn't get it up and running - low charge on battery and tired legs didn't help. Need to confirm spark etc. but it should get up and running in a day or so.

I did a very, VERY quick and rudimentary compression test on #4 just out of curiousity. Of course the engine was stone cold and never has been fired. With a few kicks it got up to 150psi which I think is pretty respectable given the conditions. I'd expect it should improve when warm and broken in. Factory spec is 170 so I'm pretty pleased with the results thus far.

Hopefully I'll get it fired up soon so I can synch the carbs. Then the Dyna can go on!

Tim. · « **Reply #32 on:** October 17, 2006, 08:13:35 AM »

So, got it running on #1 and #2. #3 and #4 aren't getting fuel - dry bowls. So, either there's an issue in the T that splits fuel to the carbs or in both valves.

#1 and #2's overflow problem seems to have gone away with some vibration and use. Might just swap out the valves with the ones from my other working carbs to see if that does it. Fuel is getting to the T between the carbs, but not beyond for both.

The good news is that is sounds unbelievable even on two cylinders. This thing is going to be killer once it's running on all 4.

Stevearino · « **Reply #33 on:** October 17, 2006, 05:56:22 PM »

Got to say, reminds me of how I spent a lot of cold winter nights in the garage last year. Nothing to warm me but the thought of hot summer days ahead. That and a cocktail or four.

I took mine out of the frame. I figured that a month on the bench was worth a couple hours of wrassling it back into the frame, rather than a month of crouching over it. Also made cleaning the bottom of the engine that much easier. With the carbs off, it only weighs 120 lbs.

BTW, since I worked out the carb issues, it screams. Success is the sweet reward for ambition, time and persistence.

Tim. · « **Reply #34 on:** October 18, 2006, 06:53:18 AM »

Well it aint winter yet here. I'll be riding this week. Got it running on all 4 and synched up the carbs. Putting the Dyna on tonight, as I don't like the points on #2 and #3 - I think I tweaked them with my wrench when turning the crankshaft at some point.

150 psi across the board - all 4 cylinders reporting the same pressure. It's running great - better than it ever has. Dyna tonight, then I'm riding again.

paulages · « **Reply #35 on:** October 18, 2006, 08:25:14 AM »

congratulations!

bwaller · « **Reply #36 on:** October 18, 2006, 08:40:24 AM »

Well done, here's hoping Indian summer treats us to some more good riding weather.

ProTeal55 · « **Reply #37 on:** October 18, 2006, 08:57:16 AM »

Good job

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Author Topic: Chronicals of my 550 rebuild - over a month in with one day to go! PICS! (Read 6191 times)

Roastem

Stevearino