Topic: Battery died while riding

[akm]

I have a 77 CB550 that I took out for a ride today for the first time this year. I pulled the battery and stored it at 60 degrees during the winter. I put it back in and charged it with a battery minder for 24 hours. When I started it this morning, the headlamp was bright and everything was good. When I came pulling in from riding (30 minutes total) the bike died. Luckily I was home when it died! The headlamp was barely visible and the engine wouldn't even turn over.

Is there something besides battery terminals that need to be attached to the battery that I missed? It doesn't seem like it would be the battery if it held a charge up through the morning. I don't really know anything about the charging system, but it seems unlikely that it would go out the day that I re-installed the battery, but certainly not impossible. Does anyone have any ideas?

Thanks in advance,

akm

[flybox1]

In what RPM's were you riding mostly?  Stopped idling a lot?

Your bike does not charge under 2500 RPM.
If you were consistently above that, you need to verify you have a good battery, and diagnose your charging system.

[akm]

I was going through the city at variable RPMs. The route normally keeps my bike charged. Is it possible for a bad battery to be charged with a tender, hold a charge through the night, then die while riding? I would think that a battery that was bad wouldn't hold a charge through the night, but I don't know.

How do you check that the charging system is working? I have a multimeter.

Thanks,

[flybox1]

FAQ section ma' man 

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,1012.0.html

[goldarrow]

If your charging system is working, should see headlight glows as you rev to 3k rpm and dim as you let go the throttle

[eigenvector]

Is there a fix for that charging system issue?  To me that seems like a big design flaw - draining the battery when RPMs are below 2500 (or whatever the number is).

Would swapping out the regulator and rectifier for a modern part cure that?  Seems like the voltage regulator is the prime culprit here.

[Stev-o]

AKM - charge your battery and then check it as Cal mentioned.
Then start your bike, using your voltage meter on the battery, check volts at differant RPM: 2K, 3K, 4K.  voltage should rise at the higher RPMs, it not, the system is not charging.

I do not have a flaw with the stock system, keep your R's above 5 grand!
No problem!!

[LesterPiglet]

issues like overheating may present themselves...

Overheating what? Vreg? Why don't all non-US bikes overheat as their lights aren't constantly on?

[mrbreeze]

You don't mention how old the battery is either. I had an older battery in my 750 last year. I didn't know it's age because I got it as a spare in a parts purchase. It took a charge from my tender and it worked fine although it would sap out after a week or so of sitting. I would charge it back up and it would be fine. The day it croaked I was out riding and stopped at my watering hole 15 miles from home. I was there for an hour or 2 and rode it about a mile to get a pack of smokes. Came back and stayed another hour or so and when I went to leave the starter cranked over like normal and it just abruptly stopped cranking before it started. No lights, nothing. I checked my fuses and my main was blown. Put a new one in....no difference. So I got a buddy to come get me with his trailer and bring me home. At home I checked it with the DVM and found zero volts. Next day I put a new battery in and everything was golden. I never had any battery....car or bike die like that so now I know something new about batteries!! By the way...there were no charging system problems then or now.

[BobbyR]

There is no design flaw in the charging system. These bikes were built before the laws mandating headlights be on in the daytime.

The result is that while idling you are essentially running solely off the battery.

You need a voltmeter. Charge your battery and when you start the bike. Check the voltage reading the battery terminals note the reading at idle.

Bring the rpms up using the throttle and see if the voltage rises. It should peak about 14VDC.  If it does not rise or rises very little you should look at the regulator contacts.

There is a regulator  adjustment procedure in the shop manual.

[LesterPiglet]

issues like overheating may present themselves...

Overheating what? Vreg? Why don't all non-US bikes overheat as their lights aren't constantly on?

The potential for overheating stems from sitting in stop-and-go traffic and with an air cooled engine, it may not receive the needed airflow for cooling. The electrical system is not involved in this scheme.

I just re-read your post and understand what you're saying now. I think I may be relaxing too much. I'll stub this out.

[akm]

Thanks to everyone that contributed on this!

[Stev-o]

Thanks to everyone that contributed on this!

Sooooo, did you find the issue?

[Duanob]

I found this FAQ a little easier to follow.

http://www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com/FAQ.html

When working properly these charging systems work fine usually. There was another issue back when these bikes were built, they didn't have the stop and go congested commutes we have these days so I guess they didn't anticipate sitting and idling for long periods of time. Be that as it may at 40 or so years old there may be some components that wear out or get weak. Diagnosing which ones to replace is key. Don't start replacing willy-nilly, you can find the actual culprit. My last 550 it turned out to be the two main wires that supply the fuse box were just fried. After replacing them with new all good again. All this after I bought a new vReg and rectifier and a good used alternator, all things I didn't need. But yes start with a known good battery first.

[akm]

I think/hope so. I worked on it yesterday and I am testing the system today.

I checked the voltage on my battery yesterday after charging and letting it rest. It was really close to 12 volts. I started the bike and got the RPMs up and found that the headlight didn't change brightness. I then took both the side panels off and looked at both the battery and the offside where the fuses and quick connects are. I checked the battery terminals, and they were tight. I then looked at the fuses and saw that none of them were blown and started getting worried that I confirmed that two of the easiest and least expensive fixes were not the issue. I decided that it was going to be a bigger project than I could deal with yesterday. As a last resort, I decided to try and wiggle and re-tighten all of the quick connects and fuses and start the bike back up. After that, the headlight got brighter at the high RPMs. So I think that it is possible that one of the connections was not good. I am driving it around today. I will check the voltage and see if the headlight still responds to higher RPMs tonight.

Thanks again,

[flybox1]

If your battery only reads around 12v after charging on a Tender, then your battery is toast. It should be over 13v when fully charged.

FTFY   
and yes, this statement is correct.

[BobbyR]

Your battery is the least of your problems from what you described. Unless you correct the underlying  cause you will continue killing batteries. Luckily, it seems like you figured it out and if you clean the connectors you will be OK. If you took a voltage of the battery at rest, why not at higher RPM.

[BobbyR]

Your battery is the least of your problems from what you described. Unless you correct the underlying  cause you will continue killing batteries.

With all respect, Bobby, if his battery is toast, then no matter what his charging system is doing, the bike will die shortly after riding as whatever charge is sustained in the battery will be depleted promptly since the battery will not accept a recharge from the stator.

All sound electrical systems must depend upon a good, known battery. From there, circuitry and charging become the next focus.

I agree, a voltage test at higher RPMs would be useful once his battery is replaced and in working order. But his battery could easily have "died" over the winter due to a poor tender charger that depleted his battery's solution (desulphured, I think they call it).

Cal you have a gift of taking the long and expensive way around every problem. I love reading your posts for that reason.

I was simply saying if he is checking the the battery voltage, he can check the alternator output.   If the alternator is putting out over 13VDC he knows he has a crappy battery. We all have crappy connectors until someone cleans them. He wiggled a connector and the headlight got brighter. I think there is a cause and effect there. He can do a load test on the battery to see if it is toast. Some folks don't have $80 for a new battery to test an assumption. 

[ofreen]

Your battery is the least of your problems from what you described. Unless you correct the underlying  cause you will continue killing batteries.

With all respect, Bobby, if his battery is toast, then no matter what his charging system is doing, the bike will die shortly after riding as whatever charge is sustained in the battery will be depleted promptly since the battery will not accept a recharge from the stator.

All sound electrical systems must depend upon a good, known battery. From there, circuitry and charging become the next focus.

I agree, a voltage test at higher RPMs would be useful once his battery is replaced and in working order. But his battery could easily have "died" over the winter due to a poor tender charger that depleted his battery's solution (desulphured, I think they call it).

Cal you have a gift of taking the long and expensive way around every problem. I love reading your posts for that reason.

I was simply saying if he is checking the the battery voltage, he can check the alternator output.   If the alternator is putting out over 13VDC he knows he has a crappy battery. We all have crappy connectors until someone cleans them. He wiggled a connector and the headlight got brighter. I think there is a cause and effect there. He can do a load test on the battery to see if it is toast. Some folks don't have $80 for a new battery to test an assumption.

Yeah, it doesn't make much sense to replace the battery before checking the charging system. And a load test on the battery can be done with a simple test light.

[ofreen]

But what is known is that without a good, known battery no other charging tests are relevant.

Actually, you can test the charging system even if the battery will only put out 8 or 10 volts, even without a multimeter.  Once it is running and at revs, if the horn honks and the headlight shines bright, the charging system is working.