Topic: 466 project turned in to a 3+ year gig. now redoing the transmission.

[Jore]

UPDATE 8: The engine is in the frame!

UPADATE 7: the engine is mostly back together pictures of it can be found here: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,157567.0.html

UPDATE 6: The bottom end is back together, the transmission shifts through the gears, now I'm ready to install the pistons and cylinders, and most of my pictures got lost again, I'll try and get those back online.

UPDATE 5: The cases are now painted, as well as the frame modified for the new seat.

UPDATE 4: The cases are split.

UPDATE 3: The 466 overbore is done, I just need to piece the engine back again. (will try to post the missing pics on older posts.)

UPDATE 2: I'm going to overbore the cylinders

UPDATE: Pondering options for a top end rebuild.

Hello people, it's been a while since I've posted anything, but I keep lurking around every now and then. I have a 75 cb400f, that I got some 3 years ago, that supposedly only needed an oil change and a new battery to run perfect (yeah right!). So in that time I've taken the carbs apart a bunch of times, tried to fix them with epoxies find mismatched jets and finally gave up on those half assed  fixes and bought a tune up kit from 4into1. I tried chasing the electrical gremlins out of my wiring to diagnose some charging system failure and ended up taking out the whole wiring. Took the engine out to address some minor* oil leak, and in the end I got a set of new gaskets, fought with the  JIS screwdrivers and got a set of SS allen head screws for the engine.

Well in short, what was supposed to be a quick fun ride has turned in to a full ground up rebuild. I had to bite the bullet at sometime I guess.

As of today, I have:
- A fully repainted frame.
- Rebuilt and painted rims.
- New tires (rear being a reinforced tire that are mostly used Harley ridding cops in Mexico, allegedly).
- New shocks. 
- Painted tank.
- New and painted side covers.
- An unopened set of complete gaskets.
- New rear brake pads.
- New intake boots.
- New tail light.
- Rebuilt and painted front forks with tube gaiters.
- A carb tune-up kit (new jets, needles, etc.)
- A roller frame.

That's the good part, the bad part is:
- The carbs are torn apart.
- I need a new clutch. I've already got a new one waiting to be installed after I split the cases.
- Need to redo wiring (but I want to simplify that).
- Need a new headlight and turn signals.
- Need to split the cases so I can change the gaskets, and see what else has to be done once I'm at it.
- Along with the previous point, I need to remove a screw extractor that broke of while trying to tackle the tensioner screw (idiotic mistake of mine).
- Redo some fins on the oil filter cover. Made a custom spin-on filter adjustment, jump to page 4-5 to see it.
- Get the seat upholstered. Ordered one from 4into1.
- New battery.
- New spark plugs.
- New front brakes. New pads and some master cylinder parts are in the way
-Engine is complete, it just hasn't been turned over or run since I took it out of the frame about a year and a half ago. Engine is mostly in pieces now.

And finally, ride the bike, it's been ages since I have it mostly as a basket case. I'm scared of splitting the cases, but I have read a bunch of great threads regarding that. I'm planning on buying on engine stand similar to this one: http://goo.gl/mz8VOo so I can tackle the job. I have the tools and determination to do this, I just need some guidance, also most of the parts can be sourced here in Mexico, and would like to avoid importing stuff from the States as most as possible since the current exchange rate and import taxes are just horrible.

Thanks and sorry for the long post, pointers and other tips on where to begin are greatly appreciated.

[hotdog]

Yamiya now stock CB400 parts, maybe check out their prices.

http://www.yamiya750.com/

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[calj737]

You don't need to split the cases to replace any gaskets. And why split the cases unless there's a reason to do so?

If you do go that route, then do replace the cam and primary chains. And all the requisite seals since you've opened a can of worms...

The only reason to simplify your wiring is if you are abandoning stock components. Every wire is used and exists for a reason. Swapping to a modern Reg/Rec can simplify a little bit, but not sufficiently to replace a whole harness.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Jore,

Don't split the cases unless you need to because of bottom end issues. You can refresh all of your top end gaskets without a complete engine disassembly.

Also you may want to ask the moderatorto move this thread to the Project forum. You'll get more focused feedback about rebuild issues there.

[FunJimmy]

^+1^

I'm with Cal on this too. Honda engines (particularly bottom ends) can see tens of thousands of miles without anymore than regular oil changes. Don't split unless you have good cause. Especially if you're not super comfortable with your abilities and budget/timeline. That could easily put the brakes on your (now 3 year) progress. Ditto on simplified wiring. Try to sort out what's there. It will save you a bunch of time and frustrations. Get help from mechanically minded friends if you have trouble finishing or tackling stages of the build. It's important to keep moving to your end goal and not allow to much time to pass or complacency can set in. Good luck

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Jore,

Where are you in Mexico. DF? If so, I know an excellent builder there who can help you out if you get stuck with mechanical issues.

Rodrigo Tuero of Soul Motor Co. 044 55 1374 7259

[Jore]

Thanks for the pointers, I'm actually two hours north of Puerto Vallarta, so Mexico D.F. is really far away, about 8 hours driving from here. but I do have a friend who has a shop and worked for a bunch of time in a Harley shop, but he's had 750's for about 20 years, both sohc and dohc variants. He's the one who helped me rebuild the front end. But I would like to do as much as possible by myself, since his shops wainting list is really long and kinda expensive ( he get bikes shipped from most of the west coast). I'm thinking that splitting the cases might be necessary since the bolt for the chain tensioner, the one's  that's just on top of the oil filter has a broken screw extractor stuck inside, and also I cracked that area a bit trying to get it out, so it might need a weld or something. I'll post a pic later so you guys can give your opinion on that.

For the moment I want to center on the motor, so I can mount it on the frame then get to the electronics, so may plans for the wiring aren't set in stone for the moment.

[Blackfin5]

Jore, hola.  Where in P.V.?  I used to have a place in Playa Conchas Chinas.

[Jore]

Hey blackfin, it's actually Tepic, but nobody knows the place (even here in Mexico lol).

[Blackfin5]

Sure...up north in Nayarit.  Been there many times.  I hear some big money developments went into Punta Minta and Banderas Bay.  Havent been there since about 2004.

[Jore]

Yeah it's growing big time down there, even if it's getting kinda crowded in some areas it still rocks.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Me and my better half like to stay at a great little boutique hotel in Playa Conchas Chinas called Villas in Vallarta.  Great little hide-away with a tiny private beach.  http://villasinvallarta.com/

[Blackfin5]

No way!   My old house is now a bed and breakfast just down the road and still called Casa Maria Cortez. 

[Jore]

Those places look amazing, you should explore the area, I love going to beaches in the middle of nowhere where your only chance of getting there is either walking, taking a 4x4 or getting there by water. Sadly enough I've haven't had as much time on my hands to go out and do that lately.

[Jore]

Hello again, I've finally found the time and funds to get the project rolling again. Since the last week I got the motor on a stand. Currently all I have done is removed the spark plugs and gave the cylinders a squirt of pb blaster and filled them with ATF and acetone. I also have beeb giving all of the screws a squirt of pb blaster for the past few days and letting it soak in before attempting anything. One more thing I have is a complete set of allen head ss screws to swap out the old JIS ones.

I'm planning on first giving the engine a good deep cleaning with gunk gel and an assortment of brushes, and then I'll continue. I'm really hopping not to have to split the cases and just do the top end and piston sleeves,might as well add to that some new rings and a slight hone.

What points should I check now?

Edit: I tried cranking it but it woundn't turn, but now that I think of it, I might have left it in gear the last time I fiddled around with it.

[calj737]

Here you go, Jore, the easy way to get your SS bolts
https://alloyboltz.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=316_358_371&osCsid=749hhtk2tu14ij9et8u7klt5t4

If you get a set of JIS screwdriver bits (member Gordon "ilikebikes" sells them on the forum) and an impact hammer (it's a type of hammer-driven screwdriver) every one of the JIS screws will turn straight out.

If you do remove the piston and ring, definitely at least hone the cylinders and install new rings. Check with quality instruments for piston and cylinder measurements, ring end gap (upon reassembly) and be mindful of piston-wall clearance when honing.

If you pop the shift level back on, you should be able to ratchet the transmission back to neutral and rotate the motor easily.

How about some pictures of your bike, and progress?

[Jore]

Thanks Calj, I already have a set, I bought the set from 4into1. I'll post pics as soon as possible.

[Jore]

I might have just screwed up big time!
So a few minutes back I tried turning the motor over,no luck, I tried taking it out of gear, I just hear a click going up or down but don't feel the gear engaging, pulled the clutch and try again still no luck, so I turn my attention to the chain sprocket and it turns easily by hand, by this point I'm thinking it might be in neutral.

So I think that a slight nudge on the nut that's on the right side, the one from the points plate might do the trick and turn the motor over, well no luck, that's my screw up, I didn't even give it an eight of a turn nor I put a lot of force to it and bam, the bolt that holds it together sheared, along with 2 little nubs under the the big nut.

This is, how the damage looks:





So now what, did I mess up the crank? Can that be fixed, should I not worry about for the moment?

[strynboen]

think you have hydro locket the engine...filling the cylenders vill blokate rotation

[Jore]

Thanks strynboen, but I removed the spark plugs before trying to turn it as not to hydro lock it.

[strynboen]

  bad luck then..sorry for that..no easy fix  this..

[madmtnmotors]

The "nubs" are part of the advance mechanism. The broken bolt on the other hand, is threaded into the crank. Circle the points plate mounting screws with a sharpie (felt marker) so you can put it back in the same spot. Remove the points plate and advancer mechanism so you can evaluate where the bolt broke. If part of the bolt is still sticking out of the crank then you might get lucky and turn it out with vise grips. Then all you have to do is find a new bolt and advancer mechanism. If the bolt broke off flush (or worse), then you have more of a job on your hands, but far from impossible.

Good luck!

[Jore]

The initial panic attack has passed, I saw a picture of the advancer off the engine and I'm thinking I might be able to pull it off and redo the part in a lathe, as for the screw, it seems that it's aluminum so I might be able to use a thin screw extractor to take it out, and then redo it in the lathe also.

[FunJimmy]

The initial panic attack has passed, I saw a picture of the advancer off the engine and I'm thinking I might be able to pull it off and redo the part in a lathe, as for the screw, it seems that it's aluminum so I might be able to use a thin screw extractor to take it out, and then redo it in the lathe also.

Sorry to hear about your troubles.
Extra work for sure but nothing to get to worried about.

[Jore]

I couple of more hours in to it I guess, my new concern is what to do with the stuck engine, if it's stuck, since I have to remove the head, first thing to do is remove the cam, I can take out one of the screws from the cam sprocket but the other one might only be accessible with a spanner to take it out, so what to do with this?