Author Topic: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?  (Read 6383 times)

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Offline Tim.

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Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« on: May 25, 2005, 05:49:34 PM »
So... long story short my pal Chundy and I are having our heads examined.  That is to say, our cylinder heads ('77 750K and '76 550F respectively) are being worked over by a local machine shop that does a lot of car and boat work.

Anywho, we first dropped off the 750 head.  He quickly popped off cylinder #4's intake and exhaust valves, and noted some play in the exhaust guide.  The intake was fine.  He checked the stem diameters, and everything was fine.

To correct the exhaust guide play, he's installing (in all four guides) bronze valve guide liners taking them back down to original spec.  Apparantly these wear much better and dissipate heat better than the original material.  Not necessary on the intakes given the much cooler operation.

Anyone have this done before?  My head is there now for the same treatment.  He's doing that, along with replacing the stem seals and reseating and lapping the valves.  All for the grand sum of CAD$150 or so.  Sounded like a great deal, which is why mine is in there too.  We dropped them off on Wednesday, and are getting both back on Friday  ;D

Just looking for some feedback on the work being done and the price being paid.  If it turns out well, and is as good a deal as it seems, perhaps Chundy will let the Toronto area folk on the board in on the secret location (he found them).  They also do aluminum welding which can come in handy.
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Offline MRieck

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2005, 07:16:34 PM »
Knock the guide out and put in bronze guides. Liners are old car stuff. Seriously take your stuff to a machine shop that does bike work. Too late I guess but I think that stuff is bandaid. Also...is that a Serdi valve job??
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Bobby

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2005, 09:16:12 AM »
I've never done the "liners", however I have done Bronze Guides on a few non-SOHC's, primarily my old Z1-900's.  As Mike posted, I would have this done at an Automotive machine shop that specializes in hotrods.  Not cheap, but replacing the valve guides was only one step when building a monster head.  Let us know how it goes...

 

Offline Tim.

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2005, 05:15:26 PM »
Got the heads back today.  They sure look nice if nothing else  :)  They blasted them clean and put new silver paint on.  They put liners in two of my exhaust guides.  While new guides would be preferable, this apparantly will do the trick.  I'll keep my eyes peeled for new guides for next time.

So, replaced the seals, 2 guide liners, ground seats/lapped valves, cleaned, painted and they machined .006 of an inch off the bottom to level it out/clean it up.  $150 Canadian.  Seems like a decent deal.

Chundy's came out nice also - he had a broken mount for his exhaust brackets on cylinder #2.  They built up the aluminum and tapped it and put in a heli-coil as well.

Pics of the 550 head:


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Offline MRieck

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2005, 07:09:04 PM »
While I'm not found of guide liners it is a great price and the head looks good. Better than it was for sure!
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Offline Tim.

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2005, 07:32:51 PM »
Ohhh yeah.  The carbon build-up was something else.  I expected Han Solo to pop out.

We weren't actually expecting the paint job.  I guess it was necessary after the media blast.  These guys work on all sorts of vehicles, ranging from high-output chevy big blocks to inboard motors on boats.  The guy working on our stuff rides - Ninja 1100 or some such nonsense.  He educated us on the wear indicators on the head showing the tolerance for machining the surface etc.

Both the heads will have a few days for the paint to fully cure before they're installed.  Can't wait to hear it run with a fresh bore, new pistons/rings, rebuilt head and rebuilt carbs.
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Offline wohali

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2010, 06:00:51 PM »
Did you ever get the thumbs up to admit whoever this was who did this work?

Offline Spiider

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2010, 06:48:24 PM »
+1 I have a 750k3 head I'd like redone as well....I'm from Guelph but I'm into Toronto every day.
Sounds like a great deal. Please PM me if you don't wish to publish who they are.




srook

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2010, 08:25:53 PM »
You guys from TO if you want to drive an hour over the Rainbow bridge into Grand Island, Fast By Gast does serdi valve jobs on CB750s.  http://www.fastbygast.com/   They are reasonable and they have a fantastic reputation.  I'm surprised their isn't any motorcycle specific machine shops in the GTA.
Scott

Offline wohali

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2010, 11:15:09 AM »
There's a ton in the GTA - was just curious who did Tim's and Chundy's work specifically, as it's convenient to where I live downtown (no car!)

In fact I'm probably getting repair work done at Gord Bush in Etobicoke on my crankcase crack...

Offline Tim.

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2010, 12:08:47 PM »
Blast from the past!

You don't want the shop we went to. They neglected to put my new stem seals on and I ended up having to rebuild the engine AGAIN!  Oil drawn in through the worn seals glazed the cylinders blah blah blah

Rebuilt it and sold it a few weeks later. Bought a BMW R75/6 with the money. Now I have an XS650 and SR500

For a GTA shop I'd highly recommend Gord Bush Performance in Etobicoke. I had my XS engine bored and valves done there. Top notch shop

Tim
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Offline wohali

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2010, 12:29:43 PM »
Gord is exactly who I'm already going with - thanks for letting us curious types know!

Offline wrenchmuch

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2010, 03:26:22 PM »
+1 on Gord Bush . He did my guides , valves , and bores . I put it all together . I'm really happy with my engine . I'm saving up now to build another engine . He'll be doing the machine work .
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Offline 754

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #13 on: December 15, 2010, 07:59:41 AM »
Do you think ir was passing oil due to no seals?, or the liners?
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Offline Gaither

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #14 on: December 15, 2010, 08:56:32 AM »
IMHO

Without the seals installed, it would be expected to pass oil. Leaving 'em out is unforgivable!
Gaither ('77 CB550F)

Offline MRieck

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #15 on: December 15, 2010, 09:43:53 AM »
IMHO

Without the seals installed, it would be expected to pass oil. Leaving 'em out is unforgivable!
Yeah....that pretty much sums it up.
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Offline 754

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #16 on: December 15, 2010, 09:39:53 PM »
I can see the benefits of stem seals.
  However, the first 750s did not use them as well as many other Hondas, and they seemed to work fine. Note bad smokers like the Z-1 Kaw to mention one that was known for it..

 How is it that Honda got away without them for so long.. ???
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
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Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline wannabridin

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Re: Bronze valve guide liners - anyone with experience?
« Reply #17 on: December 15, 2010, 10:21:56 PM »
So does anyone know any good shops around the fort worth area?  Id love to send the head to Mike for a valve job and guide installation, but shipping can't be the cheapest... 
1976 CB750K, currently under construction:
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=64468.0

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