Topic: Ignition options for a big bore streetable dragibke

[TurboD]

I all reality, a good set of points and a good set of coils will perform fine. Add a rev limiter for a piece of mind.

This bike below has all stock ignition and I've had no problems.

[dragracer]

I all reality, a good set of points and a good set of coils will perform fine. Add a rev limiter for a piece of mind.

This bike below has all stock ignition and I've had no problems.

Nice view. -)

[TurboD]

Thank you frank. Here's one just for you, I am putting the finishing touches on it. (again Dyna S and coils).

[gschuld]

Hondaman,

Great info, lots to digest.  Here is my RC ported head, MRieck was in the middle of upgrading to 33.5 intakes in this photo.  From your thoughts above, it sounds like more spark energy is preferable over more spark duration.  MRieck has the fine details regarding the finished compression ratio, so I can't speak about those details with confidence.  It will be running modern JE forged 71(and a little change) mm pistons.

I'm glad that you posted as I am keen to know more about your transistorized ignitions with regards to a motor and intended use such as mine.

TurboD,

That's basically my thought as well, but keeping an open mind to other options as I learn more from people here more knowledgeable than I am.  Plus, discussing multiple ignition options in general in one thread is a good way to gather information where people can easily access it later.

George     

[dragracer]

Thank you frank. Here's one just for you, I am putting the finishing touches on it. (again Dyna S and coils).

Love my Kaws too. CV carbs- smart street move.

[TurboD]

I've put a bunch of those GSXR carbs on the old Kaws, They really run great and wake em up.

[scottly]

Funny thing is I'm not necessarily all that concerned about the best bang for the buck.  My ARD and RC distributor hardly qualify.  I'm more interested in having a finished product that I'll be happy with.  My natural preference leans HEAVILY toward period correct OLD SCHOOL low tech, nothing more. 

The Gerex was about the best ignition in the '70s, but it was considered high tech back then, so I guess it wouldn't meet your standards, even if you could find one. Seems Mr Collins thought well of them?

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

I think the majority of reliability issues was with the Dyna 2000 units. 

[FunJimmy]

Johno, how many primary wires go the coil pack? Three or five? Jimmy, same question.

Not sure I follow Scottly.
The C5 wires up the same as a Pamco or Dyna S.
Can you explain?

[johno]

There have been more reports of Dyna S failures over the 5 years I've been on the forums than all other ignition systems combined. Evidently they got some bad parts for a while?

Johno, how many primary wires go the coil pack? Three or five? Jimmy, same question.

Hi Scottly,
With the 4 individual coils there are 4 trigger wires all different colours from down below, then a common earth black wire wired to all 4 coils  going back down below.   The system doesnt have any seperate earth wire to the frame, happens through the pick up modules, these picks are moulded in with the PLC and the system earths through that.  There are 2 other wires to provide 4 easy programs by earthing /unearthing without connecting the lap top., a green wire for tacho and the good old power supply wire to go down below.
Fair dinkum mate the spark  is like an arc welder and doesnt stop, uses the resister caps and leads to get the big fat mother.    The only problem is it sprays the spark around like a mad womans sh#t    cylinders 1 & 2 , normal & advanced , 3 &4  both  massively retarded, dunno what he done inside but my gut feel is he lost the plot between the wasted spark and non wasted spark software.
cheers johno

[johno]

Hope I'm not boring you with tales of woe but something is really intriguing me.
Based on discussions with power arc garry I assume I was the first to run the 4 coil non wasted system, had a few teething issues etc , thought we had fixed them etc , but NO.   Now it appears the cycle X drag bike must have been the second bike to run it as Garry said that they had the same issues with the instructions etc        What intrigues me is the cycle X boys broke a crank ?? I understand it is a completely different engine but  looking at the video I hear it has the same kind of exhaust noise at constant throttle as mine and on accel sounds the same , long and lots of flames out the exhaust at same throttle positions as mine.  Guess what ? mine was
running #$%* but I thought it sounded nice.   The tell tale for me was the exhaust temps that indicated the 1& 2 cylinders were approx OK but the 3 &4 cylinders were way way retarded with no 4 so retarded the exhaust pipe was almost cold and no 3 exhaust which was red hot burning lots of fuel down the pipe

I would give my left nut to find out what the cycle X exhaust temps were , it would indicate mine was just good old fashioned faulty or if their bike has similiar exh temps it would indicate a similiar problem to mine and may have caused a detonation crank break.

He is too busy to discuss anything with me but I know he has some good mates on the forum that he would discuss things with, its just a long shot but if you get a chance raise the issue for me. Either way it would indicate where I stand with my unit one off problem or a common software problem 

[POPS 911]

FRANK: Tell these folks all the DYNA parts we have seen on drag bikes for the past 20+ years = that won many races and Championships..... George:  Honda put a rev-limiter on a stock bike from the factory that is 34 years old = my CM400A HONDAMATIC  1981 came from the factory with this built in 7000 rpm LIMITER that will shut the engine down until rpms are below 5000 and then come back to life. If you listen real close there is a few BUSA in ST/BK class that have a two step [ works off clutch lever ]  that they screw on at the last yellow bulb [ watched a guy on his BUSA this past Saturday run 8's at 170 mph with a .000 light ] with this set up and win.] If you miss a shift on your vintage drag bike foot shifting you could float a valve = many vintage racers did that in the old days and that's why their is a company named DYNA that saved them vintage racers from engine problems with their parts that worked for years.

POPS BK911

[bwaller]

A couple of us here use a GSXR ignition. George, it's not old school but is simple transisterized. The installation needs some attention, but I,m thrilled with it. If it's adequate for those engines....

[MRieck]

A couple of us here use a GSXR ignition. George, it's not old school but is simple transisterized. The installation needs some attention, but I,m thrilled with it. If it's adequate for those engines....

....and it works well on 550's too. I have seen it.

[Leino]

I didn't take time to read through the thread but have any of you considered using Ignitech?
Very flexible, programmable and most classic-RR guys here use it.

[BPellerine]

the ard may not be the best option and is old school but it should last at least 1/4 mile to 5 miles of wfo .haha bill
the bottom line is that you really wont know until you do things yourself,if I had listened to only the negative I would not have done it,and I don't keep things that do not work for me!

[scottly]

I think the majority of reliability issues was with the Dyna 2000 units.

Way more failures with Dyna S than 2000, like about 30 to 1, from a rough guesstimate.

[Medyo Bastos]

I think the majority of reliability issues was with the Dyna 2000 units.

Way more failures with Dyna S than 2000, like about 30 to 1, from a rough guesstimate.

yeah, i stopped using dyna's years ago because of issues right out the box...

[bear]

I'm still running the same two Dyna S units I brought in 2009.
The extra unit I brought as a spare is still sitting in my spares box unopened.

Cheers,
Brian

[dragracer]

I'm still running the same two Dyna S units I brought in 2009.
The extra unit I brought as a spare is still sitting in my spares box unopened.

Cheers,
Brian

My Dyna S has been on my bike since 1998. The one on my old K model was on it since 1988. The one on my Kaw dragbike has been on there since 1995. Hmmm, no one in my circle of friends has ever expressed failure of their units.

I suppose i'll start to poll others i come across to see what their experiences have been.

[Bill/BentON Racing]

Samauto's DynaS dates back to 1985. DynaS and Dyna green 3ohm coils and NGK wires work real well. Like MSD stuff also. Gerex worked well, but not many around  and limited by battery voltage concerns. ARD's cool factor hard to beat. I like ignitions that fire one plug at a time. Yes, I know Dyna fires 2. Sure don't like what happened to Johno's engine, heartbreaking, Bill

[kmb69]

A couple of us here use a GSXR ignition. George, it's not old school but is simple transisterized. The installation needs some attention, but I,m thrilled with it. If it's adequate for those engines....

What model GSXR ignition are you using?

[bwaller]

Actually mine is an 89 GSX1100 Katana 

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,145739.0.html

[scottly]

I'm still running the same two Dyna S units I brought in 2009.
The extra unit I brought as a spare is still sitting in my spares box unopened.

Cheers,
Brian

My Dyna S has been on my bike since 1998. The one on my old K model was on it since 1988. The one on my Kaw dragbike has been on there since 1995. Hmmm, no one in my circle of friends has ever expressed failure of their units.

I suppose i'll start to poll others i come across to see what their experiences have been.

Someone tried to start a poll on failed Dyna S ignitions 5 years ago, but it turned into 7 pages of mostly BS. I copied/pasted voxonda's input:

Feel the need to respond. Have a failure with the Dyna "S" too. Otherwise had no problems with it, starts immidiately, runs very well until.............Had a demo run with my replica. During warm-up bike all went well, then the rider went the first laps and commented "bike runs great, all looking good" when he came in for me to do a check up. When demo started after 2 viscious laps, bike started to misfire until it completely came to a hold. Shiitttt............. after the finish picked up the bike and went back to the paddock. Put it on it's stand and decided to start it up to see what was wrong. Just one kick and bike ran great. What's that??? Discussions about other probable causes, petrol, carb's. Decided that since bike ran that great we'll start in the second run to see what happens next. To make story short(er), same happened all over again, bike and rider Tonnie came to a hold. He waited for about 5 to 10 minutes and restarted and bike ran great again, for about a lap and a half. Same story all over.
Well decided to mount a self-generating ignition after that demo and keep the Dyna to see if it can be repaired.
At one point 'Two-tired' commented months ago that maybe Dyna is using other components than in previous years(?), heard later that maybe the later Dyna'S' probably are not US made anymore????Anyone? Still use the electronic devices, found that points gave problems higher up the revscale, like floating, could not fix that and gave up on points. (Ps. do not use mine on street, just tacks)

Rob

[kmb69]

Actually mine is an 89 GSX1100 Katana 

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,145739.0.html

Thanks Brent. Don't know how I missed that.