Topic: LED headlamp upgrade questions

[Muckinfuss]

Muckinfuss... that Speedmetal bulb swaps out an existing H4? Meaning, if I have an H4 headlight (Hella), I could try this one too? The Speedmetal is the same thing (basically) as the Cognito one?

http://cognitomoto.com/collections/lighting/products/h7-led

yep.  same set up on one of my sportsters as well.  my heritage, however, is pure halogen on the front end using high wattage, non DOT approved bulbs from Osram that put out 130W/100w in the main and 80w X 2 on the light bar for night riding in the mountains out west.

[nicks2319]

Had both a normal h4 and now a Truck Lite LED housing. Truck Lite one rocks. Heavy as hell but very bright.

[Deltarider]

Hella is known for really good reflectors.

I always had one and it's good and cheap. It's the same model that was used on early models VW Golf (Rabbit).

and the oscillating daytime light

Just curiosity. Weren't there some states in the US where daylights that oscillated between lo and hi beam were mandatory for motorcycles? I seem to remember having read about it.

that put out 130W/100w in the main and 80w X 2

Watts don't mean much in this respect. You can have a bulb that consumes an incredible amount of Watts but still have a miserable light.

[PeWe]

Something like this? I have seen when searching for reflectors to my CB750 that JEEP Wrangler has same size, 7".
http://www.amazon.com/Wrangler-Headlamp-Conversion-Truck-Lite-27270C/dp/B00B5WJHSI

[Muckinfuss]

Delta.......they don't oscillate the hi/lo..only the low and only during daylight.  hi/lo is illegal.  I don't recall any laws mandating the use, but there are 50 states so anything is possible at one time or another.  I would think that mandating would create cross boundary legal issues on face.

not sure where you got your engineering degree....but watts is a measure of the work done by the current applied using volts and amps used in electric circuitry.  Watts can measure other than electricity........  Like horsepower or torque are measures of two or more inputs and considered valid measures of output.  watts can be converted to calories burned when riding a bicycle.  watts can be converted to pound/feet of torque etc, etc.  in it's purest ..... a watt is a measure of power derived from combined inputs.   A watt is one unit of power in the International System of Units (SI) equal to one joule of work performed per second, or to 1/746 horsepower.    it's pretty consistent across all lighting.  when you apply other variables such as color, reflector design, lens interference or modification you may perceive differences in what is projected, but those become cognitive issues.......get the point?

[flatlander]

"watts is a measure of the work done" - that's true: watts don't measure luminosity. it can be used as a frame of reference between bulbs of the same construction but between different bulb types it does not necessarily let you conclude on light output, just how much "work" you need to put into them. that's why LED bulbs usually have a lower wattage than conventional bulbs with the same light output. they're just more efficient.

it's like 50hp with a 50kg bike accelerates differently than 50hp with a 500kg bike but it's still 50hp put into both.

[Deltarider]

Watts can... Watts can... yes Watts can.
I thought I made myself clear.

Watts don't mean much in this respect.

Wonder where you learned reading. 

[b5rider]

I have the Truck-lite on my bike. I had to buy a slightly longer bolt in order for the bracket to fit, but that was the only modification.

[PeWe]

The sealed bulb the US bikes came with has a very bad light, right? European H4 is a real upgrade? Philips have good H4.
On top of that modern LED lamps/bulps that have much brighter light.

I guess we have different experiences, US models vs Europeean were we have H4 and must have LO/HI with LO constantly lit when driving.

[Deltarider]

The sealed bulb the US bikes came with has a very bad light, right?

The traditional sealed beam lamps that were on most US cars for decades were next to useless. I remember European carmakers that had made an effort and developped excellent lamps (Mercedes-Benz, Peugeot) but that happened to be not round had to remove the good lamps nevertheless from models exported to the US and replace them by worhtless sealed beams that even in double configuration were below standard.

[Muckinfuss]

degradation of the filament in incandescent lighting is what causes the 'fade' over time..  Clearly if an inferior or contaminated tungsten was used, that would start the process sooner, like right out of the box.  The whole point of Edison's vacuum was to slow the evaporation of the filament.  Sealed beam is just a larger package.  The addition of inert gasses are further able to influence color and speed of filament evaporation.  US Auto headlights are held to specific 'brightness' by law.....and then that brightness starts to deteriorate the minute you first light them up.  Bulb manufacturer's play a marketing game with metal oxide coatings that give the illusion of a brighter light, but the facts are static....you can only get so much light from a filament with a fixed amount of voltage and resistance and that light will fade until the filament breaks.  All filament bulbs are low on the Kelvin color scale which makes them more yellow.  Consider that not everyone perceives all colors the same, which is why there are those who may see sealed beam as inferior because they project in the spectrum that their eyes are less able to capture.
HID uses an electric arc 'recipe' that excites the charge of gas and metal salts contained within the bulb package.  No filament issues and a completely different projection and color, which some find superior and others find irritating. 

NEt, net.....different strokes for different folks.  There is no 'one way' is the best or only way.

[turboed13b]

You can get hid capsules in any color kelvin your eyes prefer. If you want the most usable light in front of you a HID capsule with a projector is the only way. It is far superior than any sealed beam or h4 drop in.

All of the h4 led and HID drop ins will not work correctly with the reflector housings.

[flybox1]

All of the h4 led and HID drop ins will not work correctly with the reflector housings.

why not? 
If the HID gas bubble is of the same focal length as the halogen bulb element that came with the H4, I dont see any issues (..unless the reflector and glass are totally wrong. i.e. offroad use , UK spec, etc...) 
you will get more, cleaner light in the same pattern as a halogen bulb in the housing.

[turboed13b]

Here is a good explanation.


http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

[Muckinfuss]

I glanced at the 'good information'.  It's data, not information....and requires a CIA level decoder ring to really understand each granule since there's no legend in the report.  I suspect the asterisks of (fail) influence the reading.  It's a critical path to market any product that has DOT measures applied to it and that would be my acid test of pass/fail.  In other words, if a manufacturer hasn't done their due diligence in getting the appropriate third party certifications of a product in this scenario....the lawyers would be all over the first accident that could even remotely be attributed to its use.  Hence disclaimers such as "for off road use only" when a product is clearly aimed at on road use.

Here are my immediate impressions....the report only focused on the 'spread' of the light.....not the distance it projected, contrast ratio (the color thing) and the brightness measures weren't easily understood.  Second, and most important...it's 13 years old.  Tell me what technology that is in flux for the past thirteen years you would rely on that age of data to form an opinion?  That predates the first I-phone by five years.  Consider also, at the time of this report, 42 inch, 720P plasma TV's were around $8000 according to a friend of mine who owns an A/V chain of stores and LCD HDTV was only in magazine articles.  Lastly, the preamble to the report on the website was 98% marketing, so it should be discounted 100%. 

That said...if you like today's HID retrofit product, then it's the right thing for you.  Some have had excellent results with LED, some still like their old H4 based on purely human perceptions, or purely human cash flow, over science/pseudoscience or even marketing.

[chewbacca5000]

For $20 bucks draws less watts and makes more light.  Another member has one and loves it.  Says it is much brighter than stock and uses less power.  He was having issues with his Halogen using too much juice.  Got one of thes babies and all is well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/281419853101?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

[calj737]

My only question is: with that bulb, what oil should I run?

[b5rider]

My only question is: with that bulb, what oil should I run?

Lol.  So many variables

[Nayl]

Actually, I believe the crucial question is what flavor of popcorn goes best with this thread?

[PeWe]

For $20 bucks draws less watts and makes more light.  Another member has one and loves it.  Says it is much brighter than stock and uses less power.  He was having issues with his Halogen using too much juice.  Got one of thes babies and all is well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/281419853101?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

That bulb look fun.
I use this one:  written to be 3000LM!  Good to have good light to avoid collisions with the popcorn eaters!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/High-Power-H4-9003-LED-30W-6000-K-Lumen-Head-Light-Lamp-/301375731172?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item462b64b5e4

[turboed13b]

I glanced at the 'good information'.  It's data, not information....and requires a CIA level decoder ring to really understand each granule since there's no legend in the report.  I suspect the asterisks of (fail) influence the reading.  It's a critical path to market any product that has DOT measures applied to it and that would be my acid test of pass/fail.  In other words, if a manufacturer hasn't done their due diligence in getting the appropriate third party certifications of a product in this scenario....the lawyers would be all over the first accident that could even remotely be attributed to its use.  Hence disclaimers such as "for off road use only" when a product is clearly aimed at on road use.

Here are my immediate impressions....the report only focused on the 'spread' of the light.....not the distance it projected, contrast ratio (the color thing) and the brightness measures weren't easily understood.  Second, and most important...it's 13 years old.  Tell me what technology that is in flux for the past thirteen years you would rely on that age of data to form an opinion?  That predates the first I-phone by five years.  Consider also, at the time of this report, 42 inch, 720P plasma TV's were around $8000 according to a friend of mine who owns an A/V chain of stores and LCD HDTV was only in magazine articles.  Lastly, the preamble to the report on the website was 98% marketing, so it should be discounted 100%. 

That said...if you like today's HID retrofit product, then it's the right thing for you.  Some have had excellent results with LED, some still like their old H4 based on purely human perceptions, or purely human cash flow, over science/pseudoscience or even marketing.

I got lost in what you were trying to say but if it is about the link I posted that was only used to explain why an HID or led won't work properly in a reflector housing. Also if you can not understand what is in the link I posted then you don't have the grounds to say which is better or not. Your logic is if it puts out more light or correct for someone eyes then it is in fact better. If that was the case then manufactures wouldn't spend billions of dollars on engineering better ways to illuminate the road in front of you.


Also HID technology has been the same for longer than 13 years and so has halogen you can easily find data that is current. If the same test was done today you would get the same results.

As a matter of fact I can take three pictures for you if you would like. One Halogen sealed beam, one OEM led projector, and one HID projector and we can get some votes in to see which is best. However I don't have any drop in hid or led bulbs to test because well they suck compared to the real deal.

[calj737]

So, Turbo, is that 10-30 for the first 500 miles, then switch to 10-40 for better illumination? Or does it require me to change my reflector to run 20-50... I'm so confused 

[turboed13b]

So, Turbo, is that 10-30 for the first 500 miles, then switch to 10-40 for better illumination? Or does it require me to change my reflector to run 20-50... I'm so confused 

I run whatever is cheapest.

[flatlander]

tealights!

[Lostboy Steve]

For $20 bucks draws less watts and makes more light.  Another member has one and loves it.  Says it is much brighter than stock and uses less power.  He was having issues with his Halogen using too much juice.  Got one of thes babies and all is well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/281419853101?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Those Chinese bulbs always make me nervous tho.