Author Topic: Tapered Steering Bearings Thread (Read 189803 times)

mystic_1 · « **Reply #400 on:** April 19, 2009, 11:11:02 pm »

Quote from: 78SS on April 19, 2009, 07:06:12 pm

Now that I have my lower bearing in place and i may have to cob a spacer on the top side of the race

Nope, you gots to have a spacer underneath the bottom bearing, otherwise the lower triple tree will likely contact the steering head when you install it.

mystic_1

Hush · « **Reply #401 on:** April 20, 2009, 12:46:09 am »

To remove the bearing without damaging it you could do a trick some of the guys on here have found useful.
Place your steering triple with the bearing that needs to come off (gently for reuse) into a chest freezer, or Mum's if you don't mind getting a crack if she catches you.
The theory goes that the steel in the steering shaft will contract as it cools and release the bearing which is made of different metals.
Hey it can't hurt to try, another trick uses heat to expand but that is normally for removing the old races that refuse to give up their position after 30 years

don't wanna cook your new bearings eh!

Frankencake · « **Reply #402 on:** April 20, 2009, 07:11:49 am »

Quote from: Hush on April 20, 2009, 12:46:09 am

To remove the bearing without damaging it you could do a trick some of the guys on here have found useful.
Place your steering triple with the bearing that needs to come off (gently for reuse) into a chest freezer, or Mum's if you don't mind getting a crack if she catches you.
The theory goes that the steel in the steering shaft will contract as it cools and release the bearing which is made of different metals.
Hey it can't hurt to try, another trick uses heat to expand but that is normally for removing the old races that refuse to give up their position after 30 years don't wanna cook your new bearings eh!

I tried the freezing approach to no avail. I tried the heat approach to no avail w/out burning the new seal. I tried the "buy another kit on ebay" approach and that worked for getting my bearing off in a hail of little rollers that went all over the floor. As I was pounding the inner race of the roller off my stem, my girlfriend came down to the shop and said "Oh, I did that when I did my steering bearings and had to buy another set too ."
OK, so my luck has run out with stock bearings. So far, stockers have been good with all of my bikes. Today, I am Grasshopper, and now, I will learn.

MCRider · « **Reply #403 on:** April 20, 2009, 07:47:21 pm »

Quote from: ffjmoore on April 19, 2009, 04:28:07 pm

Quote from: mystic_1 on April 19, 2009, 03:59:30 pm

The All Balls kit includes a new dust seal, too.

mystic_1
Thanks for rubbing in my mistake. still need some spacers. I might try the grinder.

In the special hardware drawers of ACE Hardware, I found washers of the exact od as the inside of the steering neck. It was many years ago, but I just ran across a few and they reminded me of your post. The ID is larger than the steering stem, but I don't think that matters?

MCRider · « **Reply #404 on:** April 20, 2009, 07:49:42 pm »

Quote from: mystic_1 on April 19, 2009, 11:11:02 pm

Quote from: 78SS on April 19, 2009, 07:06:12 pm
Now that I have my lower bearing in place and i may have to cob a spacer on the top side of the race

Nope, you gots to have a spacer underneath the bottom bearing, otherwise the lower triple tree will likely contact the steering head when you install it.

mystic_1

Mine is underneath as well. But it has been pointed out to me that if you put the spacer in the steering neck before inserting the lower steering neck race, you accomplish the same thing. After getting a good picture in my mind, I think that is correct.

mystic_1 · « **Reply #405 on:** April 20, 2009, 08:16:25 pm »

Doh you are right of course. Spacer above the race for the lower bearing accomplishes the same thing as spacing underneath the bearing on the triple tree.

mystic_1

Magpie · « **Reply #406 on:** May 12, 2009, 07:36:53 pm »

Two questions:
1. I have to reinstall the top race and never done that before, all tips and pointers will be gratefully received.
2. Installing the lower set of bearing on the steering stem. The top set just pop into place but the lower ones are very tight on the stem. Should I be heating the bearings and melting the grease all over the place, taking a bit off the stem with some emery cloth or........................
Thanks in advance.
Cliff.

kghost · « **Reply #407 on:** May 12, 2009, 07:42:22 pm »

Slowly tap the race in with a brass punch. NOT STEEL.

Throw your stem in the freezer...often times theres enough shrinkage to tap it lightly and on she goes.

super pasty white guy · « **Reply #408 on:** May 12, 2009, 07:43:49 pm »

I used a piece of PVC pipe and a mallet to tap it into place.

spwg

tech10 · « **Reply #409 on:** May 12, 2009, 07:46:33 pm »

Quote from: super pasty white guy on May 12, 2009, 07:43:49 pm

I used a piece of PVC pipe and a mallet to tap it into place.

spwg

Same here...

heyjones · « **Reply #410 on:** May 12, 2009, 10:02:26 pm »

I just ordered replacement Timken tapered bearings from jbr17llc.com for $21.10 shipped... not bad! The part numbers are L45449 and 07100 for upper and lower, respectively. I got the suggestion from this link:

http://www.sohc4.us/book/export/html/303

Just need to track down some washers that match the specs on that page and when they show up in the mail, throw them in. I'll take some photos and post them here. I might also try and strip and paint my triple tree while I'm at it. Any suggestions on paint?

heyjones · « **Reply #411 on:** May 12, 2009, 10:04:32 pm »

I'm just posting to keep track of this thread, I just ordered a set of Timken bearings and can use all the pointers I can find to get them installed when they show up in the mail!

Magpie · « **Reply #412 on:** May 12, 2009, 11:07:53 pm »

Thanks guys, the freezer idea worked! The race went in with some persuasion from a dead blow hammer and a roll of electrical tape as a kind of shock absorber. The bearing slipped on nicely again using a roll of tape over the stem and hitting the bearing, gentley, with the roll. The tape seemed to keep it centred on the stem. All is good. Now on to painting the frame. Another step closer.
Cheers,
Cliff.

seaweb11 · « **Reply #413 on:** May 12, 2009, 11:31:37 pm »

HondaMan · « **Reply #414 on:** May 13, 2009, 07:57:38 am »

Quote from: heyjones on May 12, 2009, 10:02:26 pm

I just ordered replacement Timken tapered bearings from jbr17llc.com for $21.10 shipped... not bad! The part numbers are L45449 and 07100 for upper and lower, respectively. I got the suggestion from this link:

http://www.sohc4.us/book/export/html/303

Just need to track down some washers that match the specs on that page and when they show up in the mail, throw them in. I'll take some photos and post them here. I might also try and strip and paint my triple tree while I'm at it. Any suggestions on paint?

Heyjones:
That's a partial reprint of one of my early posts. You'll find that the Timken bearings today will need some work to match the ID and OD dimensions mentioned in the article: they don't make them in the finished sizes I used to be able to get with those part numbers. Specifically, the OD of the lower race will have to be ground down, and the ID of the upper bored. I'm working on a jig to make these on my lathe so I can offer the Timkens myself.

There are some KML bearings available from All Balls in their kits (red boxes) with spacers and seals in the kit, these are not bad. There are also some NTN bearings, in a green box, available out there from some suppliers: I've not had good long-term performance from these. They seem to have soft races which need quite a few tightening adjustments over the first 5000 -10000 miles or so to settle in, then they drag and dimple sooner than the others, at maybe 30,000 miles over time. (Just my experience with the green-boxed brand).

HM

heyjones · « **Reply #415 on:** May 13, 2009, 06:58:45 pm »

I'm going to see if I can cancel my order and get a set of the All Balls. Thanks for the heads up!

heyjones · « **Reply #416 on:** May 17, 2009, 06:56:37 pm »

I didn't catch them before they shipped the bearings out... Hondaman, if I shipped these out to you, could you use these to test your jig on? If so let me know how much you'd charge for something like that.

HondaMan · « **Reply #417 on:** May 18, 2009, 07:05:44 am »

Quote from: heyjones on May 17, 2009, 06:56:37 pm

I didn't catch them before they shipped the bearings out... Hondaman, if I shipped these out to you, could you use these to test your jig on? If so let me know how much you'd charge for something like that.

I haven't figured out any price yet, 'cuz I haven't finished the jig yet, either. I have to take it to a machine shop to have it align-bored (or borrow a mill to do it myself). Then I can use it to grind these thingies out. I already have the OD of the lower races ground. I've got so much going on this week, I'm sure I can't do it immediately (some tiles just came loose in the shower, you know what that means....

).

heyjones · « **Reply #418 on:** May 18, 2009, 10:35:55 am »

Oh I'm in no rush, whenever you get around to it. I've got enough other things going on with this bike to keep me busy for a while. Good luck with the tile!

stevenmgrr · « **Reply #419 on:** May 26, 2009, 11:05:41 am »

I just received my All Ballz tapered steering bearing kit for my my 71 CB500 today. To say that the included instructions suck would be an understatement.

I have two questions. First, how do I tell which is the upper bearing and which is the lower? Neither is marked. Second, the kit includes two spacers of differing sizes. The procedure is to stack the old bearing set with the new stack using one of the spacers to obtain the right height. My problem is that all of the races were discarded when I had my frame powdercoated. Does anyone know which of the two spacers I should use for a 71 CB500?

Thanks

the architect · « **Reply #420 on:** May 26, 2009, 01:04:04 pm »

I've been researching this topic, as well. I'm preparing to do the same thing to my '75 750 -- as soon as I get it back from powdercoating

This was a helpful read:

http://www.stephenbottcher.net/Honda/tapered.htm

After you finish your installation, you should do a write up (with photos, of course) to help those of us yet to embark on this job.

Good luck with the install!

moham · « **Reply #421 on:** May 26, 2009, 04:24:52 pm »

Check the faqs or search "tapered" and you'll find at least two tutorials and a hundred other threads. This has been covered pretty thoroughly. The couple tutorials that have been done are really good and helped me when I did the conversion with the all balls kit.

Are you positive the old races are gone? Did you remove them? I brt the outer races and bearings are gone but I bet the inner races are still in the neck. It takes a fair amount of persuasion to get them out. The top one is easy to get out, the lower is a bear. Do a search and then check out your bike thoroughly and you'll get it.

Flying J · « **Reply #422 on:** June 02, 2009, 04:33:01 pm »

I just did my 550 and it took the smaller washer. the bearings only fit one way. The larger one i think is the bottom and the smaller one is the top.

Dave-and-his-550 · « **Reply #423 on:** August 11, 2009, 10:45:34 pm »

Revive! This thread has been very helpful. I got my old bearings outta my '76 550F, but the races are still stuck in there. I've been hammering down on the bottom one with a steel tube with no luck. I know it just takes time though. Got it from All Ballz. I wanted to confirm how each piece goes on, is this order correct?

Or does the spacer go on first, then the seal?

mystic_1 · « **Reply #424 on:** August 12, 2009, 04:59:46 am »

Spacer first, then the seal. The seal should clip onto the bearing.

mystic_1

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Author Topic: Tapered Steering Bearings Thread (Read 189803 times)