Author Topic: Tapered Steering Bearings Thread (Read 207601 times)

Hush · « **Reply #500 on:** May 08, 2011, 05:04:59 PM »

Free Booter, are you saying the top tapered bearing won't slide onto the steering shaft without force!!!

Don't force it, you'll do damage to the bearings and you'll be back to square one, something is wrong here, either you have the wrong top bearing set or you have missed a step.
The top race has been removed I assume?
I have a horrible feeling that you have had the wrong bearing set sent to you!!!

Free Booter · « **Reply #501 on:** May 08, 2011, 05:32:54 PM »

slides on fine 'til it gets to the lower threads...I am begnning to think I also have the wrong set...CAn you send me the model # ...part # of the one you have?

Free Booter · « **Reply #502 on:** May 08, 2011, 05:36:56 PM »

Well, looked at the part number: 22-1011 and it lists cb750 k1-k5 in the list....

Is it possible that when the trips were powdered that it made them "just" thick enough to make it too snug? also... I may not have pushed the bottom bearing set far enough dowm...still a little play on the bottom spacer, but shouldn't be afecting the fit of the top bearing. top baring has these markings on it: 26-485h KML

Free Booter · « **Reply #503 on:** May 08, 2011, 05:45:31 PM »

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Honda-CB750K-1969-1978-Steering-Stem-Bearing-Kit-CB-750-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQitemZ400209333314QQptZMotorcyclesQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
That isn't where I bought it, but its the same kit and model# and has the same parts and fitment listing.

Very confused...is it possible I have a different steering stem from a different model bike?!

Hush · « **Reply #504 on:** May 08, 2011, 06:43:22 PM »

Power coatings will add a thou so that could well be your cause, why did you power coat your triple tree?

Also if you are not the first owner you can't possibly know how much has been changed on your bike, swapping triple trees and forks to get double front disc brakes is common on these older bikes.

Free Booter · « **Reply #505 on:** May 08, 2011, 10:13:10 PM »

Well, These are the forks:

This is the triple:

The kid who did 'em wasn't too "experienced?" ...so anyway...I sanded the stuff off the threads ...guess it may need just a little nudge in the end anyway....even the top of the tree is fairly snug if not tight...which isn't neccessarily a bad thing. i think it could've very well been the added "paint thickness?"

MCRider · « **Reply #506 on:** May 08, 2011, 10:44:47 PM »

Is it just me or is the lower old ball bearing race still on the lower triple tree?

Retro Rocket · « **Reply #507 on:** May 08, 2011, 10:50:29 PM »

Quote from: MCRider on May 08, 2011, 10:44:47 PM

Is it just me or is the lower old ball bearing race still on the lower triple tree?

+1,

Free Booter · « **Reply #508 on:** May 09, 2011, 05:19:07 PM »

Yeah...that was removed...I haven't lost my marbles. Was still on when I took the pics.

Hush · « **Reply #509 on:** May 10, 2011, 12:40:52 AM »

Nice job on the powder coating, your bike is gonna look great with all that shine.
Yep a little sanding on the area where the bearings slide on should see you right, also check that the top nut still fits, the threads might be too proud as well.

Note: once I fitted tapered bearings to my bike the dust/weather cover wouldn't fit on any more so don't be too suprised if you have a new spare part to hang on the wall.

Free Booter · « **Reply #510 on:** May 11, 2011, 08:36:42 AM »

Well top nut fits fine...screws on like it was brand new...so that's good. Bottom bearing assembly had a little too much play...'bout an 1/8 inch so I carefully depressed that down until it the bottom spacer was nice and tight. The upper neck insert that the bearings recede into is a tad higher on the neck as mentioned previously and I was mildly concerned with this, but no that the bottom bearings are all the way down I can see there is still plenty of threads on the lower thread area of the shaft so everything should fit nicely. Just buying some grease today before i finalize assembly and I'll take pics ad let you know how it went.

Flying J · « **Reply #511 on:** May 11, 2011, 06:57:02 PM »

Aircraft stripper works wonders on Powder coat.

aperry · « **Reply #512 on:** June 23, 2011, 01:31:01 PM »

First post, be easy on me!

I followed Kirkn's excellent instructions (form page 6 or so) to install an All Balls kit into my '73 CB750 basket case (I'll start a thread in the Project forum sometime soon). Question: After hammering the lower bearing onto the stem using PVC and "thick" spacer as a hammer medium, I noticed that the bearing no longer rotates very easily. Is this normal? I had to cup it with my hand and really twist fairly hard to make it rotate. It feels like it's either rubbing against the rubber dust seal under it, or maybe the whole bearing assembly tightened up after being pressed onto the stem. Like Kirkn, I decided to grease it *after* installing it, but it didn't make it a whole lot looser.

I've installed both races and both bearings and installed the stem into the frame, hand-tightening the top nut. The stem rotates smoothly, but it does require a little torque. For example, it won't continue rotating if I nudge it and I don't think it would move if I tipped the bike on its side. (it also does not have the forks or top tripled installed, so not much weight to help move it). Anyway, is this right, or have I damaged the bearing somehow?

I'm a noob, so I don't have much of a feel for this yet!

Thanks!

Hush · « **Reply #513 on:** June 23, 2011, 02:05:48 PM »

Hey dude, hammering any bearing is not recommended, if you read some of the tricks for this operation you have seen the freezer one works well.
Hopefully you haven't damaged the bearing beyond useability, you probably won't know until you have the whole thing back together.
Without the top bearing and top section of the triple on you will get a distorted idea of how well it all works.
I would fit the top bearing then put the top section of the triple on and see how well it turns then as the weight will be evenly distributed.
I remember when I did my 650 with tapered bearings I actually fitted the lower bearing into the steering head not onto the triple tree shaft, does the 750 fit differently?

aperry · « **Reply #514 on:** June 23, 2011, 05:20:18 PM »

Thanks. FWIW, I think I was using those tricks. I froze the lower triple, heated the lower bearing, slipped it on the shaft (after the thin spacer and dust seal), then put another temporary spacer on top of the bearing and then some PVC pipe on top of that. I hammed on the PVC. I believe the idea is that, combined with the washer, you get a fairly even distribution of force on the bearing. I don't have a bearing installer. I suppose I could have rigged something up with C-clamps, but I'm pretty sure the way I did it is how most people on this thread installed it.

Anyway, I've now installed the whole bearing set, both tripled trees and both forks. Now that the whole assemble has some weight to it, the steering seems much better and feels much looser. I think I just wasn't accustomed to "steering" without any of weight that the forks/wheels/bars/etc provide.

Thanks again for the help!

Hush · « **Reply #515 on:** June 24, 2011, 12:57:51 PM »

No worries and happy riding.

ben.cb500 · « **Reply #516 on:** July 20, 2011, 08:57:15 PM »

Do the oem cb500 chrome headlight holder fork ear thingys work with the bearings standing proud of the top stem or do you have to rejig them?

srbakker · « **Reply #517 on:** October 17, 2011, 07:10:25 PM »

Is there a lot of variation in the height of the bottom bearing stack from model to model, or is it bike to bike?

IE if some idiot (namely me) threw out the old bearings in the process of stripping the frame and triple tree, could I assume that the spacing that worked well another K5 will work well on mine?

Tugboat · « **Reply #518 on:** January 31, 2012, 09:27:55 AM »

Wanted to post this here since I couldn't find it anywhere else...

'76 CB750F
All Balls Kit #22-1011

Bottom:
Bearing #99-3512
Seal #33-1007
Small Spacer #99-1054

Top:
Bearing #99-3511
Seal (Optional) #33-1006

Not used:
Lg Spacer #99-1011

Also, the original lower stack mearsures 18mm.

MCRider · « **Reply #519 on:** January 31, 2012, 01:28:10 PM »

Quote from: rotortiller on January 31, 2012, 01:18:54 PM

Has anyone employed the "all balls" lower tapered roller bearing with the stock ball race setup. If the bike weight is carried by the lower roller the top is only for wheelies and minor alignment loads. Certainly would be good for keeping the top bearing area sealed better.

I have a set of 'all ballstapered rollers and am reconsidering them since I don't want to messing with grease each year and I want the stock headlight ears to fit the same on my 77K

rt

The greasing need is less than it would be for the OEM balls. Possibly never after the first. As to the headlight ears, that should be worked out with spacers.

As to your original question though, I'm pretty sure I've read here that others have done bottom tapers, top OEM. I'd have no problem with that.

Don R · « **Reply #520 on:** January 31, 2012, 03:16:53 PM »

The original used balls are usually not round anymore, sometimes the race is dented, if the front end took any kind of a hit. I'd use the entire all balls kit. Lots of us have with no problems.

Bucko · « **Reply #521 on:** April 07, 2012, 01:07:07 PM »

Hi Folks:

I'm an interloper here from another site; I hope you'll grant me some indulgence. I'm replacing the ball and race steering head bearing on my 84 Ascot and it happens to take the same All Balls kit referred to in this thread (22-1011). I may be crazy but it seem to me the lower seal in the kit should go under the washer not on top of it as mentioned many times in this tread. I know it's a minor detail since the bearing can be used without a washer (in the right application) so that implies the seal can sit next to the bearing, but when a washer is used it makes more sense to put the seal under the washer so that it's not in contact with the bearing - or am I missing something? Thanks for any advice.

Clinto · « **Reply #522 on:** January 14, 2013, 04:32:31 PM »

So here's a funny story... I decided to beat the hell out of my old bearing seats in order get them out of the neck so I can put my allballz kit in.

So give it to me straight, how much damage did I do? Is it repairable?

lostinthe202 · « **Reply #523 on:** January 14, 2013, 08:29:29 PM »

Rather than dredge up an 8 year old thread, you should probably start one of your own. You'll get more help that way.

my 2 cents,

Looks like you buggered the rim of the steertube pretty good but the seat is probably fine. You'd want to remove any material that got folded over from your pounding on it. The bearing races are a press-fit into the steer tube so they want a uniform diameter in order to fit properly. Start by cleaning everything really well with brake parts cleaner then feeling around the seats to get an idea of where the burrs are. Careful that you don't "feel" too hard as you may have some sharp burrs there. You'll need to get your hands on a needle file set, one like this:
http://www1.mscdirect.com/cgi/NNSRIT2?PMAKA=00673103&PMPXNO=1671989&cm_re=ItemDetail-_-ResultListing-_-SearchResults

Often fleamarket tool sellers or cheap tool shops will carry these if you have any in your area. They're handy to have. Anyway, use one of the half-round versions in the set to remove the folded over material from the beating and you'll be good to go. You won't really be able to test your progress with the new bearing race since it's a press fit (it's always going to be tight) so you'll be gauging things with your fingers.

Good luck!

Clinto · « **Reply #524 on:** January 15, 2013, 05:43:29 PM »

Thanks a lot for the advice! I was trying not to overflow the forum with new topics for things that have already been covered. I'll give it a shot and maybe update some better quality pictures to see if everything looks okay after I smooth it out. Thanks again

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Author Topic: Tapered Steering Bearings Thread (Read 207601 times)