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Author Topic: Super Eliminator Rules  (Read 7450 times)

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Offline voodooracer

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Super Eliminator Rules
« on: December 28, 2015, 08:49:49 am »
 Most are based on the last IDBA Rulebook printed for the 2000 season.
 I have tried e-mailing a few copies but have only heard from one person as to whether or not they have received it.
 As it is a very large file (21.8Mb or so) this may be where the difficulty lies.
 Please respond here, yay or ney if you have asked, but have not received.
I am by no means an expert with the computer thing-a-ma-jig. So pardon my ineptitude in advance.

Please feel free to contact me  directly via my e-mail address;
voodooracer1@gmail.com

Thanks
Keith LeBlanc
« Last Edit: December 28, 2015, 11:56:47 am by voodooracer »

Offline dragracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2015, 09:41:30 am »
I received mine email from you with the attached Super eliminator rules.

Thank you my good man!!

Offline gschuld

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2015, 10:57:41 am »
I don't believe I received the email yet.  Unless my spam filter booted it to the junk mail...  I'll check.

George

Offline voodooracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2015, 11:25:51 am »
Just sent it again gschuld

Offline gschuld

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2015, 01:57:54 pm »
Got it.  Thanks

George

Offline TurboD

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2015, 02:06:09 pm »
I noticed on the SE web page, that there are only 2 races listed for 2016 and both in Michigan. Not up to date?

Offline dragracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2015, 04:07:07 pm »
I noticed on the SE web page, that there are only 2 races listed for 2016 and both in Michigan. Not up to date?

That's not the whole schedule. The SE class will have 3 points races counted towards the Man Cup championship. Rockingham, Memphis and the finals at SGMP per the last posts on their facebook page. We've been debating since the final Cup race among the group on locations and that's the latest as of today.

Offline Fastbike

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2015, 05:10:49 pm »
Thanks Keith,

I got the rulebook.  Been reading it to see if my pos fits anywhere. 

David
I'm not as smart as I look, but I am pretty.

Offline voodooracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2015, 06:02:09 pm »
As if it wasn't confusing enough, a group of hardcore, and I mean, really hardcore, twin and triple cyl. 2-stroke only and nothing else, use the Super Elim. name for their endeavors.

Offline kmb69

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2015, 06:17:47 pm »
Not sure if this is the rulebook about which this discussion exist but I just found this at:

http://kawtriple.com/mraxl/IDBA%202000%20Rulebook.pdf


Offline kmb69

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2015, 06:25:49 pm »
OK, I am confused. I can find nothing on the ManCup website pertaining to Super Eliminator.

Like Keith said, the 2 strokers are claiming this class to only be for multi-cylinder 2 strokes.

Can we get some clarification/explanation from somebody in the know?

Offline dragracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2015, 07:02:22 pm »
Facebook page gentleman, Facebook. Super eliminator

Offline dragracer

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Offline kmb69

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2015, 07:28:06 pm »
https://www.facebook.com/#!/Super-Eliminator-Drag-Racing-354900227981412/?fref=nf

Saw that already - that's all about 2 strokes. Where do the SOHC's fit in?

Is the rulebook I posted pertinent?


Offline dragracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2015, 08:00:31 pm »
You won't find anything on the Man Cup site.

Super Eliminator is a strange animal. They do their own thing.

Offline TurboD

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2015, 08:32:20 pm »
I'm confused as well, the SE facebook page appears to be the 2 stoke SE group that I know. I have been on their forum for a few years now. ???

Offline dragracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2015, 09:31:56 pm »
https://www.facebook.com/#!/Super-Eliminator-Drag-Racing-354900227981412/?fref=nf

Saw that already - that's all about 2 strokes. Where do the SOHC's fit in?

Is the rulebook I posted pertinent?



That page is for all bikes that run in Super Eliminator, not just two strokes. Unfortunately, i was the only SOHC so it does seem like its specific to the two strokes, although there were numerous modern 4 strokes competing. Look on pages 8-18 of the rule book for Super Eliminator rules. Even after reading through it 3 times, i'm still unclear on the classifications. Bill Baxter can be contacted for information on where your particular bike fits and the national record index that applies. All i can tell you is my bike was put into the CB/SS classification. He asked me if the bike had a lockup clutch, if it had a slick and a few other questions i don't recall. I answered no to the lockup and slick. He looked the bike over and then researched the national index from their database.

Offline kmb69

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2015, 09:52:36 pm »
Could not find that class, CB/SS, in the rule book. Maybe I'm going blind or they're using a different set of rules.
All of the ?/SS classes I saw have pretty strict regulations. Like pretty much stock engines and wheelbases. ???

Offline dragracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #18 on: December 28, 2015, 11:20:39 pm »
I never saw that specific class either- maybe they just made it up on the spot. Lol. All I can say is get in where you fit in. That's kind of the way I took it when I spoke to Bill Baxter initially. Heck, they showed me a database, told me what the record was at that point and I paid my entry fees. I kept asking what the payout was but never got a straight answer. There was at least 5 of us walking around confused about how this overall class works when running off a national index for each class. Bottom line, it's a pro tree bracket race. No delay boxes or throttle stops allowed. While there were primarily two strokes in the class, at least one third were 4 strokes. Busas, Zx14 and even a Kawasaki Concourse were in competition. I wish I was better prepared to answer questions for you all, but I'm simply not as informed as I would like to be right now. I entered the class at the last minute. I accepted what I was told and showed up in the lanes when they called us up. Bill Baxter was very busy working on a bike between rounds so I never got an opportunity to have him school me on the classifications and how they were derived. By the way, for any planning to compete in this class, the entry fee was $100, no buyback as its laddered pairing based on qualifying position.

Offline voodooracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2015, 04:14:34 am »
 And now one can easily see some of the many various factors as to why class racing died out some 15 yrs. ago after being on a slow downward spiral for 25+ yrs.

The link that kmb69 put in his post #9
http://kawtriple.com/mraxl/IDBA%202000%20Rulebook.pdf
Is the rulebook I've been trying to get out there.

A little clarification perhaps. Super Eliminator is not a single class, but a collection of all the various mid to lowest level classes mixed together in a single eliminator. Where there were once enough participants in almost each and every different class to have a race against multiple entries in the same class and then compete to crown a class winner, over time, participation dwindled as racers who could not afford to match the money, time, dedication, testing that the class leaders put in to become the very best, classes began to have less and less entries until it got to the point of many classes having 0 participation. Combining the few entries from multiple classes, racing on a handicap start based on each class's respective record, was a way to keep what few participants that were still willing to compete involved. Alas, this handicap system also led to class racing's ultimate demise, as it was the basis of bracket style racing that we all know today. And all the folks that used to compete but couldn't keep up could now race without the restrictions of so many technical rules and having to use an unobtainable record as their standard of performance,and just concern themselves with running against a standard that they themselves picked.

 The resurgence of Super Eliminator is led by the most respected and diehard advocates of the old class system of racing that have NEVER let it completely die off. What they have accomplished under the strict guidelines in place at the time was nothing short of incredible. The fact that they are by far and away mostly representatives of the community of long out of production factory 2-stroke bikes is no surprise, since those machines in stock and especially modified trim were the pinnacle of performance back then. Some still are. It's why for every class in 4-strokes there is a corresponding 2-stroke class designated by double class letters, i.e. C/M for 4-stroke C/ Modified, and CC/M for 2-stroke C/Modified. In almost every case, the corresponding 2-stroke class has a lower record time than it's 4-stroke equivalent.

I personally think allowing records to be set in old restrictive classes like Stock and Super Stock without the backing of adequate inspection and teardown and verifications does a disservice to those record holders of the past who worked under the constant scrutiny of the organizations enforcing the rules. But again, as long as the "asterisk" of ManCup designates this new era of "class" racing, any new records set can be viewed in proper context.
 And whatnot.

Keith LeBlanc
















Offline voodooracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #20 on: December 29, 2015, 04:55:34 am »
Here's a link to a searchable data base of Super Eliminator records from several different drag racing organizations, maintained by Bill Baxter.

http://www.dragbike.com/super-eliminator-records/

Offline POPS 911

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #21 on: December 29, 2015, 05:42:44 am »
S/E class was over in 2000 the year LE ANN closed IDBA down. The last champion was [ 2000 ] Brad MATTIE on a DOHC KZ.  The 2cyl racers were a group that hung together at all the IDBA races, like the SOHC 750 racer want to do at these events at MAN CUP = RIGHT ?  Only rule you really need is the PROTEST RULE at the end of the day a rider can put up money [ $150-75   to force the winner to tear down or give up the win.  We MSP did that at a PRO-STAR race and the owner of those bikes 1000cc class said he didn't have any gaskets for his two KZ bikes to put back together, Scooter came to the Big MSP  trailer and begged JOE- MSP to drop the protest so the sponsor would stay with the class ........ one racer on one those KZ bikes was the son of the big sponsor now a days.
Quit bull#$%*ting around it always will be WHO YOU NO = they were cheating the rules and so were WE, cam, shaved counter balancer, heavy 4-1 front pipe, WARD head, and the most important " SHINE ".

Offline voodooracer

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #22 on: December 29, 2015, 05:46:02 am »
Define "SHINE" for me Pops. I'm not hip to da gyp.

Offline RP

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #23 on: December 29, 2015, 06:16:35 am »
Keith,

Good explaination on Super Eliminator history, and what is going on.  Looking at the class records it seems like they will make up a class for you to fit in in case you do not fit in one with an existing record.
Ralph
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Offline Bill/BentON Racing

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Re: Super Eliminator Rules
« Reply #24 on: December 29, 2015, 06:18:10 am »
Apple pie he didn't mean. Lol. Engine/chassis builder from his neck of the woods, I think, POP'S?   ;D, Bill
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