Author Topic: Primary chains question/research - found them for 39eu... SWAG-30-93-9962 (Read 25642 times)

Bill/BentON Racing · « **Reply #75 on:** February 09, 2016, 07:37:23 AM »

Very interesting, K.

gschuld · « **Reply #76 on:** February 09, 2016, 08:04:48 AM »

Well I have zero constructive input on this since it's way over my head, but your CAD work is beautiful...

Combine your skills with those who really understand what needs to be done and something really great could come from it. I'm certainly interested in your success.

George

MessnerMoto · « **Reply #77 on:** February 09, 2016, 05:07:38 PM »

Yes I encourage people to give advice

...

This is for today... Independent tensioner for each chain... But I need to check clearance to crank counterweights... Probably there will be no space.

FunJimmy · « **Reply #78 on:** February 09, 2016, 05:26:47 PM »

Harley Davidson Sportsters have a primary chain that requires a tension guide.
The typical guide is a simple plastic pad on an adjustable threaded shaft.
There are a few other after market solutions too. It doesn't have to be complicated.
Google it and you will see many (smaller) options.

MessnerMoto · « **Reply #79 on:** February 09, 2016, 05:33:50 PM »

yes I saw HD tensioner. I am trying to make a bolt on solution. For HD tensioner I would need to make support in bottom case.. welding etc.

FunJimmy · « **Reply #80 on:** February 09, 2016, 05:51:48 PM »

Quote from: MessnerMoto on February 09, 2016, 05:33:50 PM

yes I saw HD tensioner. I am trying to make a bolt on solution. For HD tensioner I would need to make support in bottom case.. welding etc.

There's more than one way to skin a cat or tension a chain.

Ilja · « **Reply #81 on:** February 13, 2016, 12:42:22 PM »

Quote from: MessnerMoto on February 09, 2016, 05:07:38 PM

Yes I encourage people to give advice ...

This is for today... Independent tensioner for each chain... But I need to check clearance to crank counterweights... Probably there will be no space.

Nice, but this way the chain will be pulled tightly against the guide because its on the pulling side.
Don't put a tensioner on the pulling side, or a guide that pushes the chain (or belt) down.
Just replace the stock tensioner for whatever you create.

bwaller · « **Reply #82 on:** February 13, 2016, 01:16:16 PM »

+1, no guide. Otherwise that looks good.

I received some material from a friend from his work that is supposed to be incredibly wear resistant. I wish I knew what the material is, might work well for this application, light blue in colour.

grcamna2 · « **Reply #83 on:** February 13, 2016, 01:31:46 PM »

subscribed

FunJimmy · « **Reply #84 on:** February 13, 2016, 04:14:53 PM »

Quote from: bwaller on February 13, 2016, 01:16:16 PM

+1, no guide. Otherwise that looks good.

I received some material from a friend from his work that is supposed to be incredibly wear resistant. I wish I knew what the material is, might work well for this application, light blue in colour.

Not sure light blue works well with engine oil Brent.
Might clash a bit. Can you get said material in a nice crimson red?

MessnerMoto · « **Reply #85 on:** February 14, 2016, 09:31:36 AM »

No need for central guide. There are side guides but it is not necessary.

Will use pa6 mos2 material. Polyamid molybden sulfate.

But selection of material will depend on temperature in engine. Does anybody knows what is max temp in engine?

NitroHunter · « **Reply #86 on:** February 15, 2016, 09:02:41 AM »

Quote from: FunJimmy on February 09, 2016, 05:51:48 PM

Quote from: MessnerMoto on February 09, 2016, 05:33:50 PM
There's more than one way to skin a cat or tension a chain.

Discovered this the other day...

Nothing like the old oak block to keep 'em snug. Self profiling too.

madmtnmotors · « **Reply #87 on:** February 15, 2016, 09:13:03 AM »

Quote from: NitroHunter on February 15, 2016, 09:02:41 AM

Quote from: FunJimmy on February 09, 2016, 05:51:48 PM
Quote from: MessnerMoto on February 09, 2016, 05:33:50 PM
There's more than one way to skin a cat or tension a chain.
Discovered this the other day...
Nothing like the old oak block to keep 'em snug. Self profiling too.

Oil absorbent too!

edwardmorris · « **Reply #88 on:** February 20, 2016, 11:22:45 AM »

Back to the chains again for a quick vote of confidence: These G67HP-6 bolt ons vs stockers?

MessnerMoto · « **Reply #89 on:** February 20, 2016, 11:37:28 AM »

1.6mm thickenss of plates. What is the height of plates?

edwardmorris · « **Reply #90 on:** February 20, 2016, 12:06:07 PM »

Quote from: MessnerMoto on February 20, 2016, 11:37:28 AM

1.6mm thickenss of plates. What is the height of plates?

9.6mm, if I got what you are referring to plate height right.

MessnerMoto · « **Reply #91 on:** February 20, 2016, 01:58:45 PM »

ike I sad by experience of drivers of sohc 750 Laverdis they will be fine.

Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er · « **Reply #92 on:** February 20, 2016, 07:48:14 PM »

Definitely look stronger but they don't look like the 'rollers' roll? Would that put all the wear on half the chain vs all of the chain? Good price?

edwardmorris · « **Reply #93 on:** February 20, 2016, 08:11:54 PM »

This will probably cause more confusion, but hey, better than a blown engine. I will do some more measurements to make sure everything checks out dim specs wise. The outer plate height is the only thing I checked earlier and it was 9.6mm, exactly what the specs say. I didn't find any specs for plate thickness in the catalog (first post of this thread) but the breaking force(?) FB in the catalog is listed as 12500 N min (12.5kN?). My guess is that its the tensile strength, but someone correct me if I'm mistaken. That value for the G68HPF-2 is 13000 N min (13kN?). Then I found this in another thread when I was searching for the same value for stock chains

EDIT: Image removed.

PLEASE tell me I'm doing something wrong, but the way I read it, both the above chains appear to be below that value.

MessnerMoto · « **Reply #94 on:** February 21, 2016, 02:46:38 AM »

15kn is probably ultimate tenisal strength(breaking point of chain). 13kn is yeald strength(maximum force before chain starts to plasticly deform). So 13kn is a maximum force. If chan goes over 13kn it will become unusable...By my calculations g67 is ~9℅ weaker then g68... But surtenly strong as OEM chain. Measure tensioner at the beginning and after 5000km.

edwardmorris · « **Reply #95 on:** February 21, 2016, 10:57:01 AM »

Cool.

I reached out to Andy the chain guy over in UK, he is well known over at the Laverda forums for his expertise on chains, and he has been the supplier for many. According to Andy, the G67 is fine for the 836cc build (I specifically asked for that size to be sure). He also stated that the pin diameter is more important than the TS since at high speed the torque reduces significantly. The big pin gives good wear and is chromised. I invited him to join the discussion but he politely declined. I think I'm going to run these then.

edwardmorris · « **Reply #96 on:** February 21, 2016, 11:26:19 AM »

Also Messner, I'm not a precision machinist, but I did my best to measure the plate thickness accurately and both inner and outer are measuring out to only 1.4mm. If this was a factor in your calculations, can you please run the numbers again?

MessnerMoto · « **Reply #97 on:** February 21, 2016, 01:12:18 PM »

1.4mm Are you sure? I measured the same chain you have and it was 1.5-1.6 Pretty sure you made a mistake in measurement.
Just use it don't worry

Like I sad check it after 5000km.

edwardmorris · « **Reply #98 on:** February 21, 2016, 11:11:10 PM »

Quote from: MessnerMoto on February 21, 2016, 01:12:18 PM

1.4mm Are you sure? I measured the same chain you have and it was 1.5-1.6 Pretty sure you made a mistake in measurement.
Just use it don't worry Like I sad check it after 5000km.

haha probably. I will make some time to take pix when measuring. I'll just run with them and see how it goes. Thanks for all the information and help, this thread made it a lot easier to locate and afford something better than stock.

MFHP · « **Reply #99 on:** February 24, 2016, 07:57:17 AM »

Just bought those IWIS chains and I did measure the same thin side plate thickness for G67HP. The side plates are definitely less beefy than those from the stock chains. If anybody came up with the tensile strength numbers for a stock chain a comparison could be better done. The G67HP-6 is listed at IWIS with a tensile strenght of 12500 N.

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Author Topic: Primary chains question/research - found them for 39eu... SWAG-30-93-9962 (Read 25642 times)