Author Topic: Front Disc Performance Improvements - Bad Brakes (Read 12137 times)

Old Moe Toe · « **Reply #50 on:** January 21, 2016, 02:51:22 AM »

Why doesn't someone just make the good old asbestos ones anymore

PeWe · « **Reply #51 on:** January 21, 2016, 03:10:00 AM »

Quote from: RAF122S on January 21, 2016, 02:25:06 AM

Maybe there is a market for new rotors in a better alloy or material. Problem I see with that solution is price not to mention increased wear to the rotor will cause replacement being required in short order. But, the price of safety is hard to put a price tag on...

David Silver claim that their rotor is a new better one. I believe them, will get 2 on monday.

https://www.davidsilverspares.co.uk/CB750K6-FOUR-1976/part_273686/

PeWe · « **Reply #52 on:** January 21, 2016, 03:11:45 AM »

Quote from: Old Moe Toe on January 21, 2016, 02:51:22 AM

Why doesn't someone just make the good old asbestos ones anymore

NOS early pads must be the good old ones, right?

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #53 on:** January 21, 2016, 04:28:54 AM »

Quote from: Old Moe Toe on January 21, 2016, 02:51:22 AM

Why doesn't someone just make the good old asbestos ones anymore

I think they're all dead.

RRRToolSolutions · « **Reply #54 on:** January 21, 2016, 05:29:42 AM »

PeWe, please give us a ride report. I'd pay the $200 for great breaks in a heartbeat. That new rotor may be just the answer I'm looking for.

Meanwhile, I'm going to find me some old, dusty, faded package pads from years ago that some dealer has lying around. I'll pay a visit to some of the old shops in my area that have been around for 30~40 years. They might just have a set in the dark corners of the parts room.

Thanks, Gordon

buffalogt750 · « **Reply #55 on:** January 21, 2016, 06:37:03 AM »

I tried Ferodo old school asbestos pads on my 550, they were no better than any other pads. You can blame a lot of things for the poor braking but the biggest problem is the master cylinder to caliper size ratio. The stock master cylinder is simply too big to provide good power and feel with a single 38mm caliper. That's why adding another disc and another caliper with the stock master cylinder gives more power and better feel, it gives a better master cylinder to caliper size ratio. If you want to keep the single stock caliper a smaller master cylinder will be the best modification you can do. Check the link below.

http://www.vintagebrake.com/mastercylinder.htm

PeWe · « **Reply #56 on:** January 21, 2016, 06:54:05 AM »

Quote from: RRRToolSolutions on January 21, 2016, 05:29:42 AM

PeWe, please give us a ride report. I'd pay the $200 for great breaks in a heartbeat. That new rotor may be just the answer I'm looking for.

Meanwhile, I'm going to find me some old, dusty, faded package pads from years ago that some dealer has lying around. I'll pay a visit to some of the old shops in my area that have been around for 30~40 years. They might just have a set in the dark corners of the parts room.

Thanks, Gordon

That will take months.
Hopefully in the middle of April if the global warming is good to us here up in the north, latiitude close to 60 (west of Stockholm).
I am curious to only replace the oem disc and check. But I think it will be easier to implement the dual disc version when I have all parts. Only hoses left to decide. Like OEM with metal pipes from calipers but SS lines, B, A. I use david silver cheap MC that works well but not enough with my OEM disc (rotor)

BobbyR · « **Reply #57 on:** January 21, 2016, 09:56:05 AM »

I think I will go with increasing the pressure to the caliper. I can sandblast the rotor to give it some tooth for the pads to bite into. I have SS hose which is was done in black. The SS hose is about the same diamerter as the clutch cable. It looks fine.

flybox1 · « **Reply #58 on:** January 21, 2016, 10:00:15 AM »

Consider that adding a second caliper and rotor will also add significant weight/rolling resistance.
The only way to mitigate this is to thin and cross-drill the rotors.
Godferry does a great job

jonda500 · « **Reply #59 on:** January 22, 2016, 02:21:47 AM »

machining/drilling/upgrading the disc, rebuilding the master, upgrading the brake lines and brake pads... these all make a very small improvement to braking performance, whereas adding an extra standard disc & caliper makes a huge difference in braking performance as this gives the brake master cylinder twice as much leverage!
John

becken · « **Reply #60 on:** January 22, 2016, 04:56:17 AM »

http://www.mikesxs.net/parts/yamaha-xs650-slimline-lightweight-master-cylinder
Has anyone tried this master cylinder? With an 11mm bore it should add considerable pressure to the front brake with a single disc. My only concern would be having enough travel in the lever to not come back to the handlebar.

buffalogt750 · « **Reply #61 on:** January 22, 2016, 06:16:04 AM »

Quote from: becken on January 22, 2016, 04:56:17 AM

http://www.mikesxs.net/parts/yamaha-xs650-slimline-lightweight-master-cylinder
Has anyone tried this master cylinder? With an 11mm bore it should add considerable pressure to the front brake with a single disc. My only concern would be having enough travel in the lever to not come back to the handlebar.

Not sure if 11mm would be too small or not. The 2009 KLR650 master cylinder I used on my CB550 was a Nissin 1/2 inch bore which is actually 12.7 mm. It gave more power and better feel with the stock caliper and a single braided line, no problem with brake lever having too much travel. Suzuki DR and SP bikes, and probably other bikes too, used this same master cylinder. There's always several of them on ebay. I paid 25 dollars shipped for mine and it was like new inside and out. Advantage of using the Nissin is you can always get parts if you need them and it has a 10mm mirror mount so the stock Honda mirror fits.

PeWe · « **Reply #62 on:** January 22, 2016, 12:01:39 PM »

About brakes and when they feel OK. My single OEM front brake is OK as long as the speed is maximum 120km/h. When the speed is around 150-160km/h (100mph) and beyond that, the brake is really bad, especially with 2 persons on the bike.

PeWe · « **Reply #63 on:** January 25, 2016, 02:28:34 PM »

I got a box from David Silver today. Brake discs look good, as the photos on their homepage.
Brake pads too, good price with shiny flakes as I have seen before. Is this the mentioned bronze flakes?

I will use mixed brake lines. OEM metal pipes from calipers (will fit the tight fender) - OEM style rubber hoses (A) - SS line up to MC as I have today.
I have not seen any SS line that match the metal pipe connection. ALL goes all the way to caliper.
I do not think I'll drill the discs. Is it a big deal to run with OEM look without holes?

Steve_K · « **Reply #64 on:** January 25, 2016, 04:37:21 PM »

I believe I got SS line adapter to the hard tube from Z1 Enterprises. Has the female 10 mm thread with the male thread for the SS line. I have one SS line that runs to the caliper with this setup. Brake light sensor in the banjo bolt at the MC.
Steve

RAFster122s · « **Reply #65 on:** January 26, 2016, 03:17:37 AM »

Slingshot cycles was able to provide the hard lines bent to the original pattern and mirror that pattern for the right side on a dual front disc setup...
Don't recall the price now...wasn't outrageous...
They also had the lines with the appropriate ending to the SS lines without the need for an adapter. Custom made lines, rather than off the shelf pattern parts that are generic.

They are in the listing for services... Shawn does nice work. My experience was good but, like many brick and mortar stores transitioning to more internet sales, they aren't fast on email replies. It can be a huge drain/time waster for people who are merely kicking the tires, rather than buying. Might be a good job for a kid with some training...along with a inventory control system to let them know if a configuration of lines was available and it would require orders to be built per a tablet based system where the operator of the line crimper and lines used either stock/std lengths for an order or it was custom. I think Shawn and others have ran into problems with sourcing the ends with the correct bends. It happens to any business from time to time for situations out of their control. I've had it happen on medication where no pharmacy could fill the order as the manufacturer shutdown the production line and no one could get that medication for a while...

David

flatlander · « **Reply #66 on:** January 26, 2016, 03:34:11 AM »

yes slingshot has (or used to have? the hard lines with OEM style connection, and also SS lines that connect to them.
looks like this:

pewe, i also want to preserve the OEM look and don't drill my discs. it's fine as long as you're aware that you don't get that last bit of weight saving and performance.

Steve_K · « **Reply #67 on:** January 26, 2016, 06:52:53 AM »

Flatlanders pic on line is what I use, too. One thing that I do is move the MC as far as possible from the end of the bar. That way you have more leverage because your fingers are near the end of the brake lever. I also rotate the MC for the best angle for my hand. NOTE: When doing this be sure that the brake lever does NOT contact or restrict travel with some throttle housings or switch housings.
Steve

Steve_K · « **Reply #68 on:** January 26, 2016, 09:48:31 AM »

A follow up on the SS line to the hard line, I got my connector at Autozone.

part number 641471

called a "Russell/Japanese metric inverted flare female brake adapter" $20 for a pair and they are plated
Steve

PeWe · « **Reply #69 on:** January 26, 2016, 11:40:25 AM »

Thanks for the Slingshot hint guys!
Just what I need for dual brakes with ss lines and metal pipes. Lenght easy to order when I have drag bar they have as an alternative.
Only one thing, the website crashed in step2 page when going to step 3 where I probably should activate PayPal and pay.

I sent them an message with all error details and the parts I need . Hopefully possible to order anyway by e-mail.

RAFster122s · « **Reply #70 on:** February 03, 2016, 09:59:42 AM »

I tried it just now and it worked, maybe it was fixed... try a different browser if it still crashes. Also, use code SOHC4 for a discount.
David

PeWe · « **Reply #71 on:** February 03, 2016, 11:10:38 AM »

Quote from: RAF122S on February 03, 2016, 09:59:42 AM

I tried it just now and it worked, maybe it was fixed... try a different browser if it still crashes. Also, use code SOHC4 for a discount.
David

I ordered manual via email and PayPal... oK too late for discount. How much? 10%? Cost some but easier when it will fit the bike direct when I could order upper hose for my handlebar, drag bar.
I have tried with 2 different computers, 2 different high speed networks and 4 different web browsers. Maybe the country was involved when others can order.

I order a lot to my CB750 that must be a she when it always need something to look and work better.

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Author Topic: Front Disc Performance Improvements - Bad Brakes (Read 12137 times)