Topic: From Sh*tty to Shiny: Sbeckman7's CB350F Cafe Resto

[MoMo]

I agree w/ cal about checking them,make sure the float heights are correct also and all the same between the 4.

The seller has another set posted for sale on Ebay.  The set looks like he knows what he is doing but I'd still double check, as stated better to do it now than have to pull the carbs off later

[sbeckman7]

Ok guys, I'll check the float height after dinner.  I just confirmed the stock jetting, with the needle on the middle setting.  I will have to figure out how to measure/adjust the float height as I never looked into that before.  I also honed my cylinders today

[grcamna2]

Ok guys, I'll check the float height after dinner.  I just confirmed the stock jetting, with the needle on the middle setting.  I will have to figure out how to measure/adjust the float height as I never looked into that before.  I also honed my cylinders today

Sbeckman7,
I think now is a good time to use an inside telescoping precision width gauge and then a large micrometer to measure the diameter of each of you're cylinder bores all the way up and down to tell if they are actually still round or oval shaped from piston wear.Then you can measure each corresponding piston at their widest point(skirt)to tell what the actual clearance is between the parts(I don't have these instruments but have used them before..)but I could imagine you should be close to the correct tolerance. That hone job looks sweet 

[sbeckman7]

Sbeckman7,
I think now is a good time to use an inside telescoping precision width gauge and then a large micrometer to measure the diameter of each of you're cylinder bores all the way up and down to tell if they are actually still round or oval shaped from piston wear.Then you can measure each corresponding piston at their widest point(skirt)to tell what the actual clearance is between the parts(I don't have these instruments but have used them before..)but I could imagine you should be close to the correct tolerance. That hone job looks sweet 

Thanks!  I don't have any tools to measure the cylinder bores as you described, and I will check them with a micrometer but to be honest I just want to button it back together at this point.

[MoMo]

Flex Hone does an awesome job. float height is measured from the base of the carb to the crown of the float with the float tang just barely resting on the float needle

[calj737]

You did a perfect job on those cylinders with a hone! Slip your rings inside the piston and measure the end gap before you button it up. Enthusiasm is a great thing; rushing is a PITA later.

[sbeckman7]

You did a perfect job on those cylinders with a hone! Slip your rings inside the piston and measure the end gap before you button it up. Enthusiasm is a great thing; rushing is a PITA later.

Thanks Cal! I am assuming the only way to measure this is to seat each piston until the first ring is compressed inside the cylinder and then measure, seat pistons to 2nd ring and repeat, 3rd ring and repeat?

[calj737]

Nope, ditch the pistons altogether. Slightly compress the rings so they slide into the bore (they will fit). Then while they're being held in with friction, use a feeler gauge to measure the opening gap. Specs are in the book for Service Limits.

Handle the rings carefully, they are prone to breaking if you meathead them.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Nope, ditch the pistons altogether. Slightly compress the rings so they slide into the bore (they will fit). Then while they're being held in with friction, use a feeler gauge to measure the opening gap. Specs are in the book for Service Limits.

Handle the rings carefully, they are prone to breaking if you meathead them.

Meathead! Hamfist! Now, I'm hungry.

[grcamna2]

LOL 
I like to lightly and evenly push the ring to be tested down into the bore past the non-wearing 'ridge' where the piston stops, 10-12mm down..

[sbeckman7]

Guys, I am ordering a feeler gauge off amazon today so I will check the rings before reassembling the engine.  I just finished cleaning the pistons up so that's great timing.



In the mean time... This gasket is killing me    I've had enough scraping with a razor... Any other tricks to get this sh*t off?

[calj737]

Any decent Auto Parts store will have feeler gauge sets. Just buy a set with the range of thicknesses you need.

Gasket? The head gasket? Oh, its a beauty lots of times. Chemicals, beer, elbow grease, lots of razor blades, more beer, heaps of cussing, beer, elbow grease, fresh razor blades, beer, and more cussing. Or, you can drop it to a machine shop and they can whip across it with a flap wheel and get it pretty dang clean. (Didn't you mention access to a drill press? If so, put a flap wheel in, move the head around it gently and DIY).

[sbeckman7]

Any decent Auto Parts store will have feeler gauge sets. Just buy a set with the range of thicknesses you need.

Gasket? The head gasket? Oh, its a beauty lots of times. Chemicals, beer, elbow grease, lots of razor blades, more beer, heaps of cussing, beer, elbow grease, fresh razor blades, beer, and more cussing. Or, you can drop it to a machine shop and they can whip across it with a flap wheel and get it pretty dang clean. (Didn't you mention access to a drill press? If so, put a flap wheel in, move the head around it gently and DIY).

Not that I don't have enough beer, but after the BMW V12 I did last year I am really not looking forward to more gasket removal    The flap wheel is an interesting idea, but would it be effective in a drill press (perpendicular to the cylinder head)?

[calj737]

Mount the head on edge, move it along with the table and the flap wheel becomes usable 

Another very simple option is to have a machine shop mill 0.001 off the surface. That should clean it straight away and produce a perfectly level mating surface.

[sbeckman7]

Thanks for the advice, I'll see what ends up feeling best.  I've made a few scratches with the razor blade but none near critical sealing areas (oil tubes/cylinders) so I think it should be ok... Getting there!  After reading horror stories for the past half hour of leaking head gaskets and oil o-rings I am definitely getting new OEM gaskets.  Anything else I need to think about before ordering?  Copper spray-a-gasket?  I have the original oil seals but do I need new ones?  In the mean time...

My head, powder coat, and handlebar switches arrived today!


The CB400F valves on the new head (left, obviously) are slightly larger than the original CB350F valves.


Not sure if this is the standard port finish or if it's been slightly ported, but it looks nice!


The reason for my porting muse is because some of the screws seem to be ground off from the inside of the intake ports


My switches, which I forgot about! Also came in the box with the head


And lastly, the bane of my existence.  Scraping gasket material off...  I nudge the razor into the gasket with the hammer when the going gets rough 

[grcamna2]

I think you scored on that CB400F head ! 
Have you ever ordered a Vesrah gasket set? they are quality and are as close to oem(Made in Japan) as you can get plus a good value as you get the complete set.

[MoMo]

To measure the ring end gap, I insert the ring into cylinder then use the piston from up under to make sure the ring isn't cocked before measuring the end gap.  Nice hone job and keep at it with the gasket removal(it is a major PITA)

[sbeckman7]

I think you scored on that CB400F head ! 
Have you ever ordered a Vesrah gasket set? they are quality and are as close to oem(Made in Japan) as you can get plus a good value as you get the complete set.

I would agree! Going to mount my carbs to the head tonight to see how it looks    I just read on an older thread that Vesrah gaskets aren't what they used to be, although I think that was with regard to the o-rings.  Hopefully I can get away with just head and cylinder gaskets.  The pair of NOS Honda are $50 shipped so that seems like a good idea.

To measure the ring end gap, I insert the ring into cylinder then use the piston from up under to make sure the ring isn't cocked before measuring the end gap.  Nice hone job and keep at it with the gasket removal(it is a major PITA)

Thanks for the advice and words of motivation!  I will admit that I forgot a crucial step in the beginning: A Cold Beer!  With that nearby it seems a little better


I just scored another great eBay find this evening!  Won an auction for a pair of Works Performance adjustable rear shocks   They are nearly identical in length to the original springs and I think for the money there is nothing better for these bikes (at least nothing I have come across!).  I was originally planning on having a set of Hagons built to order, but these seem to be of an even higher level of quality and the adjustability is something that could come in handy later on.  The final price was a good $70 less than new Hagons; I am happy! 

[grcamna2]

Those are nice looking shocks! I'd like to find a pr. like that for my CB125S,they look like around 12.5" eye-eye.

Vesrah gaskets Are still great.

[MoMo]

Nice but isn't the bottom of a 350 shock  clevis mount ?

[sbeckman7]

Those are nice looking shocks! I'd like to find a pr. like that for my CB125S,they look like around 12.5" eye-eye.

Vesrah gaskets Are still great.

They do look to be right around 12.5," the exact length of the OEM shocks   Good to know for the gaskets as well.

Nice but isn't the bottom of a 350 shock  clevis mount ?

Yes it is, a simple modification will take care of that

It's been an expensive night    In addition to the shocks, I ordered:

- OEM Head Gasket
- OEM Cylinder Gasket
- Adjustable Levers


- and a new brake rotor... but wait!  It's a ZX9 rotor, and not to be used with the original caliper.


It will be used in conjunction with this Tokico two-piston caliper



The new brake system will require some work to make it fit but should be a very worthy upgrade in the end.  It seems as though forum member Psychonaut (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=101234.25)has done this exact conversion at some point in the past although he hasn't been active in a while and all of his picture links are broken.  Nevertheless, I will be taking this conversion on with my best friend who is building another 350F in parallel with the same conversion.  He was actually the one who gave me the caliper (for free!)

[sbeckman7]

Been a while but I finally have some material worth updating

- Head Gasket arrived so now I'm just waiting on my cylinder gasket before putting the engine back together.  Gasket surface is about 80% clean but I just hate scraping them so I will get around to it this weekend 


- Works Performance rear shocks also arrived.  These will require modifying the swing arm to accommodate the eye-mount instead of the original clevis, but I'm not worried about it.  Just need to make time for a trip to the shop.  Excited about the dual spring rate; I think they'll clean up nicely


- My Steel Dragon Performance intake was shipped today, it should arrive on Monday!

- Lastly, I've been working with my friend on the front brake upgrade.  Happily, this will all be going in the trash (or to any other forum member who wants it!)


The replacement will require a custom spacer/adapter on the hub and a custom caliper bracket as well.  We began by looking at rear-mounted caliper setups, but after some design work it's looking like replicating the OEM caliper mount may be the way to go.  This will require a righthand caliper as the left one I currently have is in the wrong orientation for a front mounted system, but no matter.  We can get the right hand ones easily.  Here is a picture of how the first mock up went:


If these turn out well (and we are reasonably hoping two mechanical engineering students can make sure they do) we could possibly offer the conversion as a kit to other interested forum members.  Like I said, we are now looking at a front-mounted caliper so I will update once we get those

Also should go without saying, I will sandblast my rims tomorrow and hope they're salvageable.  They currently give me slight nausea on sight 

[sbeckman7]

I have paint!! 

Today I had my first experience with powder coating and I'm very happy with the results.  I practiced with a few pieces in black: swing arm, exhaust flanges, kickstand, and a few other bits.


They turned out great, but the real triumph for today is that I now have a painted frame   This was the last stage of prep before it got painted; I inspected the entire frame to make sure there were no ugly spots and torched the left side engine mount bracket.


Cured for 10 minutes @ 400 degrees, and after it was looking like this 




It's a tad darker than I thought it would be but I am really happy with the result.  It has a very unique hue that changes depending on where the light hits it   For example, this is how it looks in the living room


For anyone who missed the how/why the sides are torched: In order to get all of the standing water out of my frame, I ended up having to heat it with a torch.  After a little while the thin metal started discoloring from the heat, which gave me the idea to do the entire bracket in that finish.  Same process for the other side.


I wanted to put the swingarm back on tonight but unfortunately I found that the bushings inside were badly corroded so I will replace those before reinstalling everything.  Instead I settled for sticking the new wiring harness into its home

Tomorrow I plan on getting some hardware for the engine (carb isolator bolts), ignition key switch mount, and the swing arm.  I may also move components from the old harness to the new one.  I sand blasted my wheels today as well, but sadly the rims are so badly pitted that I found a few holes   I am getting a new(er) set from another forum member who is currently parting out a 400f, and once I receive those I will find time to powdercoat them as well.  I also need to finish scraping the gasket off the cylinders as my new one arrived today, so once that's done I can begin reassembling the engine!


A good start to the weekend!

[Bootsey]

Nice work on the frame, looks quite intriguing!

[grcamna2]

Now your frame is completely clear PC'd ? nice