Topic: From Sh*tty to Shiny: Sbeckman7's CB350F Cafe Resto

[sbeckman7]

Alright, I'll rub some 30wt. oil on the cylinder walls before sealing everything up.  Engine Bolt kit should arrive Monday and the top triple on Tuesday.  It would be awesome to get the engine reinstalled next weekend!  Should be doable.

[sbeckman7]

Finally an update: My engine bolt kit and new OEM top triple arrived, and I completed what should be my last round of powder coating today! I did:
- left side engine/front sprocket cover
- rear brake linkage
- new top triple
- Idiot lights/top bar clamp
- front engine mount
- Engine oil breather hose cover
- chain guard

I'm actually fairly certain I won't use the chain guard, but I wanted to paint it anyways just in case.  If not I will sell it to whoever wants it

Also forgot to share my Bikemaster "drag bars" with eBay adjustable levers.  Quality is yet to be seen... Have to try them out once all the cables are hooked up on the bike.


The new triple before:


And after:



Other pieces:



The fork is my next project, and I'm really not sure how I should approach it.  For now I'll try to clean it up and remove the rust at the top of each stanchion with some scotchbrite, and eventually I'd like to paint the guards black.  I tried to disassemble it today but they're so tight from the rust that I couldn't get them out; I was only able to rotate them.  Regardless, I should be able to have a roller by tomorrow evening, even if it's without tires   I think I'll get my new rims shipped soon, and the MotoGP Werks exhaust is finished but awaiting some final machining work.  I sandblasted my original exhaust gaskets tonight just to see if they're reusable.  If not I'll get new ones, but they're pricy enough that I wanted to try the old ones first.  So tomorrow I want to finish putting the engine back together, and if possible I would love to paint it too!  The sooner I can get it back in the frame the happier I will be

[grcamna2]

Nice looking triple and even better after PC;is that the same part on the CB400F ?

[markreimer]

My 350F stanchions were rusted badly between the two clamps as well (thankfully all clean below the lower triple clamp) and I had some good success with a soft brass wire wheel. It took the rust right off but left the chrome behind. Had both of them cleaned up in a few minutes. Scotchbrite should work too, just might take a while longer. My 2 cents!

[sbeckman7]

Nice looking triple and even better after PC;is that the same part on the CB400F ?

Thanks! I can neither confirm nor deny that it will fit the 400F    But my gut instinct is: yes.  I believe* they are the same.

My 350F stanchions were rusted badly between the two clamps as well (thankfully all clean below the lower triple clamp) and I had some good success with a soft brass wire wheel. It took the rust right off but left the chrome behind. Had both of them cleaned up in a few minutes. Scotchbrite should work too, just might take a while longer. My 2 cents!

Good to know! I think I'll give the wire wheel a try before the steel wool and scotchbrite... Power tools > manual   Pretty sure this rust is a common issue with the bikes as mine is exactly the same as you described yours.

Also, does anyone know where to source new face plates for the warning light labels?  I don't mind reusing the old one but if I can get a new one cheap I may do that.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Make sure if you get a wire wheel that it is brass.  A standard wire wheel will scratch the crap out of your chrome.

You might also want to FIRST try cleaning the affected area with aluminum foil and Coke, or soaking it in EvapoRust for a day or two.

[grcamna2]

My 350F stanchions were rusted badly between the two clamps as well (thankfully all clean below the lower triple clamp) and I had some good success with a soft brass wire wheel. It took the rust right off but left the chrome behind. Had both of them cleaned up in a few minutes. Scotchbrite should work too, just might take a while longer. My 2 cents!

I painted my fork tops silver after much prep because for some odd reason Honda chose not to chrome plate the entire fork tube and left the top part bare steel.. Water sits inside the 'tins' when it's parked outside and just does a big 'number' on those hidden areas on the tubes. 

[RAFster122s]

The CB550 has the same issue on the fork tubes between the triple trees encased in the fork ears. You have to spread the triples with a wedge to get the fork tubes to slide out and then wire wheel the rusty scale off.
Take a look at SohRon's build...he has the decal for the idiot lights that he sourced from some where and was playing with the different labeling over the years. I don't think he did it himself but he might have. He was extremely meticulous and did a great job documenting his far better than blueprinted cb550 build.


David

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

I wasn't aware that Honda used fork tubes that had no plating on the portion covered by the fork ears on the CB350.  I know on the 550s and 750s the enclosed fork ears prevents cleaning them and the moisture, dirt, etc. just allows them to rust away under the ears.

[grcamna2]

I wasn't aware that Honda used fork tubes that had no plating on the portion covered by the fork ears on the CB350.  I know on the 550s and 750s the enclosed fork ears prevents cleaning them and the moisture, dirt, etc. just allows them to rust away under the ears.

I think they are better starting w/ the late 70's-up models.

[sbeckman7]

That's really good to know! I'm not sure which method I should try first, I guess coca cola and foil.  If I have time tonight I'll update with my results.

David, thanks for the info on Ron's build.  I'll send him a message.

[nimbuzz]

I'm so glad you put in new headset bearings! I must've gotten onto another similar project but I thought I was still on yours where the guy "cleaned up the headset..." and had already put it together and I didn't know what to say about your NEEDING new bearings in that sensitive (handling) area. Right on Dr Spence!

[nimbuzz]

The shock springs must be balanced with the fork spring rate.

[Denver_Larry]

Nice to see how the top triple came out

[sbeckman7]

I'm so glad you put in new headset bearings! I must've gotten onto another similar project but I thought I was still on yours where the guy "cleaned up the headset..." and had already put it together and I didn't know what to say about your NEEDING new bearings in that sensitive (handling) area. Right on Dr Spence!

Oh yes Al, tapered bearing replacement kit is an important upgrade on these old stems as you probably know!

Nice to see how the top triple came out

Thanks Larry!  It was great that you had it laying around

[sbeckman7]

Time for an update, and not a good one sadly... Today I thought I would get the engine buttoned back up after a long period of sitting while my friend from Germany was visiting.  Instead, after the first pass over the head with the torque wrench, I discovered part of an oil ring on the garage floor that I assumed was ejected while I was seating the cylinders a few weeks ago.  Several words exited my mouth at this point    And sure enough after removing the head nuts, head, and cylinders again, I found the #4 piston with ⅔ of an oil ring and a some nice gouges along the cylinder wall...

The scratch is 2.5" long from the bottom of the cylinder sleeve, and my tape-measured dimensions tell me the bottom of the oil ring sits ~0.75" below the top of the piston crown.  With a 2.0" stroke, that puts the new oil ring 0.25" into the scratched portion of the cylinder sleeve.  It's deep enough that I can feel it with my finger, but I'm trying to decide if I can salvage the sleeve somehow either with another partial hone only over the scratch or - if it isn't that deep - if I can just get away with it.

Are these rings decent enough?  Don't want to break the bank on this thing. http://www.ebay.com/itm/72-74-Honda-CB350Four-Standard-Piston-Rings-Set-4-rings-Include-11-CB350FPR-/162019454483?hash=item25b91cae13:g:ARoAAOSwk5FUtjrs&vxp=mtr


Hopefully the next update will be a happier one!

[grcamna2]

I like the 3-piece oil control rings myself.. the one-piece(old style,just like your broken one)lower oil control ring is 'dated' and is not always able to 'seat'/break-in as well as compared to those nice 3-piece oil bottom rings that come in better kits and they are more efficient at scraping oil, imo

That'd be nice if a light hone would clean that up

[sbeckman7]

I like the 3-piece oil control rings myself.. the one-piece(old style,just like your broken one)lower oil control ring is 'dated' and is not always able to 'seat'/break-in as well as compared to those nice 3-piece oil bottom rings that come in better kits and they are more efficient at scraping oil, imo

That'd be nice if a light hone would clean that up

Any idea if the ring set I linked is of the 3-piece oil ring variety?

[calj737]

Only way to tell is to hone it. If you can feel it, it must be removed.

[grcamna2]

I like the 3-piece oil control rings myself.. the one-piece(old style,just like your broken one)lower oil control ring is 'dated' and is not always able to 'seat'/break-in as well as compared to those nice 3-piece oil bottom rings that come in better kits and they are more efficient at scraping oil, imo

That'd be nice if a light hone would clean that up

Any idea if the ring set I linked is of the 3-piece oil ring variety?

Those 'cruizin image' ring sets you linked have the one piece lower oil control ring.
I see that you're having similar struggles w/ your cylinder as member 'iiAtlas' has w/ his,he is trying to source a new sleeve.

[sbeckman7]

Those 'cruizin image' ring sets you linked have the one piece lower oil control ring.
I see that you're having similar struggles w/ your cylinder as member 'iiAtlas' has w/ his,he is trying to source a new sleeve.

Yep, pretty much an identical story sadly...

[grcamna2]

Those 'cruizin image' ring sets you linked have the one piece lower oil control ring.
I see that you're having similar struggles w/ your cylinder as member 'iiAtlas' has w/ his,he is trying to source a new sleeve.

Yep, pretty much an identical story sadly...

How many cylinders are messed-up on your bike ? I hope both you and 'iiAtlas' would consider going half on the price of a very fresh STD bore cylinder block(split the cost)which you can both salvage the liners from it to fix yours,as long as you both have just 2) cylinder liners each   
I'm wondering why no other sohc4 members have stepped forward to sell you a good cylinder set yet?

possibly STD size liners are difficult to close to impossible to find..

[sbeckman7]

possibly STD size liners are difficult to close to impossible to find..

I'm thinking this is the case 

[MoMo]

I  have a spare cylinder set along with at least two full sets of std. pistons...Larry

[iiAtlas]

Time for an update, and not a good one sadly... Today I thought I would get the engine buttoned back up after a long period of sitting while my friend from Germany was visiting.  Instead, after the first pass over the head with the torque wrench, I discovered part of an oil ring on the garage floor that I assumed was ejected while I was seating the cylinders a few weeks ago.  Several words exited my mouth at this point    And sure enough after removing the head nuts, head, and cylinders again, I found the #4 piston with ⅔ of an oil ring and a some nice gouges along the cylinder wall...

The scratch is 2.5" long from the bottom of the cylinder sleeve, and my tape-measured dimensions tell me the bottom of the oil ring sits ~0.75" below the top of the piston crown.  With a 2.0" stroke, that puts the new oil ring 0.25" into the scratched portion of the cylinder sleeve.  It's deep enough that I can feel it with my finger, but I'm trying to decide if I can salvage the sleeve somehow either with another partial hone only over the scratch or - if it isn't that deep - if I can just get away with it.

Are these rings decent enough?  Don't want to break the bank on this thing. http://www.ebay.com/itm/72-74-Honda-CB350Four-Standard-Piston-Rings-Set-4-rings-Include-11-CB350FPR-/162019454483?hash=item25b91cae13:g:ARoAAOSwk5FUtjrs&vxp=mtr


Hopefully the next update will be a happier one!

Aha...welcome to the scratched cylinder and snapped ring club!  At lest we are both in this one together...as grcamna2 mentioned, I'd happily go 50/50 on a cylinder block with you.  I need two sleeves, sounds like you need one. 

As for rings, I was weary of anything other than OEM.  It took me a while and cost a pretty penny but I found them from a dealer in Canada.  $170.38 for a set of four.  Unopened in the OEM box, they really are a thing of beauty!  Shame I'll have to open them...but they'll serve my bike well.  Many recommendations on my thread were to overbore a size up.  Why scratches are not too deep so one size up (0.25") should do.  Seeing as how I spent all that money on the rings, this was not exactly something I wanted to do...that being said, it could be a decent option for one of us.  If you'd like to stick with the STD bore I'd be happy to sell you my rings for what I paid for them.

The third option is an aftermarket sleeve.  I reached out to two companies, one LA Sleeve, the other Bill Moeller at Bore Tech.  LA Sleeve got back to me and said it would be $150 per sleeve and that they had one in stock.  Six weeks lead time to make another.  Yikes!  But alas, in desperation, a good option to have.

We're in the same boat here sadly, and not with any real obvious "good" answer.  I'm pretty sure you have my number so feel free to call or text if you want to chat options!

EDIT: Looks like Larry could be a good option!

I  have a spare cylinder set along with at least two full sets of std. pistons...Larry

Is your set the sleeves or the head as a whole?  Thanks for chiming in!