Topic: From Sh*tty to Shiny: Sbeckman7's CB350F Cafe Resto

[grcamna2]

Thanks guys, I will order the 48mm 320 grit Silicon Carbide flex-hone today   Tonight I'll try my luck with removal of the cylinder head with my new torch!

Have you had any experience w/ using a 'ball' type flex hone to hone a 'cross-hatch' pattern in your cylinders so they are ready for fresh piston rings? I prefer the type of hone that has flat,rigid stones on it...

[sbeckman7]

Thanks guys, I will order the 48mm 320 grit Silicon Carbide flex-hone today   Tonight I'll try my luck with removal of the cylinder head with my new torch!

Have you had any experience w/ using a 'ball' type flex hone to hone a 'cross-hatch' pattern in your cylinders so they are ready for fresh piston rings? I prefer the type of hone that has flat,rigid stones on it...

I can't say that I have. Is it somewhat superior technically or is it just a personal preference? Starting to wonder if I should just take it to machine shop! 

[grcamna2]

Thanks guys, I will order the 48mm 320 grit Silicon Carbide flex-hone today   Tonight I'll try my luck with removal of the cylinder head with my new torch!

Have you had any experience w/ using a 'ball' type flex hone to hone a 'cross-hatch' pattern in your cylinders so they are ready for fresh piston rings? I prefer the type of hone that has flat,rigid stones on it...

I can't say that I have. Is it somewhat superior technically or is it just a personal preference? Starting to wonder if I should just take it to machine shop! 

The machine shop can hone them for you using a Sunnen 4-stone precision hone that will make quick work of each cylinder,as long as they are with-in 'Spec'  see my Edit below:

as mentioned earlier it would be Best to know exactly what the inside diameter is inside each of the 4 cylinders,A decent machinist will carefully check the bores all the way around and the entire depth from top to bottom of each hole.The cylinders will sometimes wear unevenly(oval shape  )and if that is the case it's better to bore out the cylinders to the next biggest size pistons to get an exact 'Round' hole for better ring sealing and even wear for many strong running miles and years.A better seal equals more consistent compression and that means more horse power 

[calj737]

You can decide whether to hone at home or have a shop hone them but really you should have a shop determine if the bores and pistons are still within spec, and are suitable for just honing. If there is too much wear, then its possible new pistons, rings and a re-bore are necessary.

I personally don't recommend DIY rigid hones unless you have a drill press. Its pretty critical to keep the alignment perfectly co-linear to the bore to avoid warping or ovation the bore with a rigid bore. A Flex hone is far more forgiving and a really suitable type for DIY and a handheld drill. (Even better in a press  )

[sbeckman7]

You can decide whether to hone at home or have a shop hone them but really you should have a shop determine if the bores and pistons are still within spec, and are suitable for just honing. If there is too much wear, then its possible new pistons, rings and a re-bore are necessary.

I personally don't recommend DIY rigid hones unless you have a drill press. Its pretty critical to keep the alignment perfectly co-linear to the bore to avoid warping or ovation the bore with a rigid bore. A Flex hone is far more forgiving and a really suitable type for DIY and a handheld drill. (Even better in a press  )

Thanks for that info Cal.  I don't know why I didn't think of it before, but my friend has a solid drill press I could use (as well as an entire machine shop...).  I'm gonna check with him to see what could be done at his place   What type of rigid bore would be best for this cylinder set then?

[sbeckman7]

HOLY MOLY another beauty for you guys to feast your eyes on!!!  This time it's the speedo

The speedo that came with my bike is the only item that showed signs of a possible crash, with a shaved down portion of the left side of the bezel.  Fairly sure I would be replacing it anyways, I decided to take it apart to practice before I mess up a nicer set of gauges.  I pried the metal clip up and eventually off by working a pair of needle nose pliers around the circumference, and presto.

This is right about when I decided to definitely source another speedo:


I don't usually share selfies, but having found my new dinner I was too excited not to.

[MoMo]

Ugly.......................................................................................the speedo not you .   Never have I seen any gauge that bad

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Toast!

[grcamna2]

Are you sure you didn't put that speedo in the freezer before taking it apart and snapping the pics? lol 

[sbeckman7]

It was completely full of rust! I've never seen anything like that before 

[Davez134]

Thanks guys, I will order the 48mm 320 grit Silicon Carbide flex-hone today   Tonight I'll try my luck with removal of the cylinder head with my new torch!

Have you had any experience w/ using a 'ball' type flex hone to hone a 'cross-hatch' pattern in your cylinders so they are ready for fresh piston rings? I prefer the type of hone that has flat,rigid stones on it...

I can't say that I have. Is it somewhat superior technically or is it just a personal preference? Starting to wonder if I should just take it to machine shop! 

I used that flex hone on my 750K2 with great results. More "forgiving" than the stones and easy to use.

[sbeckman7]

I used that flex hone on my 750K2 with great results. More "forgiving" than the stones and easy to use.

Good to know Dave.  Love your bike(s) by the way! (black one w/ gold wheels and yoshi exhaust particularly)

[calj737]

Hey man, a little WD-40 and a couple of rags and I think that gauge will be all right...  I had a set of carbs that looked worse. They went into the bin never to be seen again. Take notice of the mileage if possible, as you can set the new gauge to the same if you open it up for rebuilding.

[sbeckman7]

Ha! Right you are Cal, don't know why I'm was so lazy and dropped 15 bucks on a nice quality speedo when I could have instead spent the next week cleaning the old one 

Guys, anyone familiar with TTR400 (Kevin)?  I emailed him asking about pricing on his gorgeous billet CB400F top triple but not sure if he is around to respond to emails or on some crazy enduro ride.

[grcamna2]

It was completely full of rust! I've never seen anything like that before 

if we had a 'wall of shame' here on the forum we could post that speedo pic up there explaining just how ruinous it is to store your vintage Honda outside for years.. 

[calj737]

Kevin Bidgood is "really good people". Incredibly nice guy, does outstanding work, and a bastion of knowledge on the 400s. Only chink in his armor is he's located in South Africa and shipping R from there is a nightmare 

He often takes a couple of days to reply (+6 hours) and he does ride his bike a good bit. It's not a sign of not caring or un professionalism, he's just not always in the shop.

[sbeckman7]

Cylinders are off!  It was pretty easy, I applied a little heat with the torch (although I honestly don't think it was enough to do anything), tapped around the base of the cylinders with my rubber mallet/wood block combo for a few minutes, and presto!  The hardest part was sliding it off of the #1 piston (the one that had standing water at some point).  All the rings on this one are seized into the piston itself, but the other 3 are ok.  I mean, not great... Couldn't see any cross-hatching on the bores so I am hoping they're not too worn, but I guess I will find out once I take it to a machine shop.

Other parts that arrived: my handlebars which look good, and the carb rebuild gasket kit, which means I have to do the other three now 




Open to suggestions/recommendations on engine parts repair or replacement here..

[grcamna2]

I recommend carefully covering over the openings in your crankcases and just propping the engine forward to where the cylinder studs are horizontal and meticulously cleaning each one of those cylinder mounting studs,otherwise that stuff will get into your crankshaft & rod bearings plus inside the cases.

[sbeckman7]

I recommend carefully covering over the openings in your crankcases and just propping the engine forward to where the cylinder studs are horizontal and meticulously cleaning each one of those cylinder mounting studs,otherwise that stuff will get into your crankshaft & rod bearings plus inside the cases.

That's good advice.  There was even more when I first removed the cylinders, and while I did my blow to get all of it away from the crankcase a little bit did go inside    Hoping it will flush out with gratuitous amounts of oil...

[calj737]

Don't use oil to flush your motor, use a fluid like Diesel or Kerosene. It's cheaper and more productive at rinsing away particles.

You need to replace many of those studs. Use a "stud puller" and lots of heat (like cherry red hot) pointed directly at the case where the stud meets it. Use a hammer and give each stud a whack then use the puller to twist out the stud. This will he loosen any stuck studs, and prevent them from snapping off.

When they're corroded like that, they're apt to shear when you re-torque the head nuts to them and better to replace them now then after you've assembled the top end. 

[sbeckman7]

Don't use oil to flush your motor, use a fluid like Diesel or Kerosene. It's cheaper and more productive at rinsing away particles.

You need to replace many of those studs. Use a "stud puller" and lots of heat (like cherry red hot) pointed directly at the case where the stud meets it. Use a hammer and give each stud a whack then use the puller to twist out the stud. This will he loosen any stuck studs, and prevent them from snapping off.

When they're corroded like that, they're apt to shear when you re-torque the head nuts to them and better to replace them now then after you've assembled the top end. 

I figured replacement was basically a given haha.  Thanks for those tips for the diesel and stud puller   I might try the 2-nut method first in case I get lucky. 

This little engine sure is turning into a $$$ sucker!!

[sbeckman7]

Good news from the local motorcycle shop!  They took a quick look at the head and said it looks great, advised to simply hone and reinstall.  So I'll be doing that   It will get a bath today followed by some paint prep while I wait for the flex hone to arrive.  I decided to go that route in the interest of saving time/money.  In the end it comes down to me not being worried about the quality gap between that and a rigid stone hone.  I have ordered the flex-hone as well.

[calj737]

I hope you meant they said the bores looked great, not the head  Or did they also inspect the head and valves and gave it a passing grade too?

[sbeckman7]

I hope you meant they said the bores looked great, not the head  Or did they also inspect the head and valves and gave it a passing grade too?

Oops    I definitely meant to type "bores" instead.  The newly rebuilt head, however, is on its way to me!

[calj737]

Man, for a newbie, you're making really great progress on getting this thing together. Take great care with the rings on the pistons when reinstalling them into the bores. Watch ample YouTube videos on honing, and use lots of cutting fluid (motor oil or better). Some use WD, but I encourage you to use something of a true lubricant or cutting fluid. Produces a better, more even cut.