Topic: Let's talk torque wrenchs

[Sockeye]

So in preparation to have the right tools, I need to get a set of torque wrenchs(inch and foot).

 I don't want to spend on the Snap-on level but don't want the cheapo China brands.

What the middle of the road?

[Davez134]

I have good experiences with Lowes (kobalt) torque wrenches. I've compared their readings with my digital Snap-On and they are pretty consistent and reliable.

[Don R]

 Hot rod tested a bunch of them and the Harbor Freight cheapies tested well. How long they are accurate I can't say. They were shocked at the results.

[mrfish2]

My Pittsburgh wrench from Harbor Freight has held up well for the past year, and has proven to be fairly accurate.

[PeWe]

I'm convinced I got good wrenches for not that much. Wrong torque can cost more to repair than the wrenches.
Hazet wrenches, Made in Germany. (Not China or Zimbabwe....)

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,148109.msg1687529.html#msg1687529
I was not aware of how much they should be used :-)

[calj737]

The only advice I'll give you about tools is that they should be considered an investment. Cheap tools break, and they have to be replaced far more frequently than their more expensive counterparts. Torque wrenches especially are critical tools if you are building a motor. Too little torque and you get leaks and burn out bearings. Too much torque, and the motor breaks. If you are only torquing values less than 25 FT/LBs, then a quality wrench can cost less than $100. Any wrench up to 100# is going to cost you a decent amount of money, and you should spend it.

Buy it once, take darn good care of it, use it properly. Lasts a lifetime.

[70CB750]

I used fish scale once to get the proper torgue  - it was clumsy, but worked.

[RRRToolSolutions]

I like, use, and own several different makes and sizes of torque wrenches. Sturtevant Richmont torque wrenches are my favorite for price, performance, and durability. They sell repair kits for the ratcheting mechanisms, they have interchangeable heads, and they are everywhere. I just did a search and on eBay alone, there are over 100 items listed. Put in "sturtevant richmont torque wrench" and you'll see.

I am a strong advocate for using torque wrenches where Plastic, Aluminum, Stressed Members, and Safety is concerned. I do folks say they don't need or use one, but I won't build or assemble without one. Getting those connecting rod caps to 14 (K) or 17 (F) lbs/feet is critical. Getting the nuts on my tire pressure monitoring sensors to 35 inch/lbs, my windshield brackets on my ST1300 to 30 inch/lbs, my fork caps to 14 ft/lbs - all are critical. I use them on my boat to torque the engine mounting bolts to 55 lbs/feet - the perfect torque to prevent cracked fiberglass and gelcoat and exactly what the manufacturer recommends to ensure proper attachment.

Two things to remember once you have your wrenches -

All torque wrenches are best/most accurate in their "sweet spot" range - the middle. I prefer to have at least 2 - one for 10~75 lbs/feet and one for 50~150 lbs feet. I also have one for 5~50 inch/lbs that I'll use in delicate applications where electronics or windshield plastics are being installed.

If you buy the "click-torque" type (my favorites), there will be a handle that you tighten to adjust the preload. Do Not leave that preload on after use. Always remember to loosen the preset back to zero so you don't leave the spring under tension.

One last observation, I do like the torque-click type wrenches the best. My one and only digital screen got broken when I dropped it and was a pain to see in bright and bad light so those are on my "no" list. The beam type are ok if you have room to fit your head directly over the beam/numbers to read the scale each time. 90% of my bolts/nuts are where I can't and don't want to fit my head, so that is why I like the click-torque type. Just a little practice and you'll both feel and hear when the torque is reached.

Best Regards, Gordon

[flybox1]

Two things to remember once you have your wrenches -

All torque wrenches are best/most accurate in their "sweet spot" range - the middle. I prefer to have at least 2 - one for 10~75 lbs/feet and one for 50~150 lbs feet. I also have one for 5~50 inch/lbs that I'll use in delicate applications where electronics or windshield plastics are being installed.

If you buy the "click-torque" type (my favorites), there will be a handle that you tighten to adjust the preload. Do Not leave that preload on after use. Always remember to loosen the preset back to zero so you don't leave the spring under tension.

+1
I have an inch lb up to 250, and ftlb up to 150

[ChopSticks]

is there anyway to test that your torque wrench is still accurate?

[calj737]

A simple means is to clamp a vise grip to the drive, then lever a known dumbbell weight or other known mass. Its not 100% accurate, but for pretty darn close, it works.

[flybox1]

you can buy a torque wrench tester.
Fastenal offers this as a paid service.

[ChopSticks]

you can buy a torque wrench tester.

but would I eventually need something to test my tester? 


what if I have another torque wrench? could I say torque something down at 10lbs then mark it with a dot of paint or something, then use the other wrench at the same 10lbs and see if the mark moved?

also anyone try these?

http://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-ARM602-4-Measurement-Adapter-4-147-6/dp/B004VYURT0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1454687313&sr=8-1&keywords=torque+wrench+tester

[Duanob]

Hot rod tested a bunch of them and the Harbor Freight cheapies tested well. How long they are accurate I can't say. They were shocked at the results.

I'll second that! At work we have to calibrate our torque wrenches so i tested two that I bought at HF and they were both pretty much spot on.

[Duanob]

I used fish scale once to get the proper torgue  - it was clumsy, but worked.

If its a fisherman's scale you know it's off by a few pounds and a few inches! 

[70CB750]

I used fish scale once to get the proper torgue  - it was clumsy, but worked.

If its a fisherman's scale you know it's off by a few pounds and a few inches! 

You mean something like this?   

[Powderman]

you can buy a torque wrench tester.

but would I eventually need something to test my tester? 


what if I have another torque wrench? could I say torque something down at 10lbs then mark it with a dot of paint or something, then use the other wrench at the same 10lbs and see if the mark moved?

also anyone try these?

http://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-ARM602-4-Measurement-Adapter-4-147-6/dp/B004VYURT0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1454687313&sr=8-1&keywords=torque+wrench+tester

If the second wrench moves the fastener which wrench is wrong?

[wowbagger]

Yup, I always default to cheap Harbor Freight tools to start with. If they break then I know I use that one enough to justify investing in a professional grade tool.

[flybox1]

you can buy a torque wrench tester.

but would I eventually need something to test my tester? 


what if I have another torque wrench? could I say torque something down at 10lbs then mark it with a dot of paint or something, then use the other wrench at the same 10lbs and see if the mark moved?

also anyone try these?

http://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-ARM602-4-Measurement-Adapter-4-147-6/dp/B004VYURT0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1454687313&sr=8-1&keywords=torque+wrench+tester

If was your money maker, then yeah, you might use a torque wrench enough to get it out of tolerances.
I think you'd have to build bikes in the double digits before a torque wrench would need calibration/adjustments.

[Sockeye]

I have good experiences with Lowes (kobalt) torque wrenches. I've compared their readings with my digital Snap-On and they are pretty consistent and reliable.

Thanks everyone, as I know your not someone paid to increase the review rating on amazon!

I think I might go with kobalt because it seems that it would be more prosumer, and I'd get more life out of it. I do plan to buy 2, one that is inch-lbs and another w/ foot-lbs. Harbor Freight does seem tempting but I only like to buy fool proof things from there and in the long run id feel like it would fail or go out of calibration.

What would be the max i'd need in the foot-lbs?

[ChopSticks]

If was your money maker, then yeah, you might use a torque wrench enough to get it out of tolerances.
I think you'd have to build bikes in the double digits before a torque wrench would need calibration/adjustments.

that's good to know, was just concerned how often these things ship out of calibration. I know the tekton ones amazon sells +/- 4% accuracy

[millla03]

Another option I haven't seen mentioned is CDI brand. I have a 3/8" that covers most needs for these bikes. It's advertised as a "Snap-On brand", whatever that means. No plastic except for the case it came in. I consider it a middle of the road option. Not terribly cheap, but still half what a Snap-On or MAC costs and is a good quality tool that works as well as when I bought it a couple years ago.

I also have a Craftsman 1/2" torque wrench and the CDI is much higher quality. In hindsight, I would've gone with a CDI in place of it.

I've also read the article talking about the Harbor Freight wrenches, but I'm still leery of them. That store is my go-to for things like jack stands or other stuff that doesn't need to be accurate. Torque wrenches are worth spending more on, in my opinion.

[heyitsrama]

my uncle left one of these hazets at my house..... its got much better feedback throughout the torque setting. My pops always says to reset (back to 0) after using it to ensure that it does not wear out... not sure how much truth there is to that

[calj737]

my uncle left one of these hazets at my house..... its got much better feedback throughout the torque setting. My pops always says to reset (back to 0) after using it to ensure that it does not wear out... not sure how much truth there is to that

A fair bit. The internal spring is under pressure when the torque meter is set, and when in use. De-compressing the spring prolongs its life as well as promotes a longer, more accurate compression when under tension.

[Restoration Fan]

I had a cheap Harbor Freight torque wrench.  Right up until Logan broke a bolt off a case bolt using it and it had never clicked.
I went and bought a Snap-On and have used that since.

I did set up a small test and set up a test at 12, 15, and 20 foot pounds using both wrenches (using the Snap-On as the 'correct' value).  The HF one was off by a little at 12, a little more at 15 and a fair amount at 20.  I don't remember exactly how much it was off because I just threw the thing away once I realized how far off it was.

Take it FWIW but I'll stick with the Snap-On.

[jeffg]

is there anyway to test that your torque wrench is still accurate?

Cal Tech does calibration to (DEAD ON BALLS ACCURATE) that's an industry term                   (check with Marisa)

I always wanted a 1/4" drive, I felt I would do allot more torq ing, have 3/8, & 1/2. Wouldn't mind a screw driver grip style 1/4" drive also.

[dhall57]

You get what you pay for, like we've all be told since we were kids. If you depend on tools to make a living of course you need high quality stuff. Ive got some Craftsman, Kobalt, etc. But the tw's I've got are from HF and serve my purposes very well. For me spending more money on them was not necessary.

[ChopSticks]

Some manuals say to store at lowest setting so I'm assuming if you're wrench is a 10-90ftlbs the lowest setting would be 10 not below that

[mystic_1]

BTW, the "right" way to check a torque wrench for calibration involves hanging very precise weights off of a calibrated wheel like one of these:





These setups are however prohibitively expensive.  Often companies will send in a digital torque transducer and have that calibrated to NIST standards and then use that as a reference standard to check calibration of their in-house tools. 

In a DIY scenario you can do things like clamp the drive of the wrench in a vise and then hang known weights off the handle at a predetermined distance and then see if the wrench clicks.  Working out the weights and distances is pretty straight forward, torque is an expression of weight and distance, so 10 ft lbs is 10 pounds at a distance of 12 inches, or 20 lbs at a distance of 6 inches (120 inch pounds), or 5 pounds at a distance of 24 inches (again 120 inch pounds).

You can check against other wrenches but then you'll need at least two other wrenches and with luck at least two will match, otherwise there's no way to know which one is the accurate one.

What ever method you use, it's important to check the wrench at several points within it's range of operation. 

Your best bet to be absolutely sure is to send it in to a place that'll check it on a rig like the one below.  This particular wrench was off by about 3% near the top of its range, but the deviation was linear and repeatable, so the wrench would still be usable so long as one corrected for this when setting torque.




mystic_1

[Sockeye]

Another option I haven't seen mentioned is CDI brand. I have a 3/8" that covers most needs for these bikes. It's advertised as a "Snap-On brand", whatever that means. No plastic except for the case it came in. I consider it a middle of the road option. Not terribly cheap, but still half what a Snap-On or MAC costs and is a good quality tool that works as well as when I bought it a couple years ago.

Ok, so I've decided to go with a CDI 2502MRPH 3/8-Inch Drive 30 to 250-Inch-Pounds for my low end needs and a Harbor Freight 1/2" 20-150 ft/lbs for the top end. Eventually I plan to replace the HF with a CDI equivalent.

I'm sure the HF will serve its purpose and pay for itself the few times I'll require it, plus it will leave me with a beater/loaner tool for the odd/misc jobs that pop up.

For this first year I'm only going to work on getting the bike road worthy, then I'll tear into everything next year.

[seanbarney41]

I have found that I almost always need to borrow my bud's 1/4" drive 5-200(somewhere around there) inch pound wrench for these bikes.  The 1/4 drive is much more useful for getting at these little engine's hard to get at stuff, and torque values are relatively low...these are not tractor engines.

[calj737]

Right, you need an 8# - 50# wrench. Head nuts and studs are below 20# and they're most of the critical torque values aside from crank and rods.