Topic: Grumblings about modern technology

[Buckskin Bandit]

I love my old vehicles just because they break less often and are easy to fix when they do

Same here! Plus they look cool too! 

[calj737]

DH - there's a significant difference between an S class and a C class. As for the ball joints, mine doesn't have the conventional type but instead they're pressed into the upper and lower arms. These do wear as other brands though. But possibly the air suspension provided a bit of relief.

As for doing something right, I've run Amsoil since 10k and change it religiously every 25k miles. Yes, 25k. Leakdown tests run annually show me at 8psi and compression within 3psi of all 8. If that's not testimony for that oil, I don't know what is.

It is my experience that those who besmirch cars they've never owned are merely confusion their opinions with the malodorous noise resulting from a plate of refried beans. Because both are emanating from the same place.

[Gene]

but people dont want to pay for better . . .

truth.

[socal1200r]

Military has taught me about the dangers of a "single point of failure", which will happen with these so-called "smart phones", that people use for music, GPS, social media, etc.  If I need a GPS, that's what my Garmin is for.  Music, got an iPod for that.  Internet stuff, my laptop.  That's why I've resisted the temptation to get a smart phone, and have been quite happy with my old-school 3G flip phone. 

With that being said, there are some advantages to newer bikes, but one has to factor in the much more complicated nature of them as well.  If I want to ride one of my bikes to work, it won't be my '79 CB650.  I'd rather ride the 2014 Bolt, just turn the key, let the system do its thing, hit the start button, put my riding gear on, and off I go.  With the CB, I'd still be waiting around for at least 5 minutes, or until I can put the choke down at least half way, before it's ready to go.  But should the "system" go wonky on the Bolt, I'm in trouble, but luckily it'll throw codes to point me or the dealer in the right direction.

[DH]

DH - there's a significant difference between an S class and a C class. As for the ball joints, mine doesn't have the conventional type but instead they're pressed into the upper and lower arms. These do wear as other brands though. But possibly the air suspension provided a bit of relief.

As for doing something right, I've run Amsoil since 10k and change it religiously every 25k miles. Yes, 25k. Leakdown tests run annually show me at 8psi and compression within 3psi of all 8. If that's not testimony for that oil, I don't know what is.

It is my experience that those who besmirch cars they've never owned are merely confusion their opinions with the malodorous noise resulting from a plate of refried beans. Because both are emanating from the same place.

Sorry Cal, didn't mean to single out your car in a negative way. Just commenting on things I've seen, with plenty of modern technology failures, the mercs were included. Those being more mainstream in recent years and they're a high end car.. They're ALL getting harder and more complicated to fix. The technology is evolving faster than the repair industry, and it getting prohibitively expensive to keep up. That expense gets passed down to the customer who owns the vehicle with one defective HID headlight that he can't afford to replace.
Either make it to last or don't force it on the consumer. Especially when conventional components and systems are sufficient. jmho

[Mantree]

I love my old vehicles just because they break less often and are easy to fix when they do

Same here! Plus they look cool too! 

Well I don't know if that is always true

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[calj737]

Sorry Cal, didn't mean to single out your car in a negative way.

I didn't take it as such, DH. "Tone deaf" posts I'm afraid. We agree on the nature of your experience, but I also find a tremendous amount of anecdotal opinions from many with no experience whatsoever in ownership.

I put the success or survivability of a car down to each owner's model of care. I have a buddy who until recently had a Euro-service/tuning shop near Dulles. Lots of expensive cars, well-heeled owners. More than not, the cars were so poorly cared for, but always in for the next batch of go-fast trinkets or status styling upgrades. Made my stomach turn. Leaves and debris in the body drain holes, unwashed paint, no sign of wax, scraped wheels from curbs, etc. You pull the dipstick; black and sludgy. Greenbacks doesn't equal sense I'm afraid and perhaps this lot of dolts had more trouble with their toys than I with my car.

There's no denying many components today are engineered to be replaced and not serviced as in tester-years (ball joints a pretty good example actually). Gone are the days of chassis lubing welcoming todays replace when worn.

[Terry in Australia]

Your sweeping generalization is off-kilter and disproved, Terry.

Ha ha, if you said it Cal, I MUST be disproved, yeah? Only problem with that is you're talking about your experience with ONE Mercedes, while I'm talking about my experience with MANY. Yeah mate, when I was a soldier I worked a second job to support my family working at a full service garage, and I saw MANY Mercedes' that had failed prematurely.

Usually it was electrical issues that warranted enormously expensive replacement parts, (ignition/fuel injection parts were horribly expensive and nearly impossible to obtain from the Australian distributors, before the internet fixed most of those issues) but just as regularly, mechanical failure was a huge issue too.

The guy who started re-inking computer cartridges in Melbourne made a fortune. Before he made a lot of money though, he bought a new 1980's Mercedes 230E. By the early 1990's, it was blowing a cloud of smoke everywhere it went, so he brought it in and asked my boss to do a full rebuild. Back then a replacement reconditioned engine for an Australian built car was around the $2K mark, but due to the ridiculous cost of Mercedes parts, the quote for a full reco was $8K!

My boss was sure that the owner would tell us to forget it, but no, he's made a fortune re-inking cartridges, and he happily paid the $8K. Sadly a few months later it had some sort of electrical fire after he washed it with a high pressure hose, and burned to the ground in the owners driveway. Oh well........

But the thing that reminded me of this story was your claim that somehow the savings that you've made by driving your 16 year old Merc has put your son thru college. You see, my boss was one of the few mechanics in the area who would touch crappy European cars like Mercs, BMW's, Volvo's, Saab's, Audi's etc, and he told me that the reason that he'd decided to become the patron saint of Euro trash cars, was because they'd put both of his kids through private school, and paid for another house when his wife divorced him.

Oh, and your economy figures are a little "Light on" mate, you might have forgotten to add the 50,000-odd gallons of gas you've put through it, not to mention all of the other items that are a true reflection of actual running costs. In reality, the $80 that someone forked out for that thing when it was new was only a deposit.............

[calj737]

You misunderstand, Terry. The money I've been paid for business travel as a reimbursement has gone to putting my boy through college. The reimbursement rate over the 16 years have averaged about $0.42/mile. The fuel costs have averaged far less, and the balance of "running costs" have been tax deductible. Please don't presume to know how the finances work out when you don't know the nature of it all.

And "working in a shop in the '80s" is a far cry from owning a Mercedes and caring for it yourself, Terry. But if you've opined then it must be so. Pardon my presumption to ever have a fact-based thought that differs from your story telling.

If you feel so inclined, both of these articles are pretty revealing to the nature of the beast (230e) and its "reputation":
http://classics.honestjohn.co.uk/reviews/mercedes-benz/e-class-w123/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/10074074/Classic-Mercedes-230E-built-to-last.html

Both essentially rate the 230e as "bomb proof" and the high watermark for vehicles from MB. They go on to say, there are ample examples of vehicles with well over 350k kilometers still running strong. Further citing their popularity with For-Hire drivers.

These are a far cry from your heaps of #$%*e description, Terry. Perhaps your recall is not indicative of the experience had by so many other owners.