Author Topic: Died in the rain (Read 2988 times)

kennyle · « **on:** May 04, 2016, 10:03:31 AM »

I was heading home from work when it started to rain down hard. It was fine for the first like 10 minutes but the the throttle became unresponsive and then a few seconds later engine just turned off. Lights and everything was still on. Tried starting it back up with the electric starter but nope, nothing happened. Had to push the bike to my friends house a block away.

Power is not an issue cause lights are turning on so I am not sure where to start looking.

flybox1 · « **Reply #1 on:** May 04, 2016, 10:40:18 AM »

What bike?

points wet?
wiring to coils wet?
check, clean, dry, and treat all bullet and block connectors in and around the headlamp and under the tank.

kennyle · « **Reply #2 on:** May 04, 2016, 11:31:59 AM »

Quote from: flybox1 on May 04, 2016, 10:40:18 AM

What bike?

points wet?
wiring to coils wet?
check, clean, dry, and treat all bullet and block connectors in and around the headlamp and under the tank.

Sorry, its a 1974 CB550.

Appreciate you telling me where to start looking. I had no idea what ignition points were until I googled and researched. It stopped raining today so hopefully I can check all the wires and hopefully the bike works so I don't have to get it towed home.

754 · « **Reply #3 on:** May 04, 2016, 11:35:36 AM »

Take point cover off, look for condensation.. may fire up or need points cleaned.

flybox1 · « **Reply #4 on:** May 04, 2016, 12:31:30 PM »

Quote from: kennyle on May 04, 2016, 11:31:59 AM

Sorry, its a 1974 CB550.

Appreciate you telling me where to start looking. I had no idea what ignition points were until I googled and researched. It stopped raining today so hopefully I can check all the wires and hopefully the bike works so I don't have to get it towed home.

Welcome to the forum. Im just north of Seattle.
post technical questions about your bike in this section.

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/board,2.0.html

You'll get more/faster responses. Be sure to include details about, and photos of what you're working on.
It helps us help you

Gene · « **Reply #5 on:** May 04, 2016, 12:45:33 PM »

It's often points - you will learn to know them well.

strynboen · « **Reply #6 on:** May 04, 2016, 01:24:08 PM »

some types after marked coils, can not take vater..or vauper..it all shorts up sparking jumping all over ..after to have dryed up..you can start and ride on..old vires and caps can also shorts up..i have been strandet in rain a fet times on my 550..10 minuts drying..and it vas running ..a hot engine can better take the wet clime..so let the engine heat good up before run aut in the wet.
.pods is not vaterteight

Gene · « **Reply #7 on:** May 04, 2016, 01:50:54 PM »

Oh yeah - jeez - are you running pods? If so, there's your issue.

Steve F · « **Reply #8 on:** May 04, 2016, 06:29:03 PM »

Both of my 750's would never run in the rain, and one had the Dyna ignition and DYNA coils too, so points were not the problem, it was the plug wires and the really high voltage stuff that wouldn't tolerate water. The bike with the points and OEM coils was even worse.
Hated the sight of dark clouds.

Trevor from Warragul · « **Reply #9 on:** May 04, 2016, 11:53:10 PM »

My 350/4 won't start after I wash it unless I use the air compressor to blow it dry!

scrapvalue · « **Reply #10 on:** May 05, 2016, 06:05:02 AM »

If it isn't the points, it is most likely water getting in the spark plug area and causing the short. If the spark plugs and caps are wet the spark is just grounding out.
Pods have nothing to do with it.

Gene · « **Reply #11 on:** May 05, 2016, 12:43:11 PM »

Quote from: scrapvalue on May 05, 2016, 06:05:02 AM

If it isn't the points, it is most likely water getting in the spark plug area and causing the short. If the spark plugs and caps are wet the spark is just grounding out.
Pods have nothing to do with it.

I was thinking of a post by Alacrity - he runs pods and has mentioned that was his problem in the rain - since they are not water-tight.

flybox1 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 05, 2016, 01:09:19 PM »

I see side covers in the OP's picture.
Might be difficult for water to gain access to the pods, BICBW.
My vote is still for damp points. Moisture around the plug area is a close second.

scrapvalue · « **Reply #13 on:** May 05, 2016, 01:30:49 PM »

I run pods on my CB750 rat rod and have ridden in more rain then I care to admit.
Have never had a problem with them. Jetting them is somewhat of a chore, but can be done with some patience and understanding.
The spark plugs are on the front of the motor. Water coming of the front wheel can get it the spark plug chambers and short out the plugs.
Is your front fender stock or bobbed?

kennyle · « **Reply #14 on:** May 05, 2016, 04:18:51 PM »

Quote from: 754 on May 04, 2016, 11:35:36 AM

Take point cover off, look for condensation.. may fire up or need points cleaned.

Quote from: strynboen on May 04, 2016, 01:24:08 PM

some types after marked coils, can not take vater..or vauper..it all shorts up sparking jumping all over ..after to have dryed up..you can start and ride on..old vires and caps can also shorts up..i have been strandet in rain a fet times on my 550..10 minuts drying..and it vas running ..a hot engine can better take the wet clime..so let the engine heat good up before run aut in the wet.
.pods is not vaterteight

Quote from: Gene on May 04, 2016, 01:50:54 PM

Oh yeah - jeez - are you running pods? If so, there's your issue.

Quote from: scrapvalue on May 05, 2016, 06:05:02 AM

If it isn't the points, it is most likely water getting in the spark plug area and causing the short. If the spark plugs and caps are wet the spark is just grounding out.
Pods have nothing to do with it.

Thanks for all the response guys.

I am not running pods, the bike is all stock except for the exhaust. Took it to the shop about a month ago and got the carbs cleaned. They did told me I should have it rejetted cause it was running rich (I did hear pops a lot from the exhaust). The bike starts with the choke fully on but as soon as I take the choke off, it dies. This wasn't a problem before the rain so Im thinking water got into somewhere it wasn't suppose to. I haven't checked the spark plugs yet and will do that today.

I did however looked at the ignition points and there isn't signs of water that I could see. The bike starts so I don't think the problem is with the ignition switch.

I have recorded a video (links down below) and took some pictures of the ignition points to show a better idea of what is going on.

Part 1:

Part 2:

Part 3:

Retro Rocket · « **Reply #15 on:** May 05, 2016, 05:33:00 PM »

Quote from: kennyle on May 05, 2016, 04:18:51 PM

Thanks for all the response guys.

I am not running pods, the bike is all stock except for the exhaust. Took it to the shop about a month ago and got the carbs cleaned. They did told me I should have it rejetted cause it was running rich (I did hear pops a lot from the exhaust). The bike starts with the choke fully on but as soon as I take the choke off, it dies. This wasn't a problem before the rain so Im thinking water got into somewhere it wasn't suppose to. I haven't checked the spark plugs yet and will do that today.

I did however looked at the ignition points and there isn't signs of water that I could see. The bike starts so I don't think the problem is with the ignition switch.

I have recorded a video (links down below) and took some pictures of the ignition points to show a better idea of what is going on.

Part 1:
Part 2:
Part 3:

Sounds like your carbs need another clean, popping is usually a sign of a lean condition. How clean is your tank..?

evanphi · « **Reply #16 on:** May 05, 2016, 06:50:20 PM »

DO you have a gasket on the points cover? water could be getting in.

I found out my gasket had a kink in it the last time I washed it. I had to open it up and let my points dry out before the bike would start.

New gasket and some silicone grease has solved that.

Mantree · « **Reply #17 on:** May 05, 2016, 06:51:19 PM »

Quote from: scrapvalue on May 05, 2016, 06:05:02 AM

If it isn't the points, it is most likely water getting in the spark plug area and causing the short. If the spark plugs and caps are wet the spark is just grounding out.
Pods have nothing to do with it.

My 750 with pods runs really rich in the rain

Sent from my ME302KL using Tapatalk

mystic_1 · « **Reply #18 on:** May 05, 2016, 07:01:23 PM »

The sudden onset of the problem does make it feel like an ignition problem to me.

A weak or intermittent spark could cause a lot of this I think.

Do you have a timing light? Hooking one up to each spark lead in turn will let you observe if that plug is firing evenly, or intermittently, or not at all.

It might be worthwhile to take a blow dryer and warm up the points area, and also inside the headlight bucket, and the wiring under the left side cover, to try to drive off any water.

While you're poking around in the wiring, take one of the bullet connectors apart and look at the ends, are they bright brass colored, or grungy looking? If the connectors are corroded then that can cause all sorts of problems. Clean them up with a scotchbrite pad if necessary.

Try running the bike at night and see if you can spot any arcing from the plug wires or down at the plugs themselves.

I've ridden in the rain with pods, sometimes in pretty heavy downpours, and while the bike sometime ran less well, it never outright died on me.

Sudden shutdowns like that do tend to be electrical, unless they're mechanical, but if you'd thrown a rod you'd have noticed this by now

mystic_1

754 · « **Reply #19 on:** May 05, 2016, 07:11:27 PM »

Exhaust leaks can cause popping on decelleration.
So are you saying you went back and tried and it fired right up ?

flybox1 · « **Reply #20 on:** May 06, 2016, 06:57:43 AM »

Hopefully they didnt charge you a bunch at this shop, because i'd bet they spent a can of spray carb cleaner and about 15 minutes spraying it 'clean'.
These carbs need a bit more than that. Time for you to learn

It isnt as hard as you think. We'll help.

kennyle · « **Reply #21 on:** May 07, 2016, 04:08:52 PM »

Quote from: evanphi on May 05, 2016, 06:50:20 PM

DO you have a gasket on the points cover? water could be getting in.

I found out my gasket had a kink in it the last time I washed it. I had to open it up and let my points dry out before the bike would start.

New gasket and some silicone grease has solved that.

Quote from: mystic_1 on May 05, 2016, 07:01:23 PM

The sudden onset of the problem does make it feel like an ignition problem to me.

A weak or intermittent spark could cause a lot of this I think.

Do you have a timing light? Hooking one up to each spark lead in turn will let you observe if that plug is firing evenly, or intermittently, or not at all.

It might be worthwhile to take a blow dryer and warm up the points area, and also inside the headlight bucket, and the wiring under the left side cover, to try to drive off any water.

While you're poking around in the wiring, take one of the bullet connectors apart and look at the ends, are they bright brass colored, or grungy looking? If the connectors are corroded then that can cause all sorts of problems. Clean them up with a scotchbrite pad if necessary.

Try running the bike at night and see if you can spot any arcing from the plug wires or down at the plugs themselves.

I've ridden in the rain with pods, sometimes in pretty heavy downpours, and while the bike sometime ran less well, it never outright died on me.

Sudden shutdowns like that do tend to be electrical, unless they're mechanical, but if you'd thrown a rod you'd have noticed this by now

mystic_1

Quote from: 754 on May 05, 2016, 07:11:27 PM

Exhaust leaks can cause popping on decelleration.
So are you saying you went back and tried and it fired right up ?

Quote from: flybox1 on May 06, 2016, 06:57:43 AM

Hopefully they didnt charge you a bunch at this shop, because i'd bet they spent a can of spray carb cleaner and about 15 minutes spraying it 'clean'.
These carbs need a bit more than that. Time for you to learn
It isnt as hard as you think. We'll help.

Yes, the next day after the rain (which is when my bike just suddenly died) I tried starting the bike and it started fine with the choke on but then after 2 minutes it felt like the throttle was flooding the engine and it would slowly die. If I put the choke to the off position, it would die instantly. I don't know what the water did or where it went. Its been in the 85's degrees Fahrenheit so there shouldnt be any water left.

scrapvalue · « **Reply #22 on:** May 07, 2016, 04:16:07 PM »

Drain your float bowls and put some gas treatment in the tank.
But when you drain the bowls, try to catch the gas in a clear glass container.
Probably be surprised on how much water is in there.
The high humidity on the day it was raining may have been the straw that broke the camels back, so to speak.

Retro Rocket · « **Reply #23 on:** May 07, 2016, 04:51:04 PM »

And check the breather in the tank cap....

evanphi · « **Reply #24 on:** May 08, 2016, 04:49:29 AM »

You should also take the points cover off to really let it dry out. My bike sat for two days after washing it and that was when it wouldn't start. I took the points cover off and set up some halogen lights pointing to it to dry it out.

News:

Author Topic: Died in the rain (Read 2988 times)

scrapvalue

scrapvalue

scrapvalue