Topic: my 79 cb650z

[crusierlover]

I will post here.Thought this was mostly for 750.I am trying to get sparkplugs out without breaking one off.They have not been removed for 30 years.I have 2 out.Number 3 i broke the end of the tach cable housing trying to get to it.It is frozen bad.pb blaster,waited 2 days.Still stuck.

[crusierlover]

I have 2 of the sparkplugs out.Of course #1 and#4.With the thinwalled motorcycle socket the others still wont budge.More Pb blaster,more waiting.I am afraid of snapping one off.The bike is dirty,sat in garage 12 years.Some might say patina.I say no, dirt.Once i get the plugs out a tbsp of oil down each hole,turn the motor over gently with 24 mm wrench.Hopefully it will turn over.if so, change oil,put in a battery,a little gas, hit button and hope.I have 3 engines.This is a complete bike, the other 2 are rollers.One with working brakes.The front caliper was so stuck I couldn't even roll the bike.I took the bolts loose,used a block of wood and a hammer, caliper came off, now the bike easily rolls.My plan is to go bone stock.Even leaving that ridiculous high in the sky sissybar.This is going to take me several months, i work fulltime night shift.I will post as I make progress.I filled the rusty tank with vinegar.Did not rinse it out.Now i think it is more rusty.Probably I will use por15.I am not sure how much of that to use.Also, pour it in, rotate the tank around several times and wait? i did not see instructions on their website.l am looking forward to this.The 80 model and remaining 79 roller will be combined into some sort of barebones barhopper exile motorcycle style.Only its a 4 cylinder.

[rb550four]

  Gas tank flash rust is always an issue. Right after the water rinse dry it as quickly as possible. Some guys use a hairdryer, some guys blow it out with air  then coat it with a light spray of penetrating type oil or  marvel mystery oil.
  Just asking...you did take the petcock off while vinagering the tank?
I like to heat stuck things,nuts, bolts ,spark plugs....not cherry red but enough to know it's hot, then try a wrench while it's cooling. Doesn't work ,do it again . still didn't work shoot on more pb .do it again tomorrow Don't break it off , it'll come sooner or later.
  POR15. comes in a quart. Take the petcock out and plug /tape it. Pour in a little at a time and roll the tank around and upside down . Don't put in too much, or get it on hands clothes or anything else, it don't come off when it's dry.ever. It takes about two or three days for the tank to be dry after you do it.
  I like stock stuff too but , a big ugly sissy bar isn't stock...and it's ugly.
The only stock item on any 650 that screams"Change Me" are the handlebars. All 650 bars are ...well they suck. Try them , see?
  Use a fresh battery, no 1/2 charged or jumping it off the car battery. Cdi s are under the seat , there are 2 of them. look at the side that isn't aluminum. If that side looks drippy or a bit melted on either 1 get a new one or get one of the other bike . If they are both burned , don't try to start it , it won't .
  Check for critters in the airbox so 's not to suck the nest and crap into the motor.
Change oil and filter. Thought the plugs were a PITA wait til you get to the oilfilter plug, drain the oil first.I heat the nut only and not cherry turn as it's cooling once it's free take it out ,use new o rings provided with filter.
  Download or get a shop manual.
 And have fun with it.
 

[crusierlover]

Thanks RB.yay, I got the plugs out.#3 broke off, but for some reason that was good.Then the wrench I had got on it and got it out completely.Yes,I found a dirtdobber nest under the seat.The airfilter box might have something too.There is one little piece of white insulator in #3 hole.Tomorrow a piece of gum on a stick(fireplace match) and i should be able to get it out.Thanks for headsup on cdi.I am soooo glad I have lots of extra parts.

No, I did not remove the petcock.I did not have the vinegar in there long. I know it can eat metal.The underside of the gas cap was orange with rust.I put it in a bowl of vinegar in the kitchen sink.After only 20 minutes the rust could be wiped off.That stuff is toxic.And we eat it.

yep, I have 2 more sets of handlebars.The third 79 roller I have has some cool trooper style bars i will use.I rebuilt a 1980 gs 1000.Buckhorn handlebars, it was the L model.They were on there less than a day.I want stock, but i also want to ride.So the ugly sissybar goes and so does the terrible handlebars.I will be looking for a throttle sleeve for my 80 roller after this.But they seem easy to find.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Nice persistence with the spark plugs.

All great pointers from RB.

Watching with interest. 

And 86 that sissy bar.

[crusierlover]

ha ha.Yes, the sissybar is going today.I know a guy named jacob.Owns j and l rodwerks here in Denton.Worldclass car restorer,customizer,hotrodder.people from all over the USA send their cars to him.He doesnt even an ad in the yellow pages anymore.I bet his price is too high.But I might get him to paint the bike the original colors ,striping as it was in 79. His shop is on woodrow in Denton.I do not know if he ever made a website.

[crusierlover]

$89 plus shipping.Remember you saw it here first folks.if too many people respond I may have a drawing.If not, then 89 cents plus shipping.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

THAT is one "compelling" sissy bar.

[crusierlover]

yeah, it kinda says get on the bike #$%*.

[crusierlover]

I paid $175 for my bike.Selling the sissybar would help recoup some of that.My signature says $390 79650z.That's what my black book of motorcycle values says it is worth.

[Bankerdanny]

The rack and sissy bar on my 550 came in handy during Relay Rally #1. I pulled the sissy bar for day-to-day riding, but it was a handy strap down point for touring.

[kslrr]

Would you like to be added to the cb650 owners list?

[crusierlover]

I am on the 650 sohc forum also.If there is an owners list besides that you are talking about then yessir, put me on it.

[rb550four]

The 650 owners registry http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,32307.0.html
The 650 forum is another good forum to be on, allot of 650 specific information , but it hasn't been terribly active recently.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

The 650 owners registry http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,32307.0.html
The 650 forum is another good forum to be on, allot of 650 specific information , but it hasn't been terribly active recently.

The 650 forum has not been very active over the last year.  SOHC4 was more responsive to posts.

[crusierlover]

The 650 owners registry http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,32307.0.html
The 650 forum is another good forum to be on, allot of 650 specific information , but it hasn't been terribly active recently.

The 650 forum has not been very active over the last year.  SOHC4 was more responsive to posts.

I have found that to be true.if you mean the sohc650 forum.Some f the threads are 6 years old.I pm'd a guy with a 2 year old one and he did respond.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

tomwitt is a member on both forums and frequently parts out 650s if you need parts.

[crusierlover]

tomwitt is a member on both forums and frequently parts out 650s if you need parts.

very good to know.Thanks.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

tomwitt is a member on both forums and frequently parts out 650s if you need parts.

very good to know.Thanks.

His prices are incredibly fair, too.

[crusierlover]

brake lever wont budge.Picture shows why probably.no fluid,broke reservoir.Clutch lever wont movemdont know why.Stuck plates maybe.Throttle wont turn,dont know why.I changed the oil and filter.Got the  friggin seat lock off.I put tbsp oil down plug holes.Wednesday new plugs, a battery, check for blown fuses, then hit starter button and hope.I bought a caliper rebuild kit, have an unbroken reservoir off ebay on the way.I hope this engine is good.

[rb550four]

Carbs are varnished tight would be my guess on the throttle story...you're gonna hafta clean 'em.
Cables may be wasted or in need of lube  and /or just stuck in frozen carbs...Motion Pros cables are reasonable.
Before you put the plugs in, if the chain is still on, you could bump it in a tall gear, alittle, too be sure she'll turn freely. If it does and you haven't bent a stuck valve go for it see if she'll pop. Remember it'll only run for a moment ,you have no carbs.
Good luck.

[crusierlover]

Carbs are varnished tight would be my guess on the throttle story...you're gonna hafta clean 'em.
Cables may be wasted or in need of lube  and /or just stuck in frozen carbs...Motion Pros cables are reasonable.
Before you put the plugs in, if the chain is still on, you could bump it in a tall gear, alittle, too be sure she'll turn freely. If it does and you haven't bent a stuck valve go for it see if she'll pop. Remember it'll only run for a moment ,you have no carbs.
Good luck.

I have the luxury of another bank of 79 carbs in a basket.I will clean them properly then put them on this bike.Thanks for the information.probably the throttle cant move the carb linkage,the butterflies dont move etc due to being totally fubar like you said.I see no reason to spend $100 on carb kits.The jets are better than any replacement ones.Unless a float bowl gasket needs replaced, a float itself or its perch is broken no reason to split a rack.But I have 8 to choose from.This bike is going to be quite a resurrection.I have a gallon of berrymans, an air compressor,just dread it.But I have no choice.

[crusierlover]

well,my other 2 motors turn over freely when a socket is applied to the 24 mm crank bolt.Not so on the motor in the bike.figgers.I had put new oil in it,new filter, was hoping it would turn over.Perhaps the pistons are seized, or the cam chain, or tensioner, or transmission, or clutch.Who knows.The bike was in neutral or else it wouldnt roll so easily in my driveway.Up on the lift, both wheels off the ground, the back tire can be turned.So I am thinking seized piston.I was about to just start pulling the motor out.But my son who is a deisel mechanic said take the top of the motor off, see if its seized.Once I take the valve cover off, perhaps i ca see if the cam chain is bound up or the tensioner has broke or something.On a suzuki motor once the motor wouldnt turn over more than half a revolution.After taking the head off for the umpteenth time i found the tensioner bottom is supposed to sit in a cup area at the bottom of the crank.It had jumped out of the cup when i was reassembling the engine.Once i got that corrected it started and ran great.But I had bought that as a running bike.This bike aint ran nowhere but sat in one spot for 12years.If the motor is unsalvageable I will use one of the other 2 motors.And while they are out I will do many good things so I wont have to do them again.I am anxious to get all the years of caked on dirt and crud off all the bikes parts,especially the motor.All my electrical connections under the seat look like they were buried in a tomb for centuries.I will take each loose,clean it, and grease it.perhaps preventing future headaches.I have as yet not located the solenoid.I know the positive battery cable connects to it.But I have not been able to do much.The battery is on the right, so the solenoid has to be also.I am an impatient person.I want to hurry and get this done.But lack of time and money will slow me down.I do think the bike will look good once I get done.I have done automotive work much more difficult due to the sheer size and weight of a car motor and transmission.But the upside is the motors and transmissions generally have lots of room to slide into.It appears darn near impossible to get the carbs mounted properly with airbox attached.

[rb550four]

Okay, key word patience. You rush it, you get to do it twice. Take your time, look at the pics in the manual the first time through,then, open it up an read it.
  Yes, the carbs on all sohc 4 s are a PITA to get in and out of the stock box, that is the real reason guys go for pods...which, in itself will be a bigger PITA than taking your time and carefully using the stock set up.
   Your rings are probably rusted to the cylinder walls, that's common ( a slipped timing chain would be uncommon).
Top end and valve off, you'll be going with new rings, a nice hone, and new gaskets.While  you are there, changing the valve seals, you might as well check the valve movement to ensure they are not stuck too.
  While you have the pistons out, switch through all the gears to be sure that the shifting dog aren't rusted tight. you'll hate to do the top end then realize that with just a little extra effort you could have had the transmission working too ( ASK ME HOW I KNOW) yeah there's gears and stuff to  look at, to check condition  of while you have the cases split too but hey, if your going that far , go all the way and make it right, you already have the gaskets anyways ( while you're there change out the shifter rod seal and any other one that looks suspect). It'll make your next two engines that much easier once you've done one.The thing about a machine that has been in storage is that it wants to oxidize in all the areas that don't sit in oil,so after 10 or 20 years of oxidation things will be stuck . The entire engine and drive should have a thorough inspection to be sure all parts are good , clean, lubricated and in working order before it is ready to go back to work, after all your butt will be on it, kinda makes it worth doing .
  Yeah, maybe you could get one of the others to run...I never trust any engine with unknown history, could be a bigger can of worms, you just don't know till you open them up.

[crusierlover]

super good input rb.I do intend removing the original motor,so much easier to clean and work on.If all I needed was a head gasket I wouldnt.I bet you are right about oxidation,rings,etc.I tried doctoring a 327 one time.Once I bit the bullet and rebuilt with rings,rod bearings, mains,carb clean it ran great.Same principle here.I am going to get my harley back today from my son.It is 85,not a cloud in the sky.I quite possibly will not work on the honda today.

[crusierlover]

I have gotten this far.I liked to never have gotten all those 8 mm bolts out.They have been 37 years.I bought a whole set of those sockets that mold to the rounded or stripped nut.Only way some of them would have ever come out.Anyhow, the part of the motor that is visible looks great.Only 17,000 miles, but zero since 2004.The head bolt rubber cover things and the head cover gaskets look great.As seen in the photos the bike is up on the lift, both wheels off the ground.The front and rear brakes are disconnected, the bike when on the ground must be in neutral it rolls very easily.So back on the lift, the rear wheel turns easily.So before i go any further, what do you think keeps the motor from turning over.I put the 24mm socket on the crank, right side engine cover, it will not budge.On my 2 parts bikes this turns them over easily.If it is stuck rings, do I just take off the head,then what? Should I drain the oil and pull off the left side engine cover and see if the clutch is somehow jammed up? I want to stick with thos original motor if possible, but i do have other motors that are not locked up,plus i do not want to spend a thousand bucks fixing this motor when the whole bike cost me $175 so far .But I do not want to do anyhting halfassed mechanically.The brakes and motor have to be a number 1.I ride a harley, so I know what its like to have a day ruined by a break down.Plus this bike is about the dirtiest neglected thing I have seen.It deserves either a glorius resurrection or a proper burial.Any input appreciated.I just included a pic of my seat, got off ebay.the z seats are hard to find.And I didnt have one till now.Seems trivial, but try riding without one.

[crusierlover]

took off the right exhausts.My lord, total rust out.Not useable.i am takingboth sides off in prep for head removal.plus if I pull this engine out to rebuild or replace i have to do that anyway.But there is no way any exhaust could have gotten through that muffler.Totally rusted out.probably the inside of the motor will be the same.