Topic: RE: Tytronic Electric ignition $75 from China

[Terry in Australia]

I try to avoid many Chinese products if I can but it’s not really practical a lot of the time.

Yep, one thing I draw the line at is the odd grocery item that seems to sneak into my local supermarket, there’s no way on God’s earth I’m buying anything grown in the most polluted, unregulated country in the world.

[PeWe]

I have read this thread from the very beginning, the link to Honda twins too. Plus all good comments about ignitions in general.

- Is it verified that this Tytronic ignition is a copy of the first version of Charlies Place ignition?

- The Charlies Place ignition look really good but cost some. With shipping + customs will make it +50% more expensive than Dyna-S I can buy locally here, 5 minutes ride away.

The stories about failing Dyna-S might have been with 3 ohm coils and/or the earlier version only?

About the simple advancer unit fix by cutting the springs making them apply force on advancer direct without a few degrees free play advancing the ignition:
Hondaman's write up for many years ago about this really helped me getting it right from idle to full.  Also to avoid the "slots in plate are not long enough"
(Thanks Hondaman).

My advancer had really sloppy springs so the bike ran like crap. CX-7 cam back then.
Good idle and smooth starts is very important, only get it right from 2500-2700 rpm is not an alternative for me.

A hotter cam also  does not like too early advance.

I guess that people installed Dyna 2000 to get it right all the way skipping the advancer.

Good info here  about various ignitions, not only Tytronic.

The question still is:
- Which ignition should you use if going for a long touring trip on remote roads?
Lets say 3600km (2000miles) away + same back.
Should points be in the luggage as a plan B if using electronic ignition?

[rotortiller]

Is it verified that this Tytronic ignition is a copy of the first version of Charlies Place ignition?

Why even throw that out there when you have absolutely no proof? The rotor looks different with two magnets with reverse polarization, so functionally it is what it is. It's like the guy that suggests it is power hungry. That is how politicians work not vintage maintainers. I would tear the guts open to let you see what is inside but the rumours would continue lol. If it was a copy it would show how greedy some USA merchants can be (245 bones Charlie)) and how some are not (niche cycle is local @ 145 bones). It's a global economy and Asians have just as much right to make a living as the rest of us

To answer your question electronic systems have proven themselves more reliable than points, that is why every modern bike has them.
If you need spare ignition to put your mind at ease just buy two electronic ignitions.

You still have one set of coils, one alternator, one regulator, one battery, one chain etc so you better make a bigger spares list. What if a points spring breaks, the rubbing block comes apart or a contact fails, same old song but a different verse.

[Gurp]

I have read this thread from the very beginning, the link to Honda twins too. Plus all good comments about ignitions in general.

- Is it verified that this Tytronic ignition is a copy of the first version of Charlies Place ignition?

- The Charlies Place ignition look really good but cost some. With shipping + customs will make it +50% more expensive than Dyna-S I can buy locally here, 5 minutes ride away.

The stories about failing Dyna-S might have been with 3 ohm coils and/or the earlier version only?

About the simple advancer unit fix by cutting the springs making them apply force on advancer direct without a few degrees free play advancing the ignition:
Hondaman's write up for many years ago about this really helped me getting it right from idle to full.  Also to avoid the "slots in plate are not long enough"
(Thanks Hondaman).

My advancer had really sloppy springs so the bike ran like crap. CX-7 cam back then.
Good idle and smooth starts is very important, only get it right from 2500-2700 rpm is not an alternative for me.

A hotter cam also  does not like too early advance.

I guess that people installed Dyna 2000 to get it right all the way skipping the advancer.

Good info here  about various ignitions, not only Tytronic.

The question still is:
- Which ignition should you use if going for a long touring trip on remote roads?
Lets say 3600km (2000miles) away + same back.
Should points be in the luggage as a plan B if using electronic ignition?

Hands down I would use a Hondaman if I was gonna be out away from help. If it fails just unhook it.
I'd still carry a extra set of points and condensers though

[Deltarider]

Hands down I would use a Hondaman if I was gonna be out away from help. If it fails just unhook it.
[...]

That's why I decided to build my own transitorized ignition decades ago. This after my Peugeot 504 GL had succesfully crossed the Sahara desert with one. In those years I rode my bike through all of Europe, from the North (Norway) to the Peloponnessos (Greece) and I could not allow myself to be fully dependent on some aftermarket product. Mine never failed. The second pic shows the original Velleman K2543 I had under the hood of my Peugeot, the first pic is my copycat (X2 ofcourse). Instead of that exaggerated cooling fin, I've used the aluminum casing, both bottom and lid to cool the power transistors.
My bike has almost done 140.000 kms now and I have never experienced sloppy springs. I must have done something wrong, I guess . Also a used spare advancer that I bought second hand, doesn't show sloppiness.
Frankly I never quite understood this coil cutting thing, apart from possibly, possibly curing a somewhat wandering idle. I trust Honda choose the right advance for my model and any CB500/550s advancer will hit its stops already @ 2500 rpm anyway, which is within a fraction of a second after you open the throttle. The way I ride my bike, the TEC is fully avanced 99% of the time. So... what's the deal?

[PeWe]

Rotortiller, you have not read this thread from the very beginning?
If so you might have same QUESTION as I have.

Earlier in this thread post #3 (2016, this was up as a question. This link added.
http://www.hondatwins.net/foru...n/44581-tytronic-ignition.html

[PeWe]

Deltarider, your advancer springs still OK?
My advancer, TEC 300 had bad springs, really stretched. Originally on my CB750 K6.

Full advance at around 1500 rpm or just a little after despite plate at max retard position, (clockwise). I used Pamco ignition then.

Bike had then done a little over 97000 km.

[rotortiller]

Maybe Tytronic version-3 in the green box is your cup of tea PeWe? No more stinking stretched springs or mechanical advance cleaning etc. Might just order a green box ignition for a dear buddy of mine or keep it and give him my older post 2017 version lol.     From the web and merchant:

Electronic ignition using a single magnet have the same duty cycle(95%) of  most single magnet e-ignition on the market. The working current of the e-ignition is 2-3 times of the original bike, which causes the e-igniton and ignition coil to heat seriously and shortens the life of the e-ignition and ignition coil. At the same time, the long-term high current operation also shortens the battery life. The e-ignition was completely discontinued in December 2017.

 

Black Box(upgrade)

In May 2017, Tytronic first designed a dual magnet electronic ignition (red and black magnets), which achieved the same duty cycle as the original bike, completely solving the problem existing in the primary product.this is what we are selling in the market.

 

Upgrade 2.0(red box)

In upgrade version, timing LED light and current protection circuit are added to make installation more convenient for users. At the same time, current protection circuit can effectively solve the problem of easy damage to e-ignition caused by wiring error, unstable voltage of charging system, ignition coil damage, etc. The product starts on sale in January 2018.

 

Upgrade 3.0(green box)

The new e-ignition designed and produced by Tytronic in March 2021 uses computer program to control the advance of the e-ignition, replacing the mechanical advance system of the original bike and solving all the problems caused by the wear of the mechanical advance system. It is the most ideal e-ignition at present

[Terry in Australia]

When I built my CB750K0 I installed a Kokusan electronic ignition, and Dyna 3 Ohm coils, and after well over 3000 miles in the last 20 months, it’s proved faultless. I really think the days of carrying a spare set of points are well and truly gone.

[Gurp]

Reading this thread I'm thinking about trying one of these out.

[HondaMan]

Reading this thread makes me wonder how EMP-proof the Tytronics is now?

Mine is...its internal impedance is so low that even if it is ON at the blast, it won't be hurt. Digital circuitry can't make that claim: mine is all analog, and very low impedance. The US power grid is trying to figure out ways to do that with thier grid controllers, now...

[grcamna2]

subscribed

[seanbarney41]

When I built my CB750K0 I installed a Kokusan electronic ignition, and Dyna 3 Ohm coils, and after well over 3000 miles in the last 20 months, it’s proved faultless. I really think the days of carrying a spare set of points are well and truly gone.

your right!  No need to carry an extra points plate on my orange f.  The only points plate it needs is running on the bike and has been perfectly for 14,000 miles.

[Terry in Australia]

When I built my CB750K0 I installed a Kokusan electronic ignition, and Dyna 3 Ohm coils, and after well over 3000 miles in the last 20 months, it’s proved faultless. I really think the days of carrying a spare set of points are well and truly gone.

your right!  No need to carry an extra points plate on my orange f.  The only points plate it needs is running on the bike and has been perfectly for 14,000 miles.

Wow! You’ve done 14000 miles on your bike Sean? Well done!

[seanbarney41]

When I built my CB750K0 I installed a Kokusan electronic ignition, and Dyna 3 Ohm coils, and after well over 3000 miles in the last 20 months, it’s proved faultless. I really think the days of carrying a spare set of points are well and truly gone.

your right!  No need to carry an extra points plate on my orange f.  The only points plate it needs is running on the bike and has been perfectly for 14,000 miles.

Wow! You’ve done 14000 miles on your bike Sean? Well done!

yes?      that is the number, roughly.  Iirc, bike had 26k on the odo. when I bought it 6 odd years ago.  Dwell and timing was adjusted then.  Odo. just turned 40k recently.  40-26=14?  I can recall checking dwell and timing 2, at most 3 times since.  So not really feeling the terrible burden of  meticulously maintaining this cumbersome and unreliable stone age technology.

[ekpent]

When I built my CB750K0 I installed a Kokusan electronic ignition, and Dyna 3 Ohm coils, and after well over 3000 miles in the last 20 months, it’s proved faultless. I really think the days of carrying a spare set of points are well and truly gone.

your right!  No need to carry an extra points plate on my orange f.  The only points plate it needs is running on the bike and has been perfectly for 14,000 miles.

Wow! You’ve done 14000 miles on your bike Sean? Well done!

A dollar or maybe a Ginger Beer Terry says that he has had his 22 rides in the books for some time now and still growing. He rides a lot on his different bikes, much more then thy. 

[Terry in Australia]

Are you talking about me or you Eric? I’ve only done around 4000 miles this year, including my 1300 mile weekend in April on the ill-fated BMW.

[seanbarney41]

My rides are unfortunately not "in the books", Eric.  I got plenty of energy to go for a ride.  Very little for typing on computers and fiddling around trying to get pictures to post.  But thankfully, there are people here, like Terry, who can tell a good story and share a picture or two with us on the internet.

[PeWe]

Good that we have an adventurous riding story making teller (Terry) during the dark and cold period of our lives living in the northern hemispere.

A window into our future adventures on our bikes.

He has various kinds if igntions too that we can see as running tests.
- Maybe time for a Tectronic on one of the bikes?

[rotortiller]

Another years report since my 2017 install and still no issues so far. Takes a licking and keeps on ticking. Naturally the timing is still spot on since there are no points to wear. I am very happy with longevity and weather proofing of this thing.
Much better lifespan than the points amplifier I had before or the routine OEM setup standard maintenance intervals. Another reliable year of service.

[HondaMan]

...I last set the points timing on my 750 in 2013 after I rebuilt the engine...last time before that was in 2006 (up to 2013 event) when I installed the Transistor Ignition...
Between these 2 events is about 18k miles, with no points adjustments needed.

While modern solid-state ignitions, with almost 50 years of experience behind them, are pretty reliable, they are also the only components I have had to replace in my cars' engines (besides engine belts). I've kept spares of those modules in my cars since the 1970s, and have always had need for them at some point. Having to replace the electronics BEFORE the engines needed to be rebuilt says something (not pretty) about most electronic ignitions in general. Speaking as a lifelong Electronics Engineer, it has always baffled me that the systems I've designed (not just for vehicles) since the 1970s have never failed in use, being scrapped still alive for newer-technology systems, in some instances. It seems to me that the only thing that limits the life of modern electronic designs is the will to use the correct parts: I guess that's why the Voyager, built in the 1970s, still ran well until it could no longer be reached for a conversation 3 years ago?

[Terry in Australia]

Good that we have an adventurous riding story making teller (Terry) during the dark and cold period of our lives living in the northern hemispere.

A window into our future adventures on our bikes.

He has various kinds if igntions too that we can see as running tests.
- Maybe time for a Tectronic on one of the bikes?

Have you seen the Ebay Dyna knockoffs mate? The Kokusan electronic ignition that I installed in my K0 apparently died a few weeks ago, it worked magnificently until it didn’t but I should have realised because Kokusan made the electrical components for Kawasaki Z1’s, which are notoriously bad. (I installed a CB750 starter motor in my Z1-B)

I saw a US seller on Ebay selling what looks like an exact copy of a Dyna S for under $50 USD, so I’ve bought a couple to see if they’re any good. The Kokusan got me home OK, unlike the OEM ignition on my K2 when a condenser died and I had to ride it on 2 cylinders, at walking pace, for around 10 miles. I thought about buying a new OEM ignition points plate assembly for the K0 when I built it from a pile of parts I’d collected over the years, but it was more expensive than a new electronic ignition.

[HondaMan]

Good that we have an adventurous riding story making teller (Terry) during the dark and cold period of our lives living in the northern hemispere.

A window into our future adventures on our bikes.

He has various kinds if igntions too that we can see as running tests.
- Maybe time for a Tectronic on one of the bikes?

Have you seen the Ebay Dyna knockoffs mate? The Kokusan electronic ignition that I installed in my K0 apparently died a few weeks ago, it worked magnificently until it didn’t but I should have realised because Kokusan made the electrical components for Kawasaki Z1’s, which are notoriously bad. (I installed a CB750 starter motor in my Z1-B)

I saw a US seller on Ebay selling what looks like an exact copy of a Dyna S for under $50 USD, so I’ve bought a couple to see if they’re any good. The Kokusan got me home OK, unlike the OEM ignition on my K2 when a condenser died and I had to ride it on 2 cylinders, at walking pace, for around 10 miles. I thought about buying a new OEM ignition points plate assembly for the K0 when I built it from a pile of parts I’d collected over the years, but it was more expensive than a new electronic ignition.

On your K2: was that condensor on a points plate made after about 2010? That's when Daiichi China started counterfeiting TEC parts. Their stamped "TEC" on the condensor's mounting foot is either not there, or much bigger than on the genuine TEC parts. On the 'real' ones, the "TEC" is tiny and hard to see.

BTW: thanks for the heads-up about the Kawi starter. I received an engine for build that had one in it, so I alerted the owner on its return to him, so he could swap it out. When I did the 'oil-up' testing where I re-prime the oiling system, it turned over quite slowly compared to the Honda starters and made the task tricky.

[PeWe]

####
I saw a US seller on Ebay selling what looks like an exact copy of a Dyna S for under $50 USD, so I’ve bought a couple to see if they’re any good.

Thanks for the hint, Terry.
I found after some searching.
$48US
There are other sellers for slightly more.
I'll regret if not order, if order one, I'll regret that I did not order 2. 
Hopefully same shipping for 2.
Check further for coils ...

Always good with extra spares for active fault tracing

2 units on the way...
$144US with shipping, customs, VAT ....
onlineparts2018

[bryanj]

Only one i can see is for a kawasaki