Author Topic: Gentlemans Express Cb550  (Read 20059 times)

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Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #50 on: July 24, 2016, 09:46:46 AM »
Carbs are stock 500four not sure of the model. Everything is brand new inside and out.
Before I ditch the $300 SD box I'm going to remove the metal top and side pieces that limit the air flow to the bottom.Hopefully this will free up some of the restriction I'm experiencing.

Bwaller: the SD box has Vstacks built in as the intake ports. They are 45mm from the back of the box
And port matched to the carb body. Uni foam is also around the airbox opening. I don't see how this would be any different than pods which are also closed off at the back.
By covering the sides that was my exact logic, decreasing the turbulence into the carb itself.
Regardless she needs more air. And thankyou no offense taking at all. If I have to ditch it that's what I'll do.
Really thank you guys.

Offline bwaller

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #51 on: July 24, 2016, 10:42:25 AM »
I was about to delete my post, been bugging me since I posted. Sorry man, it's not my call how you proceed.

Some of the manufacturers offer proper alloy stacks designed for their carbs and K&N has 4" long pleated filters to clamp over the stacks. My son's FZR400 uses 32mm FCR's like this & they work very well. I had some bellmouths made for my smoothbores and settled on dual sock foam filters. It's the best option I could come up with. Any filter affects laminar flow to a certain extent, but to not use a filter is silly.

For our older beauties we're left to our own devices. 45mm (1.75")from the bellmouth opening, Tintop had a company build him some foam filters over stacks that allowed this amount of space and pulled air straight through. The 500/550's don't offer much space so that is the limiting factor.

Absolutely remove all restriction, and good luck.

Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #52 on: July 24, 2016, 04:39:29 PM »
No Bwaller no worries. Any advice from you is treated like gold. I removed the airbox covers and took here for a rip. Idle is better but she was still falling off and stalling when decelerating down to first. Pulled plugs when I got home and she is still rich.
This is at 98 mains 38 slows and air screws at 1.75 turns out. She did seem to run smoother though.
What do you guys think? Go to Uni pods? Could any of this have to do with a brand new built engine? Rings not seated yet? Or she just wants more air?

Offline calj737

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #53 on: July 24, 2016, 05:26:10 PM »
I fail to believe you're rich if your carbs are clean, especially with the modifications you have made to the motor. It defies logic. I would suspect fuel level is plaguing you, or your carbs are not spotless internally, or your needle clips are in the wrong position.
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'73 500 Build http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132935.0

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Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #54 on: July 24, 2016, 06:17:01 PM »
Cal: These carbs came from Carburator Keith on eBay. They have been stripped,blasted, and re cleared.
Both bowls and top covers are polished and every nut, spring, and bolt re zinced. Inside every part is brand new. Every float, peice of brass, seal etc etc. They have only been run on this motor. Look him up and see for yourself the quality of his work. Bring your wallet too cause this rack of carbs cost me $650.
Hondaman stated that they were the cleanest carbs he had ever seen.

Needle position as stated before is in the 4th position. Which I believe is the stock position for the cb500f carbs. I could be wrong though. Could you advise?

Offline calj737

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #55 on: July 24, 2016, 06:25:53 PM »
Well, if the guy replaced all your internal brass parts, I sure hope they are authentic Keihin brand, else tuning your carbs based on stock information is pointless. And if they were blasted, then there is the real possibility that media might be clogging internal passages. I don't know, but I am telling you based upon the settings you describe and the changes in your motor, there's no reason you are rich with the jetting you have.
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'73 500 Build http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132935.0

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of it's victim may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

Offline Tews19

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #56 on: July 24, 2016, 06:35:38 PM »
What number carbs do you have? 022a or 069..... if your stock main jet is 98, I'm assuming 069.... If so your needle is not at stock height.
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Offline bwaller

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #57 on: July 24, 2016, 06:39:17 PM »
For #$%*s n giggles pull the airbox and run it briefly without to see what happens.

Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #58 on: July 24, 2016, 06:51:09 PM »
022A Tews
did I miss something?

Bwaller: I can try that. What should I expect to see?

Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #59 on: July 24, 2016, 06:53:28 PM »
Looking good Cam, are you going to fit fenders to the bike..? It'll save the wife cleaning the skunk stripe off her back... ;D ;)
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Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #60 on: July 24, 2016, 07:02:45 PM »
Just the front  Retro.
The license plate in hangs from the rear far enough. I hope  ;D

Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #61 on: July 24, 2016, 07:04:44 PM »
Just the front  Retro.
The license plate in hangs from the rear far enough. I hope  ;D

Just me but, I think that bike would look great with the fenders on, to me it looks incomplete...... ;)
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If You can't fix it with a hammer, You've got an electrical problem.

Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #62 on: July 24, 2016, 07:19:56 PM »
speaking of pics.....












for Cb cafe fan


just gotta dial her in.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2016, 07:21:28 PM by Camrector »

Offline sinister902

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #63 on: July 24, 2016, 07:37:33 PM »
I have a favorite pic from that set, but I'm biased by the Tshirt haha

Offline bwaller

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #64 on: July 25, 2016, 01:46:32 PM »
With basically a better than new head, and fresh bore, you'll pull great vacuum so it's not inconceivable to go down on the mainjet.

Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #65 on: July 25, 2016, 02:16:18 PM »
BWaller: so you think my/ our thinking is correct that the SD airbox isn't providing enough air?  Others that have done similar builds always move up in jet size. I'm having to move down even below stock.
Has anyone used a SD box on a over bore ,hotter cam motor?

Offline bwaller

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #66 on: July 25, 2016, 02:27:49 PM »
I'd still pull the airbox first and try it, just to see if it leans it out at those throttle settings that were rich previously. It definitely should. If you have new plugs put those in first.

Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #67 on: July 25, 2016, 03:31:55 PM »
Thanks will do BWaller. I'll report back tomorrow

Offline HondaMan

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #68 on: July 25, 2016, 04:50:19 PM »
My couple cents' worth: I have had terrible luck with the foam filter media in any form on these bikes. They are made for limited-range RPM engines, like chainsaws, lawn mowers, stuff like that. When airflow starts moving quickly thru them, they "suck closed" and begin to choke off the air. In some bikes (like notably BWM and Harley Twins) this works in their favor, as making the low-speed throttle responsive in those critters means leaving out the parts needed for richness at near-nosebleed RPMs - which those engine hate...so in those select environs, the foam works. Not so much in engines with a 10+:1 RPM turndown ratio, like SOHC4 or Katana bikes. Those who may notice the 'successful' applications of foam filters see them in bikes like the Kawi Fours (7500 RPM redlines), without realizing WHY they still work there: those bikes re dead-flat lean mixers above 6500 RPM, to help protect the Kawi warranty. ;)

If you want to REALLY see the foam filters' epic FAIL, try them on a CB450/500 Twin...they not only won't run well, they won't even start when hot, for over-richness during low-speed "filter closure", and no longer need a choke for cold-morning starts. And, they won't rev past 5000 RPM, either...and those engines are 12:1 turndown RPM ratio!   :(
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

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Offline Camrector

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #69 on: July 25, 2016, 04:59:05 PM »
Bwaller: on your wife's 592 what intake are you using?

Offline Stev-o

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #70 on: July 25, 2016, 05:16:31 PM »

 Those who may notice the 'successful' applications of foam filters see them in bikes like the Kawi Fours (7500 RPM redlines)

HM - not sure which Kaw-Four you are referring to, but my Z1 has a 9K redline [has stock airbox]

Good info though.

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Offline seanbarney41

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #71 on: July 25, 2016, 05:33:17 PM »

 Those who may notice the 'successful' applications of foam filters see them in bikes like the Kawi Fours (7500 RPM redlines)

HM - not sure which Kaw-Four you are referring to, but my Z1 has a 9K redline [has stock airbox]

Good info though.


+1, my kz650 redlines at 9k also
If it works good, it looks good...

Offline bwaller

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #72 on: July 25, 2016, 07:08:31 PM »
Cam, not ideal but this is what I use for hers with stock PD's. This a honkin big oval filter. (meant for one GSXR1100 carb  ::))





Mark, not sure I agree that all foam filters suffer what you mention. 75 rwhp @12K rpm  with these dual sock filters over stacks. It would be great to not use a filter at all and I'm sure I could gain a little more but I feel better with something on there.





« Last Edit: July 25, 2016, 07:10:55 PM by bwaller »

Offline Tews19

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #73 on: July 25, 2016, 07:32:01 PM »
Here is how your stock 22 carbs should be.

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Offline Tews19

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Re: Gentlemans Express Cb550
« Reply #74 on: July 25, 2016, 07:34:15 PM »


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1969 Honda CB750... Basket case
1970 Honda CB750 survivor.